Jagged Alliance 2 Gold

[Bob the Insane]

Edit: ***Note anyone considering getting Jagged Alliance 2 should read the whole thread which can be summerised as "the Steam version sucks, don't waste your money one it!"****


I just picked this up on Steam last night and was subquently up to 2am!!

I have no idea how I missed this the first time around, any fans of this out there?

If there are then where can I find the instructions? I didn't get any with the Steam download so I am operating in the dark a little...

What blast though, the fire fights are actually quite tense though I have not lost anyone yet, everyone has been wounded in my happy band of rookie mercs...

I have completed the "quests" to find the rebels and get them supplies. I have also explored the town run by Kingpin and have rescued a guy's sister from a whorehouse and hooked up with the local arms dealer. I have taken out a few patrols but I am a little stuck as what to do next...

[econ21]

Jagged Alliance 2 is one of the absolute best games made ever.

The basic squad-level tactical combat has not been bettered. I'm replaying Fallout Tactics right now and it is ok, but just not a patch on JA2. The open strategic layer of JA2 (economy, recruitment, quests, city conquests etc) is a wonderful way of hanging the battles together. It is kind of like Total War in that respect - mixing the tactical and strategic levels in a very successful way. And the game just oozes character and atmosphere from the moment you load up your laptop and the screen fades seamlessly into the strategic interface. It is jaw-droppingly good. (And Deidranna can never slap Elliott enough for it not to be funny).

You have done well rescuing Maria - here's some spoilers about what else to do in Kingpin's town:

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

have you given the deed to the gay shopkeeper? And you given the porno tape to the lesbian bothering Hans? That opens up the best gundealer, Tony. You also want to do the fighting quest with Kingpin around 11pm - I recommend hiring Bull for it and drugging him up with energy boosts (save after each bout - it's buggy).

I guess you have taken the SAM near Drassen to open up the airport so you can buy stuff from Bobby Ray's? It also opens up the helicopter. I recommend travelling by helicopter - it is fast and you can sleep on the way, arriving refreshed for the battle without running into patrols etc. The one bad thing about JA2 is that you actually fight as an "anti-guerilla" - ie I hide out in the towns, protected by militias, and let Deidranna's men patrol the rural areas. In reality, it should be the other way around. To find the helicopter pilot:

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

Ask locals and they will give a clue to which swamp he is in. He is in the marshes near Drassen.

What I do next is take the SAM on the west and then the town north of it (Chitzena?). After that, I go back and take out Kingpin. He has a valuable stash of cash - that and the fight winnings will pay for most of your offensive (I recommend Scope). I then head for Cambria, which is a major town with a hospital and quite a few sidequests (talk to people). After that, I go for Alma.

I'd also recommend fighting at night with a team of mainly night ops fighters - it makes the battles much easier.

[Bob the Insane]

Thanks...

I have found myself an FAQ/guide but I am trying to aviod the spoilers and just look at "the how" of playing the game...

Fight at night? With my bunch of cowboys? It's just like the A-Team in there and the only think keeping us going to the inherent crappiness of the bad guys...

I saw some notes about Jagged Alliance 3 on Gamespot...

http://www.mistgames.ru/eng/projects.php?project_id=2


Additionally, any hints on what "Normal Guns" or "Load of Guns" and "Realistic" or "Sci-fi" setting control?

[Husar]

Hey, you found the best tactical game I ever played and apart from Total War one of the few round-based games I really like.

I always chose lots of guns, so I don´t know what less guns means, but if you choose Sci-fi, then monsters can appear in mines and you have to kill them to get money, I tried it once and it seemed pretty hard.

[econ21]

You want Loads of Guns - basically it gives you access to the Warsaw Pact armory as well as the NATO stuff. It's just more variety and it also tends to mean that you get long guns quicker - specifically, the very handy SKS rifle.

I would go for Sci-Fi rather than realistic. All it does is open up a fantastic sidequest that you don't want to miss (one of your mines will stop working and it won't be because the vein as run dry...).

For night fighting to be worthwhile, you need mercs with the night ops trait - Scope and Raven are my favs but are too pricey to start with[1]. They give you an extra square of vision at night, which is the difference between clearing a map effortlessly and ending up looking like the extras from the Wild Bunch. I tend to make my custom a night ops + auto weapon expert.

