I'm re-enlisting, help me decide

[Major Robert Dump]

I have about 3-4 more weeks of family issues (like open heart surgery and possibly funerals), real estate deals and 50 hour work weeks then I can afford to spend 12 hours at MEPS getting poked and prodded.

I stopped by the Army recruiter here in town to get glimpse of my DD and feel around a bit, but they were extremely high pressure and couldn't get out of "I'm talking to an 18 year old" mode and wanted to whisk me away then and there despite my telling them I didn't have time to go the full mile just yet.

The last straw for me was when SGT .... lied to me twice, telling me he drove 100 miles to get my papers from my old guard armory when I know for a fact he can get them 6 miles away in OKC, and then told me he could have me in and out of MEPS in less than 2 hours (absolute BS, he was gonna get me there and I'd be stuck for the day). Thats okay, though, I got the info I needed and when he called, pretending to have gone to sooooooo much trouble for me, I informed him when I did take the jump I'd be going to another recruiter because he never bothered, not once, to listen to me about my schedule and was far too concerned about pushing me through before the fiscal year was over or before I could change my mind.
and we wonder why these tards can't meet their recruitment goals??????


About me:

-31 years old
-4 years prior service 2 Oklahoma Guard, 2 Army
-Been out 10 years
-6'2", 215 pounds, can easily get down to 190 when I start cardio training again
-Former MOS 31C (signal) but I have no interest in keeping same MOS
-90 on ASVAB, total crap that I can't take it again, not sure what my test breakdown was per section, as SGT ..... wouldn't give me a printout and closed the window when he saw I was going to write it down
-here's the kicker: I'm colorblind, pretty much completely...those of you who played TW with me will remember this, but there are some exceptions for red/green colorblindness depending on how the equipment is set up, hence me being 31C.
-I have a degree in broadcast journalism from the University of Oklahoma


Why am I doing this?

-Has nothing to do with money, I'll be taking a 50% monhtly pay cut going back in as an E-4
-Has nothing to do with the new relaxed standards, as I would get in regardless of those
-Not a confused little boy, not a midlife crisis, so why?

I'll tell you why, because we need help. I'm not married, have no kids, spent the last decade drinking beer and screwing 20 year olds. I simply don't enjoy civilian life as much as I used to, and the thought of people better and braver than me getting pwnt in the line fo duty quite honestly makes me feel insignificant and empty. That, and everytime I see we lost some 19 year old girl or a guy with 5 kids I get absolutely livid. I'd also like to think that when I read about some sort of messed up misconduct on the part of soldiers that maybe, just maybe, had I been there I could have changed things.

My parents will be horrified, as I am an only child and the only full-blooded child and grandchild on both sides of the family, and I will announce it Don Corleone style at thanksgiving dinner. Personally, I look forward to getting away from the Jerry Srpinger show that is my step family and in-laws

Nothing will change my mind at this point, it's pretty much a done deal unless I go to MEPS and find out I have butt cancer or AIDS or a brain tumor or something.

So there we have it.

Mithrandir : edited for language

[yesdachi]

I’m sorry, but you lost me at “screwing 20 year olds”. JK, JK!

If your minds made up your minds made up, good luck! And I hope you don’t have butt cancer.

I always find it interesting to see what motivations people to join the service, yours are definitely uncommon but honorable, thanks!

[Vladimir]

No no no . Get a direct comission, or at least OCS. You can still screw 20 year olds in the military.

Good call on the recruiter. One of the reasons I joined was because I admired my recruiter's professionalism and drive. He was attending *cough*NG*ahem* OCS at the time.

[Fragony]

I'll take camalflie's over screwing 20 year olds any day, honostly, you served your time, why not enjoy your civilian life. Take a hobby or something, go fishing, buy a boat, anything.

[macsen rufus]

Sounds like your heart's set, even if your mind isn't made up yet. If you don't do it, you'll probably regret it, despise yourself and end up doing more beer and fewer 20yr olds... The only advice I'd offer really is try and keep the peace with your family, but then be firm and follow your path.

[Seamus Fermanagh]

MRD:

An honorable choice, you want to be somewhere where your effort counts.

A number of those on this site consider a regimen of "beer and 20-year-olds" to be something akin to paradise. I'm old enough to understand why that -- however pleasurable in the moment -- engenders ennui.

I think the comment on going mustang is a valid one. Yes we need sargeants who know their stuff -- backbone of the army -- but you are an E6/E7 in age bracket. Would that impair your efforts? Moreover, your quality of mind suggests to me that you have a greater span of leadership to contribute. If such an option exists, it might be a more rewarding challenge for you as well as better for the service.

