The Will of the Senate - Senate Deliberations III

[Dutch_guy]

Conscript fathers,

It seems that this senate is as divided as it has ever been, saving ones dignitas and honor seems to be more of an issue than driving the Seleucid, Thracian, Ptolmaic and Carthaginian hordes out of this world. Our enemy's must be mightily pleased, I bet their agents are sitting around enjoying our brothels and foods while we do their work for them, on the senate floor itself !

Good to know it is, that our esteemed senators Numerius and Verginius are willing to have a duel - yes a duel ! - at the time when our eastern front is being over-run, our co consul has died and our enemy's are more powerful than ever !

Good to know that such people wield so much influence at this moment of crisis!

What am I trying to say, one might ask ?. Well it should be clear, I urge the senators Verginius, Numerius and even Aemilius to put aside their petty arguments - for that is what they are in light of the current events - and join forces to humiliate our enemy's as we did Pyrrhus years before !

Is this so much to ask, Senators ?

For the people, the legions, and the Republic I for one hope it is not...

[econ21]

[NUMERIUS AUREOLUS]: Do not worry, First Consul and Senator Flavius Pacuvius, I have no intention of duelling Senator Verginius. He is game enough, but I fear at his age he may do himself an injury and my dear wife Lucilla, his daughter, would never forgive me if that happened.

I must, however, parry the latest verbal thrusts taken at my good name. The charges that I am personally responsible for the declarations of war on us by Egypt and Seleucia are made no less objectionable by the fact that I am currently tasked with guarding the exposed part of our Republic. I cannot let the accusations reach the ears of my men without them first being exposed for the ignorant and hyperbolic rants they are.

Senator Marcellus Aemilius seeks to strike the first renewed blow against me. I see that you are unbecoming of any charity from me. If you aspire one day to lead this Republic, you really should keep up with current events.

Let me make this simple for you. Of course, an offensive was directed at Philippi. It was led by the late Co-Consul Publius Pansa while the town was held by Macedon in Spring 258. I led an offensive against Debeltos, also held by Macedon, in Spring 257. The former offensive - along with those at Ratiaria and Bylazora - led us to border Ptolemy. I submit that it was the creation of a land border that ultimately led to Ptolemy's declaration of war in Spring 256. Debeltos came later and so was irrelevant to the fatal creation of a land border - we already had one. As I say, all Lower House members have the otherworldly means to test this. We need not debate it further here.

Nor will I argue at length with you about Seleucia as you seem incapable of maintaining two distinct arguments in your head. You confuse the reasons for war with Seleucia and Ptolemy. I only mentioned Maronia as a possible casus belli with Seleucia, not with Ptolemy. Suffice it to say, our only land border with Seleucia was not due to any settlement I have taken (Byzantion borders Greek held land, not Seleucid). Rather, the border was at Maronia which was taken by Co-Consul Publius Pansa.

As to my oldest accuser, Senator Verginius, I thank you for finding my words and reading them aloud so all the Senate can hear that they did not call for war with Egypt.

The first quote merely foretells the lightning offensive we did conduct to drive Egypt from Europe after she so pefidiously - but so predictably - attacked us.

The second quote, about Byzantion, was also prescient. Do you deny that the two successor states, now both at war with us, combine to pose a greater challenge than Carthage or Thrace? And if they do, is not walled Byzantion the best pace to hold them? Or would you have them freely ranging inland to Tylis, Ratiara, Bylazora and beyond? And if we wish first to consolidate, to deal with Carthage, the natural place to hold the successor states at bay is at the Bosphorus straits. You do not quote it, but I vaguely recall making an analogy between the straits and the Massilia ford. If I did not, I should do so now - we may hold the east at bay across the straits for many years, much as we did the Gauls across the Massilia ford. That is why retaking Maronia is the first step to restoring our position in the East. But Byzantion is by far the stronger half of the line.

Thank you also, Senator Verginius, for reading stories of my victories, I am flattered by your interest. But please you must remember not to believe everything you read.

[TinCow]

Out of respect for my friend Lucius Aemlius, I shall refrain from further comments on this matter until the present danger has past. However, I will only hold my tongue so long as Senator Aureolus pursues a course of action that will aid in stabilizing our fractured borders. If he once again tries to further stretch our resources or create further wars, not even Jupiter himself will be able to silence me.