[1]I tend to build from a Eurotrash team - Grunty (night ops + heavy weapons), Igor (all-rounder), Barry (lockpick with electronics skill so escapes nasty traps) and Buns (early sniper/ mid-game trainer and leader of the B team). As they level up, they match the higher rank mercs in stats but remain cheaper. You want high wisdom for mercs that are keepers - it governs the speed at which their stats rise. But MERC provide some low cost militia trainers (Flo & Biff) plus Gasket who is good at maintaining your weapons. I hire Lynx for 24 hours just to get his mini-M14 at the start of the game - it really helps.

[Big King Sanctaphrax]

Awesome tactical action? Whorehouses? Gay Shopkeepers?!

I'm sold!

[professorspatula]

I didn't want to spend anymore money on games or PC stuff, but you lot have made me go and buy this now!

Heh, it looks cool, although with no instructions, I've so far spent 4 hours wandering around the place trying to figure out just what the hell I'm supposed to do. I've killed a load of people, but got shot to hell in the process, but really I'm not convinced my team are much cop. I suppose their heads are still attached to their bodies which is a good sign, but few have much in the way of abilities.

I have, however, since found a manual for the game here:
http://www.replacementdocs.com/download.php?view.1036

And it's confirmed the fact I didn't really know what I was doing. Actually I haven't done too bad in all and can't wait to find a gun better than the crappy pistols my team have, and the MP5K. A shame I didn't pick the 'loads of guns' option really.

[econ21]

A shame I didn't pick the 'loads of guns' option really.

I would restart. It's a really long game. But even with "loads of guns", you won't get rifles for a while - your best bet is to fight a patrol or two after taking Drassen. There should be some at the Drassen SAM too, but that's a hard fight. The drip feeding of better weapons is very well done - you really appreciate each the new guns when you get it.

I think if you pick an auto-weapons (and/or high marksmanship?) custom, you start with an MP5K. You usually get a second in Doreen's locker in Drassen. Those two plus Lynx's mini-M14 are a solid start to the game. Pistols are pretty hopeless throughout.

There are quite a few internet resources for the game if you can find them - the designers released a few FAQs explaining the more esoteric stuff; their last - explaining how all the to hit modifiers work out - was very informative. The best walkthrough/FAQ, IIRC, was Patusco's.

The best forum for the game is:
http://www.ja-galaxy-forum.com/cgi-b...ultimatebb.cgi

[Gealai]

Ah fond memories

Go for night-combat with mercs like Scope or Shadow after you can afford it. Try to get all stuff helping in detecting the enemy first, like the best NVA's and the hearing devices. Camo is a great help against good enemies.
You can silence machinepistols, making them a great addition to a scoped FN FAL with reduced AP's and increased range. IIRC the FN P90 was best, however it was impractical because it's ammo is so hard to get, so go with a 9mm. Always use the Ap ammo against well armoured soldiers.

A nice tactic is to lure your enemies in an ambush, by making noise by killing a soldier. If your soldiers are down and/or covered and have high accuracy with overlapping arcs of fire it's often a piece of cake. Sometimes it is funny to have a pair of camoed and silent killers on one side

[professorspatula]

I decided to restart my game in the end anyway. I kept running into 9 man patrols that were a bit too tough for my band of merry men (and women). Although I could kill the first few, the sheer number of guns and the increasingly annoying lack of accuracy of my merc's pistols sealed their fate.

By the way, what's with the never ending supply of items from the lockers at the airport in Drassen - everytime you leave the screen and come back, the items reappear. Which is nice I suppose to get free flak jackets and 12 gauge ammo. Is this supposed to happen and something that occurs in other places too?

Anyway, I'm off to return being a gun for hire....

[econ21]

9 men patrols are a bit tough for most early parties - an important part of the early game is avoiding fights that you don't want (you can often withdraw from a map before making contact). I tend to stick to the cities and let the patrols be (although early on they may be a source of rifles).

I never noticed a respawning locker. It does not happen normally. In fact, it's not safe to leave stuff on the strategic map unless it is guarded by the militia - it tends to disappear.

[Fragony]

Jagged Alliance is crack. Those that love it will LOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOVE Silent Storm, get it, now.

