Scutum and Pilum Question

[Oldgamer]

I have not been trying to shoot you down. However, if I think you are wrong I will say so, here I am drawing on what I have read and been taught in the field of experimental archaeology.

First, sorry about the tone of my previous post. I've been spending too much time in the TWC Mudpit!

I will concede the following points.

1.) A weapon from the 2nd century BC would definately weigh more than one from the 1st century BC/AD, the period from which I generally work. As you say many advances have been made and a lot of them were made after your particular sword was forged. I still think ten pounds is very heavy and it sounds like an odd weapon, how long was it?

[Edit: Some initial research suggests the weapon you descibe is a cavalry weapon, ealier infantry weapons being shorter and pointed.]

The weapons I held was about 42 inches long, from tip to end of tang. At its widest point ... and remember that it was a leaf-shaped weapon ... it was some 4-4.5 inches (down where the hilt would have been, it was about 2.5 inches). It was a large weapon, to say the least, and would have required a strong man to wield it. The archaeologist who showed it to me wasn't sure whether it was a cavalry weapon or not (I asked him), but reminded me that many people of Celtic, Gallic, and Teutonic origins used very long and heavy weapons designed to smash armor and break bones.

2.) I will also concede that an Imperial Scutum was, I discovered today, around 20 pounds, so we were both about as wrong as each other there.

You are correct that the shield was not overly mobile and I apolagise if I gave that impression, it is something of a controvosy between experience and the literature. I would say that it was manuverable and fairly easy to carry and use with practice.

You are more-or-less right here actually and I hang my head in shame for mentioning the "face punch." You can't do it with the boss, you can however, do a nifty number with the brass rim. I was remembering one photograph of a big guy with a little scutum.

Concerning the weight of the scutum, much would depend on the thickness of the plywood from which it was made. I've never been able to find any truly reliable source concerning this. We don't even know how thick the "plys" were, and from what type of wood they were made. It's very possible that the plywood we used in my re-enactment group was too thick.

I guess that it would be possible for a highly-conditioned warrior to do a face punch, if the opportunity presented itself. For the quality of all of our research, we don't really have a clear idea of what happened man vs. man in ancient warfare, except that men died.

So it would seem we both made some mistakes.

I make them all the time!

Oh, "Wigferth the One Armed"
How about, "Wigferth wooden arm?"

Sounds good to me. I like the aliteration!

Once again, sorry for the testy nature of my earlier post.