[econ21]

[NUMERIUS AUREOLUS]: I am grateful to Senator Verginius for his forebearance. If Senator Marcellus Aemilius wishes to return to the argument - he may take a free punch at me; I will not retaliate. I too will consider this matter closed for now; I really must get back to the front.

Cornelius Saturninus is right - the situation there is even more severe than one might imagine. Maronia is not within a season's march of Byzantion and so avenging the Co-Consul will not be easily achieved. We must trust to the strategic brilliance of our First Consul and the fighting spirit of our men to see us through this crisis.

[Braden]

Senators of the Republic,

I have rested and regained my composure but it is true that I will not forget the death of such a Hero of Rome, one whom I looked up to and admired as a personal Hero for many years.

However, I agree that the remaining Co-Consul shall take full Consulship as of now and for the remainder of his term. I believe his used of the term “Dictator” is somewhat misguided.

Has anyone considered withdrawal? If the Consul AND notable members of the Senate believe we are overstretched what shame is there then in withdrawing to a point more defensible?

It is, perhaps, the last of all options but one I firmly believe we should allow the Consul to do should he feel it is required.

Please Senators let the Consul hear your voice on this matter, he must know that even such a distasteful act as withdrawing is still acceptable in a dire situation as this.

Currently it is good that we have a Consular army awaiting deployment and I agree that it should stay in Italia until we know more of the Carthenaginian intent as well as the Selucids. However, I strongly feel that WHATEVER the cost we will have to raise two more Legions to support the Eastern Front even if we do withdraw from the current predicament.

If we can, it would be prudent to re-enforce Byzantion if possible, it is a defensible city with high walls and potentially can withstand an assault by an enemy more than twice the defenders numbers, however, I am unaware of what infrastructure is in place there. It would be essential at this time though to hire as many mercenaries as is possible before the Selucids arrive.

I would dearly love to review the tactical situation to the South in more detail also, what is happening in Melite now? How fairs the Legion in Sicily, are they ready for Carthage?

[Lucjan]

It saddens me to see the situation develop into what it has. And even more so to see that those responsible will not accept the consequences of their poor foresight.

After careful thought, I care not for what has led us up to this event, I can only say what I feel must be done now.

I will no longer listen to the foolish words of an ignorant madman. My own father, Manius Aemilius, has more sense and wisdom than the bloodlusted and logicless Numerius Aureolus. I dare call that man a coward and a thief. As only cowards would not accept responsability for the consequences their actions bring, and only thieves would steal a dark moment such as this in an attempt to divide the senate. I do not care what personal gain Aureolus had or has to hold Byzantium or to have taken Debeltos, but send him there. Send him to Byzantion. Let him wallow in the mess he has created.

In the meantime, I suggest the Republic take a serious breath. We have overexpanded beyond the limits of our own ability to maintain a military supply line, to support our territories monetarily, to trade profitably, and to defend Rome as a whole.

I would advocate the serious consideration of territorial withdrawel. Let Numerius hold Byzantion till his dieing days if he wishes, but the Republic must consolidate its gains. My personal advisors and I have discussed this in length, and we feel that the best course for a withdrawal would involve maintaining the Roman frontier of Gergovia and Comata in the west, holding Luvavum in the north, and making a full, uncompromised withdrawal in the east to create a new, more defensable frontier. A new eastern frontier consisting of Aquilaia, Segestica, Delmatia, Skodra, Antigonea, Appollonia and Thermon would provide the Republic a much more defensible, if not greatly reduced, frontier in the east. After the infrastructure and internal defense capabilities of the Republic are significantly increased on a widespread scale could we hope to reclaim the abandoned territory, if that is still the wish of the senate at such a time.

I have made many, many proposals over my short time as a senator, and the vast majority of them, in hindsight, would have saved the Republic many defeats, many disgraces, and many Roman lives. But unforetunatly the greed of certain men would not allow my proposals to acquire enough support. Perhaps now, with disaster after disaster befalling Rome due to the ill judgement of these men, things may be seen in a different light by those who are still unsure of their position. I know where I stand. Rome must consolidate, it must rebuild the armies, it must provide a solid frontier, it must restore trade, it must greatly increase its infrastructure, it must become profitable and a source of pride for its people again.