[professorspatula]

I never noticed a respawning locker. It does not happen normally. In fact, it's not safe to leave stuff on the strategic map unless it is guarded by the militia - it tends to disappear.

Actually it seems loads of stuff respawns when you visit an area. This time I'm getting free 7.62mm AP ammo from the airport which I assume is useful later on. And I get a free MP5K and AP rounds when I go to the T-shirt factory. I had a quick look in a FAQ to get me going (trying not to see any spoilers) and there is mention some areas have stuff that respawns, a possible bug.

Currently I'm training militia in Drassen whilst Pablo nicks my stuff. I haven't found the nice pilot yet though, he's better at hiding than I am. So far I'm pleased with the game. There's quite a bit of scope to it what with training militia and dealing with adventure-y bits. Kind of makes me wish X-Com Apocalypse (another squad based game obviously) was released with all the diplomacy, spying and interrogation options it once boasted about. That would have been a hell of a game then.

[Bob the Insane]

professorspatula - thanks for the link to the manual!!

Yeah, my guys seemed okay in the first few flight, but once the opposistion starts getting serious they suddenly can't hit the broadside of a barn!! I have lost 3 mercs so far and no one else at AIM wants to work for me...

I picked up the militia training thing from a FAQ and at least Dressen can now defend itself. It is really worth maxing out the miltia training in a settlement..

When your stuff is stolen from the airport do you get any notification oe is it simply not there? My first weapons (ammo really) shipment simply didn't turn up (I did get the email).

Fragony - Silent Storm..... interesting...


OOhh... Additionally...

The financies appear to be completed screwed up in my game, bizarre numbers ($1,236,534 deposit, followed by $1,236,432 deduction) and stuff not being subtracted (hiring some mercs)... Any ideas? A bug?

[Ciaran]

Hey, JA2, that game brought me into the world of game communities, that´s a classic. Is it really already almost seven years? Time sure flies by.

When you suspect that stuff gets stolen by the airport guy, have a stern talk with him and if that doesn´t help, slap him - but be careful not to kill him, you don´t want to face the problems that pop up then.

The finances thing seems odd, have you patched the game? It´s too long ago since I last played, so I can´t recall right now the best patch, but I know for sure it never happened to me.

Silent Storm isn´t bad, but it lacks the flair of JA2, the soldiers aren´t personalities and, of course, the strategic/economic part is missing, too. Oh, and you´ll have to make do with only six men, while in JA2 you can get all eighteen mercs into the action (and you´ll need to do it later on).

[econ21]

When your stuff is stolen from the airport do you get any notification oe is it simply not there? My first weapons (ammo really) shipment simply didn't turn up (I did get the email).

When your character opens the crate, he/she comments that something is missing if it has been stolen. Without that comment, you may have messed up with the delivery (e.g. not put Drassen as the delivery address).

The financies appear to be completed screwed up in my game, bizarre numbers ($1,236,534 deposit, followed by $1,236,432 deduction) and stuff not being subtracted (hiring some mercs)... Any ideas? A bug?

I don't recall a problem with finances. Those numbers sound rather large. If you hire mercs from MERC you don't pay immediately; there are also some free mercs like Ira and Dimitri.

[Daimon]

I just got it but i still not know what do just wandering around Omerta..... Maybe i should have watch the movie in the beginning?

[econ21]

I just got it but i still not know what do just wandering around Omerta..... Maybe i should have watch the movie in the beginning?

Talk to the woman on the first Omerta map and then follow her to the second. She will introduce you to the rebels, who will tell you to go to Drassen and talk to Father Walker.

But basically, the game is admirably open. There's no linear sequence of towns or missions that you have to follow. Just devise your own strategy to liberate all the towns and topple Queen Deidranna. To do that, you need money, so you need to take over the various silver mines attached to the towns. This will give you the funds to pay the mercenaries to do the fighting for you. Most of the weapons and ammo you can actually loot from your enemies.

[professorspatula]

My finances are full of bizarre large sums being added and subtracted as well right from the start. I also noticed in my first game, my money kept returning to $35,000 even when hiring my mercs and stuff at the beginning. According to the game, I think it's a 2002 version running (1.12), which I assume is the most recent patch version.

