RTW Campaign with BI exe - a few questions

[Ciaran]

I know you can start the Imperial Campaign via the BI exe, but how?
And then there are a couple of other issues: Will phalanxes still work, since I don´t know yet whether any BI unit has phalanx capability? And what about the Marius Reform and the Senate (those are really important), does all the Senate-related stuff (missions, offices, Senate and population ranking and so on) still work and the reforms still happen?

This doesn´t look much like modding questions, but the main issue is using a couple of BI features like swimming or the Schiltron in an Imperial Campaign or rather a provincial campaign that is based on the Imperial Campaign.

[Rstoner]

The BI exe seems to support everything that was in the original. I've been playing my current campaign for 180 turns and all is well.
As for the Imperial campaign. It won't work through it's original menu slot but will appear in provincial campaigns and seems to work fine.

To run RTW through the BI.exe you should make a shortcut to the BI.exe, right click on it and go to properties. Add -mod:Data to the end of the target line (leaving one space between) so it looks something like this:

"C:\Program Files\Activision\Rome - Total War\RomeTW-BI.exe" -mod:Data

The new BI unit abilities like shieldwall, swimming, ect... can now be activated using the appropriate tags in the EDU.
The night battle, hording and sacking settlement features will require a bit more work.

I activated the night battles using this great tutorial: https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showthread.php?t=59950

Peace

[Ciaran]

Thanks a lot.

[Rstoner]

You are welcome

[Lysander]

I discovered that if you name the folder "barbarian_invasion" (as well as the campaign_regions file in text folder) the Bi.exe will run the campaign through the imperial campaign menu slot, instead of as a provincial.
Also, the same goes for alexander.exe, name the campaign "alexander" and it will run through the imperial slot.

[Rstoner]

Do custom battles work using this method? Because I have to use the RTW exe to access them.

I probably should have mentioned that before.

[Caesar_Julius]

You say you play the rtw campaign for 180 turns ? do you started the civil war ?
is it works ? because i play also with this options and i cannot be outlawed anymore ??

[Rstoner]

I played as the Greek cities but I don't think the romans were at war when I stopped playing that campaign.
I might start a Roman campaign and investigate this. Please post here if your civil war happens. It will be a shame if it doesn't.

[Caesar_Julius]

NO It doesn´t I think this one are not integrated anymore in the BI.exe this issues are out . You cannot be outlawed anymore or start a civil war. to check this quickly begin a game as the julii put in some assasins and send them to kills senates generals. If they fails you will get normally be outlawed but this one doesnt functioning anymore . Only your popularity sink. So ok go one sink your popularity to the senate and when you have only one star there send a diplomat to a brutii or scipii city and bought a city from them. next turn you will became the mission from the senate to return the city back or you will be outlawed. When the misssion reached his last turn and you will press the end turn button you will got a ctd.

[Rstoner]

You're right, I assassinated 2 Senate characters and nothing happened except a dip in my popularity. I haven't noticed this before as I've never played as a Roman faction.

There is a way around this however, as you could use a basic short script to trigger a civil war. If you haven't tried scripting yet read this excellent tutorial: https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showthread.php?t=46738

Once you have created your first short script you can open it and replace the contents with something like this:

script
console_command diplomatic_stance romans_julii romans_brutii war
console_command diplomatic_stance romans_julii romans_scipii war
console_command diplomatic_stance romans_julii romans_senate war
console_command diplomatic_stance romans_brutii romans_julii war
console_command diplomatic_stance romans_brutii romans_scipii war
console_command diplomatic_stance romans_brutii romans_senate war
console_command diplomatic_stance romans_scipii romans_julii war
console_command diplomatic_stance romans_scipii romans_brutii war
console_command diplomatic_stance romans_scipii romans_senate war
console_command diplomatic_stance romans_senate romans_julii war
console_command diplomatic_stance romans_senate romans_brutii war
console_command diplomatic_stance romans_senate romans_scipii war
end_script

I tried this script yesterday, it does work and also brings up the 'outlawed by senate' message. The downside is you have to trigger it yourself.