....because Rome as a whole has spent far too long in desperate wars. We have spent far too long leaving peace at the mercy of our neighbors. We may be forced to defend our borders, but we are not forced to cause our people the same suffering our soldiers endure in the peoples' name. Open your eyes to logic. Mars is not the only god. There are many gods who Rome could be glorious in its worship of as well, and these gods are gods of peace.

[Braden]

Senator Servius Aemilius,

What exasperates our situation is that to date, none of those neighbours around us have accepted ANY motions of Peace.

Long and hard have our diplomats worked and only very recently have we managed to secure some form of agreement with another nation…..that of Germainia.

Whilst your call for peace is a prudent and needed one, I have to say that even at my young age I am jaded with the diplomatic situation around us and do not hold any hope for a negotiated ceasefire of any sort, even if we DO withdraw and leave an unoccupied buffer between ourselves and the Selucids.

They have smelt our blood and I do not believe they will relinquish, what they perceive is an advantage of military might.

However, your call for Senator Numerius Aureolus to be posted to Byzantion finds a place in my heart. Whatever has caused our Republic to reach this stage is immaterial and many blame Senator Aureolus…….personally, I do not, the vote was open…and the Senate voted.

Hind-sight leads us to place blame but the true blame lays with ALL those who voted in truth. That said, with Senator Aureolus’s insistence that he will be most capable against the Selucids, I agree with you and also call that if possible, he be sent to hold Byzantion at any cost!

If he can draw the attention of the giant, then we may yet have time to rebuild our legions and develop our cities so we can secure a more defensible frontier in the East.

The trouble is that we are in peril not only in the East but also from the direction of Thrace AND Carthage. Whilst I feel we can deal with Carthage aggression swiftly as they are closer to us the situation to our North East and East is a difficult one to rectify.

This will not occur over night and if Senator Aureolus can buy the Republic sufficient time to do this, then perhaps he will have redeemed himself in the eyes of his accusers?

Let it not be said though that I blame him, nor that I have forgotten that the Selucids have…..unprovoked…..taken a personal hero from me. I will have my flesh from the Selucids backs one day….but I have grown to understand I have a great many years ahead of me to do this.

[econ21]

[NUMERIUS AUREOLUS]: Senators, I would like to share with you some private correspondence I perhaps should have revealed earlier, although I fear it would have been lost amid in the recriminations.

Immediately upon hearing of the outbreak of the battle of Maronia, I despatched a messenger to Co-Consul Publius Pansa, in my arrogance presuming to give him tactical advice on the battle. Unfortunately, my rider arrived too late and the reply I received came not from the now dead Co-Consul, but from his killer, General Molon.

It read:

To the Roman Senator "Numerius"

Ah, Numerius the Pretty boy, I've heard about you. They say the people round here regard you as some kind of conquering hero. Then again, they said the same about Publius Pansa and his reputation didn't help him.

He took a long time to die mind you, took most of my bodyguard with him. I didn't have much horse to start with, but he had even less. And his men, well, they fought bravely - not a single Roman ran away, every last one fought till he died. Very admirable.

I look forward to meeting your acquintance on the battlefield.

Molon

Perhaps the Senate will share the shock, revulsion and outrage I felt upon hearing this message. If Senator Verginius detected a note of vanity in my declaring that I would kill Molon and I would liberate Maronia, perhaps he will now understand that I was sorely provoked by this thing, Molon.

But Senators, after long and careful reflection, I have decided that my initial reaction was right. I must immediately march on Maronia with Legio V to challenge the Seleucid invaders. Moreover, I will need every man I can find and so should abandon Byzantion completely.

Surely there is no Senator in this House who does not now understand that there are two gates - landbridges - from Asia Minor to Europe. One is at Maronia; the other at Byzantion. It serves us nothing to keep one gate closed, if the enemy can freely walk through the other. Legio V is too small to both garrison unruly Byzantion and confront the Seleucids. Therefore, the city must be left to its own devices. Perhaps the best outcome would be for it to rebel. Alternatively, it may fall to the Greeks who oppose it across the straits. It matters not.

What matters now is that the current Seleucid breach of the straits be plugged. If it is not, within a season, multiple Seleucid armies will flood through into Europe, threatening our settlements at Philippi, Bylazora, Ratiaria, Debeltos and Tylis. Once they are out in the open, we will not be able to cover all our territory and we will be exposed.

