"This is America. When Ordering Please Speak English" - a steak joint vs the PC crowd

[Crazed Rabbit]

City Councilman James F. Kenney has called the sign "divisive and mean-spirited,"

When that is no longer legal, it is time to begin the revolution.

Crazed Rabbit

[Xiahou]

As someone who's eaten there(check that, I ate at Pat's across the street), I have no problem with the sign at all. It's a very busy place and my guess is he doesnt want lines being held up by not being able to understand orders from non-english speakers. It fits in perfectly with the rest of the signage and the attitude of the place.

If you dont like it, dont eat there- I think they'll get by without your business.

If ordering from one of the famous establishments, they insist that you be prepared to state your order, and have your money in hand, or go to the end of the line [18] (and patrons of Geno's are encouraged to "Speak English" when ordering[17]). The requested language is to state the quantity, the type of cheese, and then "wit" or "witout" to indicate fried onions on the sandwich. A common order is "Whiz wit", a cheesesteak with Cheez Whiz, served with fried onions. It is not called "Whiz with", as the guttural South Philadelphia Italian-immigrant pronunciation actually appears on menus—ordering otherwise brands one as an outsider or tourist. Lines for the sandwiches can extend into the streets on certain nights, especially after a sports event at one of the major Philadelphia stadiums, thus showing the need for a rapid ordering system.........

[Tribesman]

I'd especially like to hear the thoughts of any locals who know how to order properly.

Now that would be interesting , how do you order in proper english when they request that you order in gibberish .
It is not called "Whiz with", as the guttural South Philadelphia Italian-immigrant pronunciation actually appears on menus—ordering otherwise brands one as an outsider or tourist.
Damn immigrants cannot even speak English eh , don't you just hate it when these immigrants come over and change things

[Xiahou]

Again, its their choice. If he expects you to order in a series of clicks and whistles, it's no one's concern but his. If his decision hurts his business (the sign in question certainly isnt), then he has to live with that choice.

[solypsist]

that's right. this is a two way street.
/end thread

Again, its their choice. If he expects you to order in a series of clicks and whistles, it's no one's concern but his. If his decision hurts his business (the sign in question certainly isnt), then he has to live with that choice.

[_Martyr_]

It strikes me as more than a little unfair to any visiting tourist...

[GoreBag]

I just like how the sign is grammatically incorrect.

[Devastatin Dave]

It strikes me as more than a little unfair to any visiting tourist...

Believe it or not, that's what I thought when I read this. What about someone from another country, visiting as on vacation (or holiday as the cousins say)? I'm glad when I was in Korea the folks there put up with my ignorance towards their language of course $ is an international language ya know.
But seriously, what about folks from other countries wanting to try out a cheese steak and not knowing the language. You know I'm not exactly a PC police guy, but all joking aside is he going after citizens that don't speak the language or all folks that don't speak English. Besides how the heck is some guy from Phillie know how to speak English in the first place!!!
Baddabing-badda-boom... Yo Adriaaaaaaaan!!!

[GeneralHankerchief]

You make some good points, Dave. You should try arguing on the left more often.

I know Pat's has a section on its website titled "How to Order" - maybe the steak joints should have something like that up on the actual store location (maybe they already do, can't remember off the top of my head, any locals want to help me out?).

but all joking aside is he going after citizens that don't speak the language

Actually I think it's aimed at illegal immigrants more than tourists. Now correct me if I'm wrong but you do not consider illegals to be citizens, right?

[_Martyr_]

Believe it or not, that's what I thought when I read this. What about someone from another country, visiting as on vacation (or holiday as the cousins say)? I'm glad when I was in Korea the folks there put up with my ignorance towards their language of course $ is an international language ya know.
But seriously, what about folks from other countries wanting to try out a cheese steak and not knowing the language. You know I'm not exactly a PC police guy, but all joking aside is he going after citizens that don't speak the language or all folks that don't speak English. Besides how the heck is some guy from Phillie know how to speak English in the first place!!!
Baddabing-badda-boom... Yo Adriaaaaaaaan!!!