[Caesar_Julius]

hy

So Ok I created a trigger for that and check it out with your script . So it works but only at half .
Let me explain this :
1. I only want to check if it works so i make trigger with the condition only faction is local and check every factions turn. Then I try it out
So Ok next rund I get the advice thread and it works . The senate outlaws all the factions and are at war with all the factions.
BUT only the senate. I don´t understand this because the command are also in your script that the other roman factions go on war with each other roman faction. But im only at war with the senate and still allied with the other . Why ? (I tested it also if you conquer Rome and destroy the senate are you still allied with the others and you cant break the aliance because it says you dont have enough popularity for this ). Do you tested that too ?? Or ist that a command to get full popularity so i can include that in the script ?

2. So now i want that this trigger happend after a historic_event . Can youz plz tell me the code for that ?
I set to conditions : FactionIsLocal
and I_historic_event Roman Civil War
but that its not correct. Can you plz tell me the correct code for this. ( I created a new historic Event Called Roman Civil war for it and i try it out and the event works fine )

[Caesar_Julius]

hy

So Ok I created a trigger for that and check it out with your script . So it works but only at half .
Let me explain this :
1. I only want to check if it works so i make trigger with the condition only faction is local and check every factions turn. Then I try it out
So Ok next rund I get the advice thread and it works . The senate outlaws all the factions and are at war with all the factions.
BUT only the senate. I don´t understand this because the command are also in your script that the other roman factions go on war with each other roman faction. But im only at war with the senate and still allied with the other . Why ? (I tested it also if you conquer Rome and destroy the senate are you still allied with the others and you cant break the aliance because it says you dont have enough popularity for this ). Do you tested that too ?? Or ist that a command to get full popularity so i can include that in the script ?

2. So now i want that this trigger happend after a historic_event . Can youz plz tell me the code for that ?
I set to conditions : FactionIsLocal
and I_historic_event Roman Civil War
but that its not correct. Can you plz tell me the correct code for this. ( I created a new historic Event Called Roman Civil war for it and i try it out and the event works fine )

What precisely is that entry supposed to do? Have you tried to remove that line? It´s the only thing I can think of right now, as I have no idea what the enhancement pack and the Client Kingdom mod do precisely.

You're right, I assassinated 2 Senate characters and nothing happened except a dip in my popularity. I haven't noticed this before as I've never played as a Roman faction.

There is a way around this however, as you could use a basic short script to trigger a civil war. If you haven't tried scripting yet read this excellent tutorial: https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showthread.php?t=46738

Once you have created your first short script you can open it and replace the contents with something like this:

script
console_command diplomatic_stance romans_julii romans_brutii war
console_command diplomatic_stance romans_julii romans_scipii war
console_command diplomatic_stance romans_julii romans_senate war
console_command diplomatic_stance romans_brutii romans_julii war
console_command diplomatic_stance romans_brutii romans_scipii war
console_command diplomatic_stance romans_brutii romans_senate war
console_command diplomatic_stance romans_scipii romans_julii war
console_command diplomatic_stance romans_scipii romans_brutii war
console_command diplomatic_stance romans_scipii romans_senate war
console_command diplomatic_stance romans_senate romans_julii war
console_command diplomatic_stance romans_senate romans_brutii war
console_command diplomatic_stance romans_senate romans_scipii war
end_script

I tried this script yesterday, it does work and also brings up the 'outlawed by senate' message. The downside is you have to trigger it yourself.

1.i tried now for several times but it seems also to not working for all times . it works fine for the first 2 times and then it not comes anymore. I dont know why ? So whitout changes it doesnt appear in the first turn every time in test i dont know why.

2. I tried also to change the script too but if i change for example from war only to neutral or only put the other factions lines out and let only the senates lines in the advice will not more appear . hmmmm strange

CAN SOMEBODY EXPLAIN MY THIS ??

[AmbrosiusAurelianus]

Will phalanxes still work, since I don´t know yet whether any BI unit has phalanx capability?

No one has answered this yet, and I would also be interested in hearing what people know about this.

When playing the BareBones mod through the BI.exe, I saw a unit that stood in the fake phalanx formation, but still had the option to form phalanx. When I pressed the key for phalanx mode the unit redeployed slightly and moved into the traditional phalanx.