I am the man to try to plug the breach. Not because I am the best man, but because I am the only man. Praetor Coruncanius is the next closest at Tylis, but he is too far away from Maronia and needed to confront Thrace to the north. Legio V is the only formation close enough and free to confront Seleucia. And I am the only general who is close enough to lead Legio V.

Senators, I have communicated the above to the First Consul. I have requested that I be sent to the plains outside Maronia, there to await the attack of General Abscanthius or General Molon or both. The First Consul has not replied and I will acquiesce to his decision regardless. But I make this statement so that the Senate can better understand the current crisis.

[flyd]

Lucius, it seems like you have passed up an opportunity to engage the Seleucids in an open field battle south of Tylis. Ok, fine, but if I end up having to dislodge a large number of the bastards from a city, you owe me five bottles of the finest wine!

[Death the destroyer of worlds]

Their numbers were too great for even your legendary skill. I am hoping they will take the city, split up and leave a garrison. Then we will turn the tables and attack them with a Consular-strength army. Let's see how they like those figs

[Death the destroyer of worlds]

I have corrected the remaining errors in my last reports. I still await news of tribune Quintus Libo.

[Mount Suribachi]

It appears Quintus Libo has won a legendary victory! I await with anticipation news of how he pulled off such a remarkable feat.

[Braden]

Firstly Senators, I have to report that I am very happy to have left my education and I am able to now serve the Republic in a fuller capacity as a Governor.

Now, has Quintus Libo won against the Selucids? If so, this is great news as my studies indicated that they will be our greatest foe by far.

Numerius Aureolus, I would not be happy should Byzantion be abandoned. Much was vaunted prior to its occupation and much invested in that venture. Whilst I understand your appraisal of the tactical situation I am not so convinced that what you propose is the best recourse, the Consul has been working hard these few past seasons and whilst we cannot oppose the Selucids just yet, I feel we now have the groundings that will allow us to do so very soon and that we have more time than you advise.

You advise that there are too bridges across the straits but propose to abandon one of them?? Surely it would make tactical sense to remain stationed where one such bridge exists so that the other commanders and the Consul will know where the next threat will come from?

[econ21]

[NUMERIUS AUREOLUS]: Your words are wise, Senator Manius Coruncanius. As you will gather from the First Consul's report and the accounts of my battles, when I last spoke, the First Consul had already decided that the time was not right to confront the Seleucids around Maronia. Instead, Legio V remains based at Byzantion, securing the city while also capable of acting aggressively.

Praetor Coruncanius and Cornelius Saturnius are moving to drive the Seleucids away from Tylis. If our sea blockade of the straits had been effective, I would have welcomed the opportunity to retake Maronia. However, with the Seleucids still capable of crossing over from Asia, Legio V will probably have to remain guarding Byzantion until the situation has stabilised.

We will have to see if the Seleucids continue to rely on the Maronia landbridge to enter Europe or whether they try to also take the Byzantion one. Needless to say, Legio V is ready for them if they try to take the city.

[Braden]

I agree Senator Aureolus,

Maronia is untenable at this time but I feel that a strongly placed Legion as you are will be better served in Byzantion as it continues to channel the Selucids into and through a knonw location - somewhere they can be ambushed and encounted on our terms.

Congratulations are in order for your Raid by the way. I have no favour of burning settlements but both our current lack of funds and the actions of the Selucids left us no option. It was a shame we were not in a position to fully commit to a blockade that would have meant that devil-dog Molon was isolated.

Perhaps it might be tactically prudent to do the same again once we have legions in place to fully close the Maronia land-bridge as the straits are a very defensible border.

[Braden]

Senators,

I know I have not been in attendance as much as I would have liked but have I missed something here?

I was recently and briefly in “command” of the new Consular army, Legio II Sabina Quintia, and I heard from many in that army that they were to embark shortly for Afrika.

Have we had this discussed? I realise that certain tactical nuances are the pre-occupation of the Consul but isn’t a full scale invasion of a major landmass something that would have been normally discussed in the Senate?

Really, I ask the main question: Is this to be an invasion of occupation or a “raid”?

With our Eastern flank so pressed wouldn’t a Consular army be better deployed to that theatre of war and a Legion size army be assigned to “raid” Carthenaginian North Afrika?