Wow, Dave... I believe this is actually the first time weve ever agreed on anything...

[Kaiser of Arabia]

Personally I like Tony Luke's better, but I think that this is within his rights, PCers be damned. If you don't beleive in free speech, go to North Korea. HEAR THAT CITY COUNCIL?

[Divinus Arma]

Here is something REALLY funny. It is one of plans to learn spanish once I finish the MBA, and before I start the MPA. So I try to pick up a little here and there and use it when I can. So I go into a Mexican restaruant and order my meal entirely en espanol: "Porfavor Senor, Yo Quero un burrito no mas con pollo e queso. E un horchata grande." What does the little bugger do? Rattles off some espanol 100 miles an hour with a smug look the entire time. When I answer: "Hablo muy poquito espanol, I am learning." He then shakes his head in disgust and laughs to himself.

That one really pissed me off. I am never again saying a lick of spanish in casual conversation to a latino until I know the language 100%. Then when somebody calls me a pinchi gringo or bendeho or whatever, then I can tell him that it isn't nice to say such things to customers who are trying to learn the language.

If somebody tells me that "they are learning", then I would be more than happy to help.

[_Martyr_]

Here is something REALLY funny. It is one of plans to learn spanish once I finish the MBA, and before I start the MPA. So I try to pick up a little here and there and use it when I can. So I go into a Mexican restaruant and order my meal entirely en espanol: "Porfavor Senor, Yo Quero un burrito no mas con pollo e queso. E un horchata grande." What does the little bugger do? Rattles off some espanol 100 miles an hour with a smug look the entire time. When I answer: "Hablo muy poquito espanol, I am learning." He then shakes his head in disgust and laughs to himself.

That one really pissed me off. I am never again saying a lick of spanish in casual conversation to a latino until I know the language 100%. Then when somebody calls me a pinchi gringo or bendeho or whatever, then I can tell him that it isn't nice to say such things to customers who are trying to learn the language.

If somebody tells me that "they are learning", then I would be more than happy to help.

Well that guy was just an ass. As someone who is bilingual, my advise to you is not to be disheartened by one bad experience that may have shook your confidence. Mixing with native speakers is pretty much the only way that you're ever going to get to a fluency level. Dont let one bad apple spoil it for you. It does go to show you though how difficult it is to learn a language if people discourage you. Maybe if the cheese steak joint owner was a little friendlier, he might actually encourage/teach immigrants a word or two instead of just being an unwelcoming asshole in the same way your waiter could have encouraged/taught you some new vocabulary!

[PanzerJaeger]

Originally Posted by Divinus Arma
Here is something REALLY funny. It is one of plans to learn spanish once I finish the MBA, and before I start the MPA. So I try to pick up a little here and there and use it when I can. So I go into a Mexican restaruant and order my meal entirely en espanol: "Porfavor Senor, Yo Quero un burrito no mas con pollo e queso. E un horchata grande." What does the little bugger do? Rattles off some espanol 100 miles an hour with a smug look the entire time. When I answer: "Hablo muy poquito espanol, I am learning." He then shakes his head in disgust and laughs to himself.

That one really pissed me off. I am never again saying a lick of spanish in casual conversation to a latino until I know the language 100%. Then when somebody calls me a pinchi gringo or bendeho or whatever, then I can tell him that it isn't nice to say such things to customers who are trying to learn the language.

If somebody tells me that "they are learning", then I would be more than happy to help.

"People" like that should be put in their place. He probably wasn't even legal.

However, as you progress down a lucrative carreer with your MBA and other degrees, he will always be a pathetic little server who has nothing more to take pride in than his ability to speak his native language and mock "gringos" with paychecks 10 times as big as his will ever be.

[AntiochusIII]

"People" like that should be put in their place. He probably wasn't even legal.