Does this mean that some units can be a sort of hybrid between the old phalanx and the new? If so this could be potentially useful in campaign, because the fake phalanx could charge and the old one could not. Perhaps using the BI.exe gives the best of both worlds.

Actually, I don't know what to enter in the EDU to give a fake phalanx in BI. Is it the same as for the traditional phalanx in RTW?

[Ciaran]

What´s the fake phalanx? Do you mean the short_pike EDU entry? If you use that, the unit with it will basically act like a phalanx unit with short spears. What´s special about it is the fact that this also works without the unit being phalanx-capable (no phalanx entry in the formatons line), but it can run while in "pseudo-phalanx" (the formation looks the same), but it can not go off phalanx mode as a "regular" phalanx could. Another thing about the fake phalanx (if I may borrow that term) is that it doesn´t use secondary weapons (or if the unit has a secondary weapon it will only use that, and never the phalanx spears).

Caesar_Julius: Sorry, I have absolutely no knowledge about the RTW scripting system whatsoever (regarding the other threat in mod discussions). I´m trying the Imperial Campaign (unmodded, without bi_options in descr_strat) with the BI.exe at the moment, but I´m still lightyears from potential civil war. I´ll see what happens if I ever come there.

[Caesar_Julius]

Caesar_Julius: Sorry, I have absolutely no knowledge about the RTW scripting system whatsoever (regarding the other threat in mod discussions). I´m trying the Imperial Campaign (unmodded, without bi_options in descr_strat) with the BI.exe at the moment, but I´m still lightyears from potential civil war. I´ll see what happens if I ever come there.

And you play as a roman faction or not ?? Because if not than you can play how long you want nothing happens also no civil war but if you play as a roman faction then it will happens

[AmbrosiusAurelianus]

What´s the fake phalanx? Do you mean the short_pike EDU entry? If you use that, the unit with it will basically act like a phalanx unit with short spears. What´s special about it is the fact that this also works without the unit being phalanx-capable (no phalanx entry in the formatons line), but it can run while in "pseudo-phalanx" (the formation looks the same), but it can not go off phalanx mode as a "regular" phalanx could. Another thing about the fake phalanx (if I may borrow that term) is that it doesn´t use secondary weapons (or if the unit has a secondary weapon it will only use that, and never the phalanx spears).

Yes, that sounds like what I am talking about. Sorry about my, erm, odd term for it.

It's a shame that units with a long pike cannot manoeuvre thus, and a real shame that such units only use the sword if equipped with a secondary weapon. Could one give them a spear as a secondary and not give them a primary? Or for that matter, give them a spear for both primary and secondary, each with the same stats?

Thanks for your info anyway, Ciaran.

[Ciaran]

And you play as a roman faction or not ??

Yes, of course, the Julii, to be precise. It wouldn´t make much sense trying to test it with a non-roman faction, now would it?

It's a shame that units with a long pike cannot manoeuvre thus, and a real shame that such units only use the sword if equipped with a secondary weapon. Could one give them a spear as a secondary and not give them a primary? Or for that matter, give them a spear for both primary and secondary, each with the same stats?

I´m not quite sure I get what you want. Do you want to make a phalanx unit use its sword? Nothing simpler than that, switch off phalanx mode and give them an order to attack, they´ll use swords automatically. Or do you not want them to use any swords at all? That´s more difficult. You could give them the same stats for both primary and secondary weapons, of course, and change the secondary weapon skeleton in model_battle to a spearman one, but the unit will keep its sword showing (that´s because the sword is part of the .cas models, the "physical" models, so to speak). To make them show to use spears (for the stats it doesn´t matter, you can basically edit them to anything; I´m purely refering to what´s showing on-screen) you´d have to edit the actual cas model, remove the sword and give them a spear as secondary weapon.
Now, things get a bit more complicated when you figure in the phalanx ability. Those pikes the phalanx units carry in the game are not part of their .cas model (though the cas models do have spears on them, just remove the phalanx ability of, say the Hoplites in EDU and you´ll see it), but they come from the phalanx ability, adding that makes them use a seperate weapon model, the Hoplite_pike.cas.