[Lucjan]

Senator Coruncanius, when there are consular sized Carthaginian armies in Melite and Sardinia, and our information relays that there are no less than an additional 10,000 active, and mobile Carthaginian soldiers in Afrika, moving the second Consular army to the east would not mean perhaps the loss of one or two cities whose conquest was ill-thought to begin with, as the current situation with the Seleucids and Byzantion goes. It would place the entire western half of the Republic in dire circumstances. Need I remind you that Rome is in the west, not the east. The second consular army is required in the west. To send it abroad would be the death knell of Rome. Now I don't know about you senator, but I will not be the one to blow that horn.

[TinCow]

We need armies, Senators. In order to raise sufficient armies for the wars on all our fronts, we will require vast sums of money. Money that has now been denied to us by the lack of trade with Seleucia and Ptolemy. The armies will bleed themselves to death in victory if we cannot restore the Republic to internal prosperity. Yet, Rome no longer has the resources with which to provide this domestic development. The cities of Carthage are close and their wealth is vast. A strike into the heart of the Punic lands will cripple one foe and give us the means with which to defeat all of the others. We must take Carthage and use her wealth towards victory in the East.

[Lucjan]

A messenger enters the senate and slips quietly through to senator Servius, presenting him with a message and swiftly taking leave. Servius stands.

Forgive me, but it seems I must attend to some urgent personal business.

At that, he dismisses himself from the senate proceedings, but not before ordering the guards to allow messengers bearing his seal into the senate floor.

[Dooz]

{Cornelius Saturninus}

Senators, indeed we need gold to fill our war chest as our current economic situation is desperate to say the least. But I fear a full scale invasion and occupation of Africa would be a disaster. In order to successfully organize and complete a campaign of that magnitude, we need a large surplus to begin with. The deserts are a harsh and unforgiving place, I fear our men and leaders are not used to them and can be taken advantage of by the Carthaginians. As already pointed out, they have tens of thousands of troops just waiting for a few foolish legions to come into their grasp.

Mark my words noble Senators of Rome, any general and army under him we send to Africa with the intention of conquering the whole of the place and occupying it, will never return.

Instead, I propose an alternative. Instead of trying to conquer all their cities, sending our legions on a futile campaign through the vast deserts on overly long, hard, exhausting marches where they will be isolated and destroyed, let us concentrate our forces and only take a few key Carthaginian cities. Utica, Carthago, Hadrumentum and Thapsus are our best targets; coastline cities, bring in more wealth than the hovels deep in the desert, and can be more easily defensed and reinforced.


Numbered in order of priority for our initial invasion.

These cities and their surrounding provinces have all the resources we could need, and well established roads and ports to transport them and generate wealth.

After having established a secure foothold and replenishing our forces as necessary, we can look towards expansion if we feel the need to do so. Hippo Regius would be the next good target at this point. Perhaps we could take Lepcis Magna as well, but I fear it is too isolated for our own good, and may not even be worth it in terms of production and income. I see Servius Aemilius is on his way there, and would urge the Consul to reconsider this action. It would be more prudent to send a fresh legion into the more heavily defensed heart of the north-east Carthaginian provinces.


Possible further expansion towards Hippo Regius. Lepcis Magna, a more dangerous gamble.

Senators, I urge you all to listen to reason here. There is no point in sending our men further into the desert than necessary, at least not right from the get go. We must first take their coastline, and be able to hold on to it. We should leave thier north-western coastline open however, to give them incentive to escape our coming wrath and perhaps mount an invasion into Iberia. In any case, the plan I've outlined will likely give us the gold we need to continue our existence as the most powerful nation on earth.

Bear in mind, we need many men to be able to occupy even just the area I've mentioned. The Carthaginian retaliation will be swift and heavy-handed. We must be prepared.

[TinCow]

I fully concur with Cornelius Saturninus, we must be very careful in this venture. We must sieze the jewels of their cities and milk all we can from them in slaves, silver, and resources. Let us take Carthago, Utica, Hadrumentum, Thapsus, and perhaps Hippo Regius. We shall put Carthago herself to the sack and spoils will be vast indeed. The rest we shall enslave and all we shall occupy. These are not poor Gallic provinces to be plundered and abandoned. These are rich territories that will benefit their owners greatly in the long-run.