However, as you progress down a lucrative carreer with your MBA and other degrees, he will always be a pathetic little server who has nothing more to take pride in than his ability to speak his native language and mock "gringos" with paychecks 10 times as big as his will ever be.

Wondrous. So that is "their place," huh?



How about some respect for humanity? A smug does not a slave make.

[Ja'chyra]

"People" like that should be put in their place. He probably wasn't even legal.

However, as you progress down a lucrative carreer with your MBA and other degrees, he will always be a pathetic little server who has nothing more to take pride in than his ability to speak his native language and mock "gringos" with paychecks 10 times as big as his will ever be.

Long time no see PJ, I see you just came back to troll.

[Tachikaze]

That one really pissed me off. I am never again saying a lick of spanish in casual conversation to a latino until I know the language 100%. Then when somebody calls me a pinchi gringo or bendeho or whatever, then I can tell him that it isn't nice to say such things to customers who are trying to learn the language.

Hey, Redleg, he's generalizing! Where's your rebuff?

What? Oh, you only criticize liberals for generalizing! I get it!

Divinus:
Now you know how second-language-English-speakers feel when they try to speak English in steakhouses run by intolerant people.

[Divinus Arma]

Divinus:
Now you know how second-language-English-speakers feel when they try to speak English in steakhouses run by intolerant people.

That's where you show your bias, hippy.

I respectfully engaged them in thier own language and the ass made fun of me for trying. Being in an area filled with latinos, I am fully capable of articulating the lingual nuances of espanol, thus I did not come across as: "you kee- aireeo uno borritto no moth con po-ell-o ee kay so, ee un hor-chatter grandee." Which, I am certain, is the case whn ordering "steeek e queso"

Hablo puquito, no ningun espanol. Si comprende cabron? Pinche rebelde del socialista.

espanol es funny

btw: Mexico v. Angola 0-0 !!!! loloolololol WTF?!?!?!?

[AntiochusIII]

Actually, DA, being a second-language-English-speaker myself I think you are self-victimizing yourself too much. It's especially hard in my situation around two years ago when I arrived in the United States not because people around me are asses but because they cannot--could not, at least, now they surely could, what's with my little own total immersion transition period effectively complete and a properly American liberal-hippie-commie as a product--understand me, which causes an awkward situation time and again when they try to be polite (most, at least) while telling me they don't understand a word I'm trying to communicate.

However, because they are nice, I was neither offended nor angered, instead, I felt shame, which is natural. Now I am friends with most of those same people. Nonetheless, there are asses out there who did laugh at my accented English (when it was heavily accented) and act like your anecdotal waiter but I did not generalize all Americans as asses who laugh at those who cannot speak fluent American English. In fact, I wasn't even angry at them, understanding as I am of the natural workings of human humor.

Just because one ass who speaks a language used by millions happens to laugh at your beginning speech does not mean you can just go out and generalize (well, technically you can, but it's a figure of speech) them out like that. Remember that commercial "stereotyping is bad?"

As of the topic, I suppose insensitive and mean-spirited does not equal a violation of the law. Of course, "this is America," as pointed out, is an elitist statement, extraneous and elitist. But what the hell. People have opinions, nice or not nice. And it's his business, literally, so unless he starts the National Capitalist Party of America (Against Hispanics) or Mothers Against Mexicans organizations I'd not go overboard like the council in the article.

*I apologize with the liberal using of the word "ass" to describe a behavior of individuals; I assume the general tone of the statement, the "ordinary" usage of the word as opposed to exclusively expletive, and the fact that it does not attack anyone in particular with that descriptive characterization, does not make for a violation material.

[Tachikaze]

That's where you show your bias, hippy.

