Anti-Semetism

**Philippus Flavius Homovallumus** · 09-08-2006, 16:36

Originally Posted by Red Peasant

I beg to differ Wig, along with at least 6 million others, who have no voice. They were just the most recent instalment in a long catalogue of anti-semitic actions. But, maybe it was all propaganda, eh? Adolf certainly thought that they were 'special'.
That's my last word in this thread, though doubtless this subject will rear its ugly head again. Some things just need to be stated.

I shall refrain from my first inclination, which is to tell you exactly what I think of being painted a holocaust denier. The Holocaust was terrible, and there are people that suffered because of Hitler's self hatred who are still alive today.

That does not make Jews special. For one thing the last two thousand years have not been a concerted effort at the destruction of the Jewish race. By contrast the English systematically persecuted the Irish for the better part of a thousand years.

Prejudice against Jews is easy to trace because Jews are easy to trace as a group. Christian Arian heresies were persecuted far more often than Jews were by the Church. The difference is that because the heresy was in and out of the public eye it is more difficult to trace and the various incidents look more isolated.

If I'm reading your post right you are yourself Jewish. In that case you have a personnal, and perhaps personnally painful, stake in the arguement.

Regardless, I stand by my position, Jews have not been persecuted more than any other group. Nor is anti-Semetism different from any other form of racism.

**Incongruous** · 09-09-2006, 12:10

Red Peasant, I started this thread mereley to highlight the great and current injustices (such as geneocide, what else can one call Sharons actions in Lebbanon?).
I am not anti-Jewish.

**Gawain of Orkeny** · 09-10-2006, 18:40

Red Peasant, I started this thread mereley to highlight the great and current injustices (such as geneocide, what else can one call Sharons actions in Lebbanon?).

Well you certainly picked a strange title to make such a point. But I suppose you were trying to refer to Anti-Semetism as anti arab.

Isreal does not equal Jews, nor do Jews equal Isreal.

And being anti Islrael dosent equal anti semitism. But are any of you denying that that anti semitisim exists?

Regardless, I fail to see how anti-Semetism is special and I don't think anyone would see it as such were it not for Hitler and the Holocaust.

You just finished giving a few examples.

Hate that word, it shouldn't exist. Anti-semitism is just your everyday's racism, jews aren't special.

Why because you dont like it? Its true racism is racism but theres nothing wrong with pointing out or naming a specifc type or peoples who are being discriminated against.

**Ser Clegane** · 09-10-2006, 19:19

Originally Posted by Gawain

But are any of you denying that that anti semitisim dosent exist?

Yes - I totally deny that anti-semitism doesn't exist

**Gawain of Orkeny** · 09-10-2006, 19:31

Yes - I totally deny that anti-semitism doesn't exist

Got me there. Seems Im a bit rusty

**Philippus Flavius Homovallumus** · 09-10-2006, 23:23

Originally Posted by Gawain of Orkeny

You just finished giving a few examples.

Why because you dont like it? Its true racism is racism but theres nothing wrong with pointing out or naming a specifc type or peoples who are being discriminated against.

One example, actually, ethnic cleansing is not new, the fact that sixty years ago one country industrialised it doesn't make one of the groups that country persecuted special.

Remember Gypsies and homosexuals were also sent to death camps.

As a few more cases, Bosnia, practically everyone was at it.

Spain in the 1500s, the Muslims were forcibly ejected.

The mass expulsions and killings following the fragmenting of India in 1946.

The holocaust is unique, but only in method. That doesn't make the one prejudice unique.

**Gawain of Orkeny** · 09-11-2006, 00:27

One example, actually, ethnic cleansing is not new, the fact that sixty years ago one country industrialised it doesn't make one of the groups that country persecuted special.

Remember Gypsies and homosexuals were also sent to death camps.

As a few more cases, Bosnia, practically everyone was at it.

Spain in the 1500s, the Muslims were forcibly ejected.

The mass expulsions and killings following the fragmenting of India in 1946.

The holocaust is unique, but only in method. That doesn't make the one prejudice unique.

Ethnic cleansing is only one example of racism at work. I really dont see your point as it relates to my post.

**Philippus Flavius Homovallumus** · 09-12-2006, 00:26

Originally Posted by Gawain of Orkeny

Ethnic cleansing is only one example of racism at work. I really dont see your point as it relates to my post.

My point was that the Holocaust was unique in method, which makes Hitler special, rather than the Jews. Since that's the first thing people bring up it seemed the best to de-bunk.

What else have you got?

If you can prove to me anti-Semetism is truely different then I will concede the point.

**AntiochusIII** · 09-12-2006, 00:32

Eh, you guys seem to be arguing on the same plane of thought.

Gawain, to summarize, Wigferth Ironwall, if my interpretation is correct, simply believes that there should be no "special treatment" of the Jews based on the Holocaust -- the "Jewish" lobby groups use this tactic pretty often, though I don't claim in any way that they somehow represent the ethnicity -- when so many other crimes against humanity have also been committed against so many other groups. I do not believe he hold the position that the Holocaust is any less a tragedy, or that Jews should not be equal, or other such positions as might be interpreted. Simply that having "Anti-Semitism" as a seperate word in modern usage seems to encourage a "special treatment" upon this particular racism while other, any other, racisms deserve just as much attention, and just as much shame for the racists.

Now, if one politicize upon this position in terms of Israel it will become a whole 'nother discussion.

**Byzantine Prince** · 09-12-2006, 02:52

Originally Posted by Wigferth Ironwall

My point was that the Holocaust was unique in method, which makes Hitler special, rather than the Jews. Since that's the first thing people bring up it seemed the best to de-bunk.

What else have you got?

If you can prove to me anti-Semetism is truely different then I will concede the point.

How is it different? Hitler himself modelled the idea after the Mongol tactics.