We must gather all the forces we can for this attack. The East must be given the men necessary to maintain borders, but all surpluses must be immediately allocated to landing two full Consular sized armies in Africa within seasons of one another. Only with two full forces of this size can we hope to conquer and hold these territories. One may strike west along the coast and the other south. In this way they will support each others' flanks and protect the inner cities of Carthago and Hadrumentum from attack. Even if those cities are besieged, their walls can hold for long enough for the main force to return for their rescue. In this way, two armies under two generals could take and hold all the resources necessary to bring victory in the East.

[Dooz]

{Cornelius Saturninus}

I appreciate your support noble Verginius, however I don't believe only two legions are sufficient to hold the East. I am currently near the hot zone and have reports of large armies looming ahead. I believe at least three full legions are necessary, maybe an oversized one too. Four legions holding the fort in the east would be perfect if we had the resources, in a perfect world. But of course I understand we are pressed for money and men so three would be sufficient. As already noted, we need to send all the men we can to be successful in Afrika.

[Dutch_guy]

I fully agree with what Cornelius Saturninus and Verginius have said, one thing, however, worries me. I would like the exact details of what we're up against, up to the last Carthaginian Peasant. Is there any chance we could order our agents to infiltrate the Carthaginian troop recruiting settlements? Or for that matter all the settlements which we hope to take ?

I'm of the opinion that we aren't using our agents enough and to their maximum ability. We should sabotage their military buildings and temples, take out their generals and captains before a fight, and make our spies brief us of our enemies strength and troop location. Spying, Sabotage and assassination may not be the most honorable way to wage a war, but if we put our Roman agents to work who knows how many lives we could save ?

[Glaucus]

Cornelius Saturninus, those were my thoughts exactly. Not only are those cities close, they are Carthage's most important. Once these are taken, it will not take much to hold them since Carthage's main source of income will have been captured. This plan permentatly cripples Carthage, keeps our forces out of the desert, and provides the much needed income.

[GeneralHankerchief]

As seen with Gaul, factions that are not finished completely will re-emerge at some point. In this case, if we drive the Carthaginians off the coast they will be far from finished. If we are not careful, Senators, we could be facing a situation worse than Massilia Ford in a number of years.

In this case, I think a two-stage attack would be most prudent. Meaning that we first knock out the cities on the coast such as Carthago and Utica. Once they are ours, we pause from conquering. Pacify our conquests, and Romanize them, while still keeping our forces in the region. Then, after this has been done, send the legions to conquer the rest of the cities in the desert and finish off the Carthaginians.

Regarding the placement of my nephew Servius and his legion, I believe that Lepcis Magna was chosen for the precise reason that some senators are complaining about it - it is far away from the main body of Carthaginians. I believe that this expedition was designed to cause some movement in the forces west of Carthago, drawing them east and thus making it an easier time for the main force which is to eventually land.

[TinCow]

To clarify, Senators, I do not propose sending two legions. I propose sending two full sized Consular armies; forces as large as logistics allow us to maintain in one body. We already have one fully formed and ready in Italy and a second is being fast created. Yes, Carthage has many men in arms, but we will be able to face their armies on equal terms. Though they outnumber us, proper strategic movements should allow us to engage and destroy each of their formations individually.

It is certainly a risk, but it is one worth taking. If we are to make an expedition to Africa at all, it must take such a prize to ensure our victory in the East. Only minor plunder will simply be a waste of men and resources that could be better diverted elsewhere. We must strike decisively or we must not strike at all.

[Dooz]

{Cornelius Saturninus}

Senators, I write to you from Tylis. Yes, it is once again in our hands. The people are subdued and happy after the battle, but a small garrisson could not hurt. I hope word reaches Consul Aemilius soon so that I may be on my way from here and take on the real menace from the east, Molon.

[Braden]

Senators, it seems there are many questions presented here and I would like to add my thoughts to each one…..

Senator Servius Aemilius,

Whilst I agree that we need a force in the West to defend our homes, I was questioning the Consuls proposal for that “defending force” to be sent out to Afrika.

As you state “To send it abroad would be the death knell of Rome”, if you stand by those words then the Consular army embarked would remain in Rome. Does not Carthage count as “abroad”?

My position is that I do not wish to see a Consular army unused; however, I feel that the Selucids are the greater military threat.

Senator Augustus Verginius,

I have to fully agree with you, a concentrated strike at the heartlands of Carthage will enable us to have slaves for population and funds for building much needed infrastructure. My main point was that such a large undertaking would normally have been previously discussed in the Senate.

