Europe aided the CIA in deporting terror suspects

[rory_20_uk]

And before that America was napalming commies in Greece, rigging elections in Italy...

Politicians seem to suffer from amnaesia in that even what they did yesterday is forgotten and all can be horrified at what some other country does.

And that the UK and USA are two of the bigest producers of weaponry in the world doesn't give us much of the moral highground.

[Mithrandir]

Those governments are pathetic.
I couldn't agree more that they're being hyopcrite.

Nothing can justify the abduction and torture of people, or governments who aid in that.

[Lemur]

The denial is quick in coming.

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

Secret CIA jail claims rejected

Washington has criticised a Council of Europe report on alleged US secret prisons inside Europe, saying it was full of allegations, but thin on facts.

Poland and Romania rejected the fresh claims that they hosted the prisons, while the UK, named as a CIA stopover, said the report contained nothing new.

The report was prepared by a Swiss senator for the Council of Europe, the continent's human rights watchdog.

It said 14 European states colluded with the CIA on secret flights.

Under the CIA policy of rendition, prisoners are moved to third countries for interrogation. There have been allegations some were tortured.

The US admits to picking up terrorism suspects but denies sending them to nations to face torture.

The report by Swiss Senator Dick Marty follows a seven-month inquiry.

It began in November amid a political outcry over media allegations of the existence of CIA detention centres in eastern Europe.

'Citizens abducted'

Mr Marty examined air traffic logs, satellite images and the accounts of those who said they had been abducted.

He identified a "spider's web" of US rendition flights and landing points around the world.

And although he said the US must bear responsibility for the flights, he concluded that the programme could operate only with "the intentional or grossly negligent collusion of the European partners".

He said that Spain, Turkey, Germany and Cyprus provided "staging posts" for rendition operations, while the UK, Portugal, Ireland and Greece were "stop-off points".

The report also says Italy, Sweden, Macedonia and Bosnia allowed the abduction of residents from their soil.

The most serious charges are levelled at Poland and Romania, where Mr Marty says there is enough evidence to support suspicions that CIA secret prisons were established.

The report triggered a wave of angry denials from the European countries involved, who called the findings speculation not based on facts.

In London, UK Prime Minister Tony Blair said the report "added absolutely nothing new whatever to the information we have".

US State Department spokesman Sean McCormack described the report as "a rehash of the previous efforts," saying that Washington was "disappointed in the tone and the content of it".

Black sites

The BBC's security correspondent, Frank Gardner, says that while the report makes uncomfortable reading for many European countries, the Council of Europe has been hampered by its lack of investigative powers.

The evidence in the report is largely circumstantial, our correspondent says, and proving many of the allegations, such as the existence of so-called "black sites", is beyond the council's powers.

The report is intended to wake up Europe's conscience to get national parliaments to investigate properly, our correspondent concludes.

"Governments have a duty to carry out serious, transparent investigations" of these allegations, Mr Marty said after the publication of the report.

"These states could have established the truth long ago - they did not. They now have an obligation to do so," he added.

Mr Marty's report is due to be adopted by the full parliamentary assembly of the council later this month.

Torture denial

Media allegations on CIA jails broke last November, when the Washington Post newspaper said the intelligence agency had been running facilities in eastern Europe, Afghanistan and Thailand.

It said more than 100 people had been sent to facilities known as "black sites" since they were set up following the 11 September 2001 attacks.

European media reports have since alleged that the CIA has used several European airports for its programme of "extraordinary renditions".

Under the highly secretive process, US intelligence agencies send terror suspects for interrogation by security officials in other countries, where they have no legal protection or rights under American law.

[Brenus]

Spain, Turkey, Germany and Cyprus provided "staging posts" for rendition operations, while the UK, Portugal, Ireland and Greece were "stop-off points", the report says.
It says Italy, Sweden, Macedonia and Bosnia allowed the abduction of residents from their soil.
The most serious charges are levelled at Poland and Romania, where Mr Marty says there is enough evidence to support suspicions that CIA secret prisons were established. “

“The hypocrisy comes from the fact that they support the taking of terror suspects because they want to remove them from their nations, and want someone else to do it for them, but they want to hide that fact from the people within their own nation.”
“It's pretty shameless for European nations to criticize the US when they've been cooperating with them”
“Oh my, you mean that the righteous Euros, who constantly remind us of their morally superior and civilized society, which is beyond the realm of thought and concept we barbaric Americans could ever understand are naughty little fascists like every god damn country in the world?”

You are having a laugh. Have you?
What Hypocrisy from Europe are you speaking about? Don’t some of theses Countries belong to the New Europe? Didn’t some of these Countries sent troops in Iraq? Germany is training the Iraqi Police, if my memory serves me.
Tell me, what choices for Macedonia, Bosnia (which, by the way are NOT in the EU)? I am more surprise by Sweden and Ireland, but not so much by Greece and Turkey, NATO bases…

So title “EUROPE aided” is a little bit overstretch isn’t it? France and Belgium, Austria, major opponents to the war are NOT on the list… THAT will be hypocrisy! But you are blaming faithful US allies here…

“It wasn't too long ago when European nations were involved in all sorts of direct actions, assassinating terrorists, midnight raids, blowing up Greenpeace boats, etc. Most Americans were usually horrified by this, with the usual "What about due process?" cries of outrage. Funny how things got all turned around.”
That is right, and at the same time the US was busy to organise Coup against elected President and Condor Operation, equipping and training so-called freedom fighters in Central America, providing weapons and equipment to the Red Khmers fighting the Vietnamese etc…
“I guess I have no point here, just saying.”

