Over powered mercs

**soibean** · 06-21-2006, 05:02

I've been playing as the Asagi (sp?) faction and have been slowly upgrading my samurai army. I have built the 3rd level barracks and can now train the heavy samurai unit, I forgot name it starts with an N I believe.

While on campaign I wanted to recruit some random mercs to use as cannon fodder when I storm the rebel walls, but I noticed that units such as the Ronin and Red ... bearded samurai (I think) had much better stats than my 2nd and 3rd level samurai with only a slight increase in cost.

I purchased 4 units of ronin, who with their 18 attack and high defense, completely massacred just about all units the AI sent at them. I feel that these mercs are a little super powered, unless that was their intention to be in which case I apologize.

**moreb_benhk** · 06-21-2006, 06:21

Yes. That is a bit of a dissapointment- to be one of the 2 'samuri' factions, but still to have most of your samuri units completely outclassed by freely available merc. units which don't cost very much extra, and are, on the whole a tad bit cooler. Perhaps making them a bit rarer on availability and a bit more expensive upfront/upkeep would help adress that. It shouldnt be very viable to stock up a whole army of such solid mercs.

Alternately, those red-beared-samuri would look pretty sweet as part of the Japanese factions too............

**big_feef** · 06-21-2006, 06:26

You think mercs are bad? Try assaulting the Monks with one full stack.

When you do, come back and tell me how it went.

**Moros** · 06-21-2006, 09:38

yeah, the monks now are overpowered. I think they shoiuld be strong and the monk masters should be overpowered. But the other shouldn't be.

I also think the akagi sumarai units (infantry) are underpowered, using mercenaries you can easily make an army wich is much stronger and just a little more expensive.

**Opie** · 06-22-2006, 03:03

I like the way mercs are atm. Its realistic to have lots of mercs, and adds to the variety in the game. Also really helps the AI out ,especially the ones with smaller amounts of provinces at the start.

Try playing the zensen , right off the bat would be tough without mercs.
And as for them being more powerfull that your samurai, consider there are various levels. The No dachi samurai are better than 99% of the mercs out there, and have a third the upkeep.

**moreb_benhk** · 06-22-2006, 05:24

Indeed I agree that mercs in general need to be affordable and common enough to provide a solid army suppliment, especially in a pinch. However when merc dominated armies become more viable, both in the short and long term, rather than using armies principally of your own units, then things are a bit out of whack.

Deffinately, the run-of-the-mill mercs (cannon fodder, basic soldiers, etc) need to be freely and cheapishly available, but those really really strong ones (such as Merc Ronin and those Red Bearded Samurai (im only familiar with Japanese-region mercs)) shouldn't. They should be of an expense and rarity to make them the solid tip of your army, that 1-3 units of super-dudes that tip the battle in your favor, rather than just a super-powerfull mainline unit. Hence I would be keen for the strong mercs to be availability/costwise to be tweaked a tad, so that they are a really cool and valuable addition to an army without being a cool and valuable and viable army all by themselves (too costly etc). That way those faction-unique units will have a greater part to play in your armies.

By the way, I am having an absolutely mint time as the northern Japanese team (name forgotten), blitzing down my southern counterparts, with fun battles and actually reasonable losses (nothing greater than 4:1 to me) thanks to that morale/battle speed mod.

This is a great game.

**Opie** · 06-22-2006, 05:41

yes the north japanese are a great faction (zensen)
i had a very good time playing them untill the deamon CTD issue forced me to put that campaign on hold till a fix comes out.

I agree some of the mercs are too plentifull, there shouldnt be 4 merc ronin, or 4 bearded samurai available. But other than scaling the overall availability down a bit i wouldnt change much.
Keep in mind that those large amounts of quality mercs are only available in japan , so it does keep with the setting of them having the elite troops (if not neccesarily city trained)

Most other locations only have 1-3 types of mercs available, the quality and quantity of which is mostly lower than the japanese mercs.

On a side note, who does the speed/morale mod help? You or the AI?
I havent noticed any issues with my own units running away , even from heavilly outnumbered daemons. And i dont mind the speed, so i didnt download the mod.
But if it will help the morale of the enemy, maybe ill give it a shot. Playing on VH/VH and im still finding the daemons very weak. (they also havent brought up many elite units, still havent seen shiva's, etc) It seems because of its location and lack of early competition India gets to be the superpower every time.

**moreb_benhk** · 06-22-2006, 06:51

The speed/morale change is for everyone. The main difference in speed now is that you cant reach the enemy or vice versa in under 10 seconds, allowing ranged units to play a slightly larger role in many clashes.

The key thing with the morale is that because all units have better morale, they all stay longer. This means that the team that usually loses the battle (whose units run first ie- the AI) gets to inflict more damage on the enemy before succumbing. The actual clashes themselves last a lot longer so you have more time to enjoy the beautiful models, the battles, and to use slightly grander strategies.

**Morray** · 06-29-2006, 02:48

I think I am finding the complete opposite!

I am playing VH/VH as the Indian faction

Mercs available to them include the fish guys and ghosts.

Both of which seem to die in droves, ghosts with the amazing 50 attack don't seem to fair to badly, but there is so few of them to make the upkeeep cost seem worthy, but the fish guys always bite the dust!

It's great though I love it!

First time in ages that R:TW has given me a challenge!

(I am at work but when I get back I have to fend of 2 full stacks of deamons packed with Noah deamons who kick my elephants ass btw!

ACE!

**moreb_benhk** · 06-29-2006, 22:54

Yes. It appears that the only powerful mercs are to be found in the Japanese regions. Perhaps throwing in a couple of rare but powerful mercs in other regions would be a cool addition that would keep you scanning merc ranks.

**Morray** · 06-29-2006, 23:13

Thats a very good idea!

I would personally love to see some deamon army mercs available! Not sure if there are any? If there are my mistake but I would love to get my hands on some Wang-Liangs! Man thyose things beat the living crap out of me in VH!