Here's my finances for day 1:


By the way, any recommendations of the number of mercs I should have once I've liberated Drassen? I think I have 8, inc. six AIM members, but there's only a couple of decent expensive ones among them.

[Husar]

And don´t forget to send Deidranna some flowers.

[professorspatula]

Hmm, I've just been on the Steam forums, where I bought the game, and it appears this 'Gold Version' ain't all it says it is. By all accounts it's a messed up and broken version with the add-on not even playable. Hurrah for Steam!
http://forums.steampowered.com/forum...hreadid=461189

[Bob the Insane]

I saw that on the forums too... It seems to be an issue with the steam version...

Well I liked it so much I ordered an orginal copy through Amazon and I would recommend anyone else who is imterest to do the same until Steam sorts it's life out...

[econ21]

By the way, any recommendations of the number of mercs I should have once I've liberated Drassen? I think I have 8, inc. six AIM members, but there's only a couple of decent expensive ones among them.

That sounds about right - I prefer fighting battles with a single 6 man squad, usually AIM. The rest are militia trainers and repairmen - either freebies or MERCs. The way I keep a manage the finances is to make sure I can lock everyone into 2 week contracts. If I can do that, I know I'll be in the black. It's also cheaper in the long run - both because of the lower rate and because when they go up in level, you delay having to pay the higher fees.

[Fragony]

Silent Storm isn´t bad, but it lacks the flair of JA2, the soldiers aren´t personalities and, of course, the strategic/economic part is missing, too. Oh, and you´ll have to make do with only six men, while in JA2 you can get all eighteen mercs into the action (and you´ll need to do it later on).

Silent Storm has tons of flair, I like it even more then JA2. JA2 was also pretty damn funny, but it lacks level of cheesiness of Silent Storm. All the characters have their running jokes, and the things they say are so hilarious I just can't help laughing out loud every time I hear it. To make it even better, it looks gorgious and is far more interactive. Everything is destructable, so with the right equipment you can just blow up an entire building instead of using squad tactics, this is a game every turn-based strategy fan should play.

[Husar]

But Panzerkleins ruin a lot of fun in Silent Storm and it seems more buggy sometimes.
And I cannot remember any funny quotes from the german Silent Storm and modern weapons are better than WW2 weapons.

[professorspatula]

I knew I never should have looked at this thread and bought the game!

I'm now trying to get a refund off Steam for mis-selling me a game that isn't complete (ie no Gold Edition content available) and largely broken thanks to all the bugs. They have a no refund policy, but with the game as it is at the moment, it clearly isn't a proper working product and thus not what I paid for. I doubt very much they'll care that much though. JA2 is obviously not much of an issue for them, because it's about the only Steam title that doesn't have it's own entry in the Steam support section.

To rub it in, I've seen new sealed box versions available elsewhere for much cheaper than Steam's mess of a version as well.

Bah.


Damn you Bob and your early enthusiasm for JA2 and Steam!

[Bob the Insane]

Damn you Bob and your early enthusiasm for JA2 and Steam!

Sorry...

Still, nice to discover the game anyway and if you have any luck with complaining please let me know...

[professorspatula]

Doesn't look like I'll have much luck with my complaints if this is anything to go by:

I'm sorry it's taken so long to get back to you. What we offer on Steam is what we were provided by Strategy First. There are no releases pending to deliver anything other than what we are currently offering. I cannot offer you a refund, unfortunately. You can see our policy on refunds through Steam here:

That was a response from Valve/Steam to someone else. So they're happy to keep on selling a broken and incomplete product and blame everyone else. That and their no refunds policy makes them one of the least consumer friendly companies I've ever had the misfortune of doing business with. I can practically guarantee I'll not be buying another Steam powered product for quite some time.

Perhaps there's some internet consumer watchdog site somewhere that can look into this. I won't hold my breath though.

[Bob the Insane]

Maybe you should take that eMail and contact support at Strategy first...

Actually I just did... We shall see...

[econ21]

Professorspatula, I was able to obtain a "JA2 Gold patch" from a link the Bearpit forums I linked to above (a forum search might track it down). IIRC this is effectively the latest version JA2.exe file. It might make your version from Steam work if you applied it - provided the problem is with the exe file and not with other files. Worth a shot, anyway.