Regardless, I wish you well.

[Philippus Flavius Homovallumus]

You might want to consider a commission, Given you age and resulting life experience etc, etc.

Either way, good on you and good luck.

[UglyandHasty]

Hiya Dump, we didnt went to school together, but fight alot together in the old days. The backroom will miss your err... less than conventional posting ! All i can do is to wish ya good luck and godspeed mate !

[rory_20_uk]

I am thinking of joining the "Saturday / Sunday Brigade". I know not the same, but I agree with the doing something worthwhile aspect or it - even if the worthwhile is only on the here and now, and not the politics of the war.

I'm too cowardly to enlist (even though I will join as a Captain, or if I wait two years, a Major) but the TA seems like a rewarding activity.

It seems that (don't take this the wrong way) you've nothing immediate to live for. So why the hell not go and kick some foreign ass?

[Philippus Flavius Homovallumus]

Rory, let me just say I don't think the TA is a good idea anymore. I have no problem with it but there's a reason they call them STABs. These days its a six month tour in Iraq with not job when you get back, no support and no pension if you get shot/cooked/mauled.

Go all the way or no way. Thats why I'm going for a commission after Uni.

[rory_20_uk]

As a medic, I would do a 2 month tour.
I will not get asked to do anything until I'm "fully trained". For me that's 3 years. Fully trained for me means I'm a GP!
My job is protected. As I'm effectively working for the government that is a cast iron guarantee (they mess us around and they'll be no more joining).
Training is 19 days a year. That's 2 weekends and a 2 week camp.
I don't relish the thought of bieng mauled / dying, but the way I see it the size of the war before they'd want me it'd almost be safer in the army than out!

For me to get shot at, they'd have to force me to mobilise (with work not pleading extenuating circumstances), then spend a fair amount of time training me (19 days a year don't cut it really).

Thanks for the heads up, but if I can get all the damn paperwork together (and get my fitness up) I'll give it a bash. I'd rather get thrown out that be 90 thinking "what if??"; and my parents have 3 children, so I'm expendable

[GoreBag]

http://www.hoo-ah.net/

[rotorgun]

Hello Major Dump,

I coudn't help but notice your plea for help, and I thought I might offer a bit of advice. As for the first bit of "wisdom", I want to second Seamus Fermanaugh in his suggestions that you consider OCS, or a direct commision. We do need good officers always, especially ones that have had prior experience as an enlisted soldier. That is an invaluable insight that many new officers don't have.

If you are still intent on being an enlisted man again, consider a career in Army Aviation maintenace. I have been doing this for almost thirty years, and I never have a dull day. I am technically challenged by the work, and have the opportunity to work with some pretty smart guys. The schools are a bit long I know, but the rewards are great. You will not be directly on the front line, but doing work that supports the frontline grunts enormously. What are your GM and GT scores? You can probably get them from your previous service records. When did you take the ASVAB? If that recruiter is not wanting to let you see your overall results than ditch that person and go over his head. Everyone has a boss.

The other alternative is to try another branch of service completely. I often wish that I would have tried Naval or Air Force Aviation instead, but opted for the Infantry, of all things first. After three years of mindless slogging through the bush with a rucksack on, I finally enlisted in Aviation. I have never regretted it since.

Whatever you decide, I am proud of you for desire to serve your country and touched that you asked us at the ORG for advice.

Strength and Honor,

[Major Robert Dump]

Went to another Army recruiter today and found out some interesting things, although he didn't pull records as he was busy and I caught him just at closing time.

First, I can take the ASVAB again since it has been 13 years, whereas the previous recruiter told me I couldn't. Second, after a succussful processing at MEPS for the army, you basically get your orders there as soon as your MOS is picked. This ticks me off even more, since I told that freakin first recuiter that I needed a few weeks to tie up loose ends. The guy was basically trying to corner me and ship me out ASAP (the recruiting quarter ended last Friday) so he could meet his quota.

I'm doing this for the country and for myself, not for some fat body E-5 who has been a pencil pusher for the last 20 years. I love how these guys act like they are doing me a favor when they fell short of their last recruiting cycle by 30%, apparently they are not used to dealing with adults.

I also requested to be sent back to boot camp, but the Army is telling me instead I'd be sent to a 4-week "warrior school." I understand they want to get people trained as fast as possible and save as much money as possible by avoiding unnecessary retraining, but I want to get smoked. I want to, and I will try to get basic again at every corner I in the MEPS process. Plus, last time around I went through the last basic cycle at fort Dix, NJ, and everything had been dismantled and shipped to other bases. We got no weapons training outside of M-16s, the grenade fields had beend razed, the obstacle courses were dismantled and shipped to other bases, there were no war games or mock bunkers to assault. Quite frankly, it was a rip off as far as training goes.