[Redleg]

Spain, Turkey, Germany and Cyprus provided "staging posts" for rendition operations, while the UK, Portugal, Ireland and Greece were "stop-off points", the report says.
It says Italy, Sweden, Macedonia and Bosnia allowed the abduction of residents from their soil.
The most serious charges are levelled at Poland and Romania, where Mr Marty says there is enough evidence to support suspicions that CIA secret prisons were established. “

“The hypocrisy comes from the fact that they support the taking of terror suspects because they want to remove them from their nations, and want someone else to do it for them, but they want to hide that fact from the people within their own nation.”
“It's pretty shameless for European nations to criticize the US when they've been cooperating with them”
“Oh my, you mean that the righteous Euros, who constantly remind us of their morally superior and civilized society, which is beyond the realm of thought and concept we barbaric Americans could ever understand are naughty little fascists like every god damn country in the world?”

You are having a laugh. Have you?
What Hypocrisy from Europe are you speaking about? Don’t some of theses Countries belong to the New Europe? Didn’t some of these Countries sent troops in Iraq? Germany is training the Iraqi Police, if my memory serves me.
Tell me, what choices for Macedonia, Bosnia (which, by the way are NOT in the EU)? I am more surprise by Sweden and Ireland, but not so much by Greece and Turkey, NATO bases…

So title “EUROPE aided” is a little bit overstretch isn’t it? France and Belgium, Austria, major opponents to the war are NOT on the list… THAT will be hypocrisy! But you are blaming faithful US allies here…

“It wasn't too long ago when European nations were involved in all sorts of direct actions, assassinating terrorists, midnight raids, blowing up Greenpeace boats, etc. Most Americans were usually horrified by this, with the usual "What about due process?" cries of outrage. Funny how things got all turned around.”
That is right, and at the same time the US was busy to organise Coup against elected President and Condor Operation, equipping and training so-called freedom fighters in Central America, providing weapons and equipment to the Red Khmers fighting the Vietnamese etc…
“I guess I have no point here, just saying.”

So I take it your defending the hypocrisy of the European community how interesting

[Brenus]

“So I take it your defending the hypocrisy of the European community how interesting”. Not at all, I just strongly opposed that it is a European Politic but a politic of individual member of Europe (geographically speaking). At least 3 on the Countries involved in the process are not in EU.

Red, you know that I think in politic hypocrisy is a needed talent (like in society: If I tell my brother what I really think about how his children education is, I won’t speak to him again).

I just react on your reactions, kind of: ”OOO, bad Euros, hypocrits!!!” when there are absolutely no proofs that the major opponents to the war (except Germany) were involved. Or EU as Community.
And again, the ones involved were the ones which supported US (or Bush, as you choose) in his War…

[Red Peasant]

“So I take it your defending the hypocrisy of the European community how interesting”. Not at all, I just strongly opposed that it is a European Politic but a politic of individual member of Europe (geographically speaking). At least 3 on the Countries involved in the process are not in EU.

Red, you know that I think in politic hypocrisy is a needed talent (like in society: If I tell my brother what I really think about how his children education is, I won’t speak to him again).

I just react on your reactions, kind of: ”OOO, bad Euros, hypocrits!!!” when there are absolutely no proofs that the major opponents to the war (except Germany) were involved. Or EU as Community.
And again, the ones involved were the ones which supported US (or Bush, as you choose) in his War…

I think that Americans can only generalise their bogey-men or demons on a large scale: Commies, Reds, Muslims, aliens, EUROS! It's just too much for them to distinguish between Britain, France, Germany, Bosnia, etc. Heck, that's too many little piddly countries maannn!

[Redleg]

I think that Americans can only generalise their bogey-men or demons on a large scale: Commies, Reds, Muslims, aliens, EUROS! It's just too much for them to distinguish between Britain, France, Germany, Bosnia, etc. Heck, that's too many little piddly countries maannn!

How unenlightened - the generalization was based solely upon the number of European countries involved.

Other then the United States what do all the countries mentioned have in common..... Or are you part of they lets defend the hypocrisy.....

[Redleg]

“So I take it your defending the hypocrisy of the European community how interesting”. Not at all, I just strongly opposed that it is a European Politic but a politic of individual member of Europe (geographically speaking). At least 3 on the Countries involved in the process are not in EU.

A geographical generalization is what you are opposed to?

Red, you know that I think in politic hypocrisy is a needed talent (like in society: If I tell my brother what I really think about how his children education is, I won’t speak to him again).

oh but in some like Germany it is indeed an artform alreadly especially in this instance.

I just react on your reactions, kind of: ”OOO, bad Euros, hypocrits!!!” when there are absolutely no proofs that the major opponents to the war (except Germany) were involved. Or EU as Community.
And again, the ones involved were the ones which supported US (or Bush, as you choose) in his War…

A geographical generalization was used because the nations involved are guess what - that's right European......