I respectfully engaged them in thier own language and the ass made fun of me for trying. Being in an area filled with latinos, I am fully capable of articulating the lingual nuances of espanol, thus I did not come across as: "you kee- aireeo uno borritto no moth con po-ell-o ee kay so, ee un hor-chatter grandee." Which, I am certain, is the case whn ordering "steeek e queso"

Hablo puquito, no ningun espanol. Si comprende cabron? Pinche rebelde del socialista.

espanol es funny

btw: Mexico v. Angola 0-0 !!!! loloolololol WTF?!?!?!?

I think the person who posted the sign at Geno's is cut from the same cloth as the man who insulted you for speaking Spanish.

I have different experiences. Most people that I speak Spanish to are happy for the attempt. Some have no patience, even though my Spanish is not too bad, and respond to me in English.

I have had a couple of people tease me, but their method was to hit me with colloquial Mexican Spanish that I had no knowledge of, then laugh.

[Tribesman]

If you don't beleive in free speech, go to North Korea.
Nah , tried that , they wouldn't give me permission to enter , and when I snuck across the border I found that the wages for undocumented were shite and I couldn't even order fried dog leg unles I knew the local version of not quite Korean , so I high tailed it across the border and ordered a Bargain Bucket *TM in a Koreanish accent .

[Lemur]

When [a divisive and mean-spirited sign] is no longer legal, it is time to begin the revolution.

Goodness gracious, I find myself in complete agreement with the rabid rabbit. A sign of the end times?

[yesdachi]

Cough cough marketing cough cough.

They knew it would get a rise out of some people and that is why it was done in a less PC maner (That and probably some personal frustration) but look at all the attention they are getting. Cha-Ching!

Plus, it sounds like the lines are always there; if you have questions about the ordering system just ask the person next to you.

[_Martyr_]

Bubba, a furniture dealer in West Virginia, wanted to expand the line of furniture in his store. Although he had never traveled outside the USA, he decided to go to Paris to get some ideas. After arriving in the French city he met with some manufacturers and selected a line that he thought would sell well back home.
To celebrate the new acquisition he visited a small bistro and had a glass of wine. The small place was quite crowded, and he noticed that the other chair at his table was the only vacant seat in the house.
Before long, a very beautiful young Parisian girl came to his table, asked him something in French (which he did not understand), and motioned toward the chair. He invited her to sit down.
He tried to speak to her in English, but she did not speak his language, so after a couple of minutes of trying to communicate, he took a napkin, drew a picture of a wine glass and showed it to her. She nodded, and he ordered a glass of wine for her. After sitting together at the table for a while, he took another napkin and drew a picture of a plate with food on it, and she nodded. They left the bistro and found a quiet cafe that featured a small group playing romantic music. They ordered dinner, after which he took another napkin and drew a picture of a couple dancing. She nodded, and they got up to dance. They danced until the cafe closed and the band was packing up. Back at their table the young lady took a napkin and drew a picture of a four-poster bed.
To this day, Bubba has no idea how she figured out he was in the furniture business.


Suppose there is something to be said about learning the language afterall...

[Devastatin Dave]

Good one Martyr!!!

[doc_bean]

Either way he would have nodded yes, wouldn't he ?

Go Bubba !

[GeneralHankerchief]

Excellent joke. Mind if I put it in the Frontroom joke thread?

[Tachikaze]

I deal with foreign people every day in my life. I accommodate them the best I can. If I absolutely can't understand their speech, I find another way to communicate. It's not my job to tell them what language they should speak.

I wonder what Geno's does with people who are mute. Tell them to leave?

If I were a patron of Geno's and I saw that sign, I would go, instead, to a taco shop and order in Spanish. The people at my local taco shop are much kinder.

[Proletariat]

I wonder what Geno's does with people who are mute. Tell them to leave?

Good point, because we all know Hispanics aren't actually capable of learning to speak english.

[Crazed Rabbit]

Goodness gracious, I find myself in complete agreement with the rabid rabbit. A sign of the end times?

Welcome to the poorly-lit-due-to-being-in-underground-tunnels side!

Crazed Rabbit

PS. My crazyness is not due to rabies, thank you very much.