I grow alarmed at the Consuls use of the word “Dictator” and that he was appearing to take the title to heart.

Also, can we be sure we can cripple Carthage by taking these cities? What do our spies say of the Carthenaginian forces posted further afield, could they be used to retake their cities?

Senator Cornelius Saturninus,

I also agree with your tactical assessment. If we are to invade and both cripple Carthage as well as line our treasury, we must concentrate on their most profitable and developed cities.

The two main ones are even Walled cities, Carthago and Hadrumentum, which means that when the Carthage reprisal starts we will have sturdy defence from which to withstand the storm that will come.

From the Maps presented by you their cities seem excessively UN-defended. I find this strange and perhaps worrying….where are their armies?

Senator Augustus Verginius,

I partly agree with your proposed tactics, strike and take several key cities and sack Carthago…..however, I would perhaps only hold Utica, Thapsus and Hippo Regius until the situation calls for our forces to withdraw. Withdraw to Hadrumentum perhaps.

Obviously ONLY if the Carthenaginians manage to mobilise fully against us. In that situation I would think it prudent for the Consul to withdraw to a more concentrated area and perhaps even into the Walled City.

Senator Cornelius Saturninus,

On your second point, this is why I was alarmed about the mobilisation of the Consular army to the West rather than the East. We NEED more men in the East more desperately than the West.

My own tactical analysis indicates that we require FOUR Legions in the East PLUS an occupying force in Byzantion – Two legions to the North East to secure our frontier with Thrace and two MOBILE legions to strike effectively against the Selucids, these can be re-enforced from Byzantion when required, hence the requirement of the occupying force.

We could make do with three IF the Thracians remain coo-coo’d and unwilling to venture against us in force.

Senator Flavius Pacuvius,

Agreed; we have an experienced spy in the area and we need more information. Whilst the garrisons appear small I am particularly worried as to the were-abouts of the vast number of Carthenginian forces and how long it would take them to respond to an invasion.

It will take TWO seasons as a minimum to storm a walled City. IF we land TWO Consular armies right next to Carthago and Hadrumentum it will be two seasons until we can take them and be safe behind their walls.

Are the Carthage armies more than two seasons march away?

If we propose to take the other cities which are unwalled we will require even more time before the enemy reacts.

This is a dangerous game but if we only take those two main cities I would consider such an expedition a success.

Senator Marcellus Aemilius,

On your comparison to Gaul; I agree with you also, though I do not believe the Consul considers a time that we will be able to withdraw our forces from Afrika. Senators, understand this that IF this invasion goes ahead we will have opened a new front AND those forces we send will NOT be returning for many, many years. It is also quite possible that should we move to Lepcis Magna we will further encounter the Egyptians!

Consider this carefully and understand the FULL commitment we are making in the long term.

Senator Augustus Verginius,

And finally, I believe that we do need a full TWO Consular armies to perform this task BUT I also believe what has been proposed is too much.

A Consular army is already embarked…..will they remain in danger, in their ships, awaiting the 2nd Consular army?

I firmly believe that we DO need two forces to strike at Carthage however, those two forces can be smaller IF they are placed correctly.

If we can land in or near the bay of Carthago two forces can strike and take both Carthago and Hadrumentum in Two seasons. Then I believe the situation should be re-assessed.

We can plan now to take more settlements, utterly cripple the Carthenginians BUT to plan too far is inherently wrong Sir!

We need, nay must, strike at Carthage and strike hard but we must also consider that their great forces will not stand by whilst we move further. A quick strike against their two greatest cities is possible to work as they appear lightly defended.

Enslave their peoples and pillage their craven temples for money but then watch to the East for their Armies. To plan further is folly indeed for could a even a Consular army withstand 10,000 Carthenginian warriors striking in a co-ordinated manner against one of these cities……..

….even if they do not manage to mobilise and we take one or two of the other cities? These lesser cities are unwalled and again I say that we will not be able and should not be prepared to bleed our armies to defend them.

So, I support this venture only IF the goals are not set beyond the first two seasons. I support an invasion of Afrika and the taking of Carthago AND Hadrumentum but nothing more until we know what our enemy will do next.

All this is also not considering what Carthage’s Navy will do! They can blockade our forces into Afrika or even sink our fleets and utterly trap our armies.