[Caesar_Julius]

Speed it it up ciaran. You dont need to invest so much time for it HERE:

" to check this quickly begin a game as the julii put in some assasins and send them to kills senates generals. If they fails you will get normally be outlawed but this one doesnt functioning anymore . Only your popularity sink. So ok go one sink your popularity to the senate and when you have only one star there send a diplomat to a brutii or scipii city and bought a city from them. next turn you will became the mission from the senate to return the city back or you will be outlawed. When the misssion reached his last turn and you will press the end turn button you will got a ctd. ""

[Caesar_Julius]

1.i tried now for several times but it seems also to not working for all times . it works fine for the first 2 times and then it not comes anymore. I dont know why ? So whitout changes it doesnt appear in the first turn every time in test i dont know why.

2. I tried also to change the script too but if i change for example from war only to neutral or only put the other factions lines out and let only the senates lines in the advice will not more appear . hmmmm strange

CAN SOMEBODY EXPLAIN MY THIS ??

the problem that the advice will not more appear is solved . We must everytime delete the advice file in preferences folder before we start.

[Caesar_Julius]

You're right, I assassinated 2 Senate characters and nothing happened except a dip in my popularity. I haven't noticed this before as I've never played as a Roman faction.

There is a way around this however, as you could use a basic short script to trigger a civil war. If you haven't tried scripting yet read this excellent tutorial: https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showthread.php?t=46738

Once you have created your first short script you can open it and replace the contents with something like this:

script
console_command diplomatic_stance romans_julii romans_brutii war
console_command diplomatic_stance romans_julii romans_scipii war
console_command diplomatic_stance romans_julii romans_senate war
console_command diplomatic_stance romans_brutii romans_julii war
console_command diplomatic_stance romans_brutii romans_scipii war
console_command diplomatic_stance romans_brutii romans_senate war
console_command diplomatic_stance romans_scipii romans_julii war
console_command diplomatic_stance romans_scipii romans_brutii war
console_command diplomatic_stance romans_scipii romans_senate war
console_command diplomatic_stance romans_senate romans_julii war
console_command diplomatic_stance romans_senate romans_brutii war
console_command diplomatic_stance romans_senate romans_scipii war
end_script

I tried this script yesterday, it does work and also brings up the 'outlawed by senate' message. The downside is you have to trigger it yourself.

the correct script for that is :

script
console_command diplomatic_stance romans_julii romans_senate war
console_command diplomatic_stance romans_brutii romans_senate war
console_command diplomatic_stance romans_scipii romans_senate war
console_command diplomatic_stance romans_senate romans_julii war
console_command diplomatic_stance romans_senate romans_brutii war
console_command diplomatic_stance romans_senate romans_scipii war
end_script

because only the senate is a superfaction the ai plays crazy if yor put the other lines in too. When you use it so,
the senate and all the other roman factions are still at war with each other.
Also all the roman factions are outlawed. That workes im tested it

Im still dont know the code to trigger that after a historic_event ? do somebody knows that code ???

[AmbrosiusAurelianus]

I´m not quite sure I get what you want. Do you want to make a phalanx unit use its sword? Nothing simpler than that, switch off phalanx mode and give them an order to attack, they´ll use swords automatically. Or do you not want them to use any swords at all?

Neither, mate! You said that "another thing about the fake phalanx .... is that it doesn´t use secondary weapons or if the unit has a secondary weapon it will only use that, and never the phalanx spears" That's why I wrote that it was "a real shame that such units (I meant the "fake phalanxes" - sorry, I was unclear there) only use the sword if equipped with a secondary weapon."

Sorry for the crossed wires. I combined two thoughts rather clumsily in one sentence.

I want long pike equipped units to be able to run in formation like the short pikes do in BI, but unfortunately they cannot - that's all. Thanks for your help anyway.

[Sir Dinadan]

Sorry if this has been posted but can you get marian reforms running it through the BI exe? Wondering because the descr_strat of BI has these two lines.

marian_reforms_disabled
gladiator_uprising_disabled

And does this line mess up the senate?

rebelling_characters_active