I do not know, whilst I support this venture all I can see is danger at every turn and our best hope is a swift and hard strike and well made preparations to withdraw from Afrika completely should the situation warrant it.

I must apologise for the long speech but much is to be considered and there is much danger for our Republic.

[Lucjan]

Senator Servius Aemilius is not attending the current proceedings, as he is away on campaign and cannot be reached, however, he has left his freeman clerk here to deal with matters of his estate and...a few other duties too.

Servius's Freeman Clerk - Senator Coruncanius, I'm not quite sure what it is you're asking. First, you said you were "questioning" the consuls proposal to send the consular force in Rome to Afrika...this emplies that you don't agree with it. Then you go on to say that my master has told you sending the consular army abroad would be the death knell of rome, but also ask "isn't Carthage abroad?" Now, this confuses me...It seems that you, while first questioning the reasoning behind a proposal to attack Carthage with the consular army, then turn around and question the reasoning for not doing so. The freeman mumbles something about Coruncanii fools. Eh...let me put this simply for you.

My master's direct feelings on the matter, as he has expressed them to me, is that the Consular army should be used to defend the west. Yes, Reinforcements in the east are in dire need. BUT, our current information tells us three things. 1 - Carthage has already landed consular sized armies on Sardinia and Malta. 2 - There are six Carthaginian armies of the same size, and one of half this size, within a seasons march of the city of Carthage itself. Possibly more on the other side of the mountains, but our spy near Carthage hasn't moved in quite some time, and is unable to determine the Carthaginian strength beyond the armies I have mentioned, as they passed through the province he currently resides in only one, maybe two seasons ago. 3 - No matter who commands it, no matter who thinks they are wise and capable enough to do so. There is no man amongst this senate that could fight, and win, a battle against six and half battle hardened Carthigian armies. Thinking you could outmaneouver them would be foolish. They will surround our armies, two, maybe three of theirs against our one. Any expedition to the heartlands of Carthage would be failed, futile, and place the western half of the Republic at the mercy of Carthage. In this way, we would be sitting in Rome, waiting for Carthage to land its armies on our shores in two, maybe three seasons. It would be the death knell of Rome.

I am unaware of exactly what plans my master has set out to do, as, quite clearly, he is on campaign and cannot be reached. But until his return, perhaps three, four seasons from now, perhaps 3 or four years from now, I cannot say. I will speak in these proceedings in his stead, and relay any information I receive from him to the senate.

[Braden]

It is obvious that my many answers have confused. I was questioning what exactly your master, Senator Servius Aemilius wanted to do with this situation as it wasn’t clear to me that he was definitively against an invasion of Carthage.

You have made it quite clear that he is at this time. However, I do not like the thought of an unused Consul army, it is a waste of coin and manpower. Our armies must earn there keep.

Perhaps your master would propose a campaign with the new Consul army to expel those Carthaginian forces who have landed in Sardinia and Malta? Certainly a noble plan in the short term, one that does not earn us any coin or slaves but there is nothing inherently “wrong” with such a proposal.

As for my questioning of the Consul, I was mainly questioning the way he unilaterally has started this undertaking, not that the undertaking itself is questionable…..only the methods of its inception.

Six and a Half full armies you say? Well, in view of that a direct strike at Carthago and the surrounding area does indeed seem folly…..I will have to visit a physician, it seems I cannot see them on the maps provided earlier.

Perhaps the Consul proposes a Raid on Lepcis Magna? It would not bring much profit and would perhaps prompt a heavy response from Carthage herself.

So, to clarify. IF, the forces built up against us in Carthage are of this magnitude I cannot see a venture, even with TWO Consular armies, succeeding. Such an undertaking would require two Consular armies AND two legions in support. We are certainly NOT at a juncture where we can afford such a thing.

Now then, where does that leave the Republic and, indeed, my own position? It leaves us with a Consul army in Ships awaiting deployment somewhere…..they say Afrika……I, now, hope this is untrue!

Using the new Consular army to expel the Carthaginians from our Islands perhaps? Does not a Consular army appear “excessive” for this purpose?

So, this leads me to again believe that the best place for a Consular army is the East! However, I will accept that we also need defence in the West and for our homes to which a force of Two Legions will be sufficient and once they are raised the new Consular army can move to the East and expel the Selucids.

To be honest, I await the Consuls comments on what he is actually proposing here as now I am confused.