I was, however, happy to see that Army training now focuses A LOT less on all the pomp drill and boot shining garbage. I still remember getting 5 hour sleep intervals at AIT and having to stay up and extra freaking hour so I could shine my boots, it was ridiculous, it didn't teach discipline it taught you how to bust your butt for somethign that was largely irrelevant in the larger scope of things.

My age in relation to my rank is not important. The fact that most E-4s are 22 year olds means nothing to me, a 42 year old PFC deserves just as much respect for serving as 26 year old E-6 hotshot.
This isn't about promotions, salary or the ability to come home and rub my service record in everyones face like so many people do. It's about the overall mission.

I don't know anything about OCS and don't care to ever set foot on a public university as student ever again, so if it entails some mickey mouse ROTC program at a non-military university I'm going to give that one a pass. I'm no prodigy or genius, and like I said before I'm severley colorblind, so I've pretty much reserved myself to the fact that I'm not going to be pandered to here.

At the moment, I'm leaning towards Army Civil Affairs, which would put on the front lines in Iraq or Afghanastan. Civil Affairs aren't a big part of assault and defense operations and operate mostly in small groups identifying needs and vulnerable spots in the communities. Based on the MOS casualty reports I read, civil affairs personnel tend to get ambushed a lot. Demolitions also interests me, and is apparently in very high demand, but the colorblindness may keep me out of that field since I wouldnt exactly be able to distinguish between the red and the green wires

The one thing I am certain of is that I wont be going NG or reservist of any kind. It seems rather pointless, I don't want to be stuck in the states, and theres simply nothing in civilian life at the moment worth keeping me here.

I have to start packing and moving today, and have to pull bedside duty over the weekend, so next week I'm going to hit the Air force and Navy recruiters. I'm also going to see if I can find some refreshers on the ASVAB

[IrishArmenian]

If your gut says so, Do it! When I got the choice, I stayed there and I made friends, served my country and made some money at the same time.

[Redleg]

I don't know anything about OCS and don't care to ever set foot on a public university as student ever again, so if it entails some mickey mouse ROTC program at a non-military university I'm going to give that one a pass. I'm no prodigy or genius, and like I said before I'm severley colorblind, so I've pretty much reserved myself to the fact that I'm not going to be pandered to here.

At the moment, I'm leaning towards Army Civil Affairs, which would put on the front lines in Iraq or Afghanastan. Civil Affairs aren't a big part of assault and defense operations and operate mostly in small groups identifying needs and vulnerable spots in the communities. Based on the MOS casualty reports I read, civil affairs personnel tend to get ambushed a lot. Demolitions also interests me, and is apparently in very high demand, but the colorblindness may keep me out of that field since I wouldnt exactly be able to distinguish between the red and the green wires

With a degree you might also be able to apply for a direct commission because of your prior service.

Rest assured last time I checked OCS was not on a college campus, but on a Military base. Just ask the recruiter what opitions do you have with your college education - especially considering what your degree is in .I have a degree in broadcast journalism from the University of Oklahoma

Your doing it right - don't rush it, make them work for your re-enlistment. Get what you want out of it, that is just as important as serving your nation again.

Good Luck

[L`zard]

I'm no current military genius, but with an MOS like yours:

Maybe as a gunner on an apache? Nightsights/thermals are all the same color are they not? Anyone smart enough for signals is well above requirements for 'shooter' unless I'm totally misinformed.

Why walk when you can fly the unfriendly skys?

AirMobile!

[Samurai Waki]

Yeah. I think i'd take the 9 weeks of basic over being a 4 week wonder, that way you'd be completely refreshed on your material, and your chances of moving to a different mos (should you decide later that your current mos doesn't quite suite you) your chances of a transfer would probably be better.

Anyway, good luck.

[doc_bean]

No real advice from me, I just want to wish you the best. There comes a time when you just have to follow your heart, and if it says 'join up' then that's what you've got to do !

[Vladimir]

With a degree you might also be able to apply for a direct commission because of your prior service.

Rest assured last time I checked OCS was not on a college campus, but on a Military base. Just ask the recruiter what opitions do you have with your college education - especially considering what your degree is in .I have a degree in broadcast journalism from the University of Oklahoma

Your doing it right - don't rush it, make them work for your re-enlistment. Get what you want out of it, that is just as important as serving your nation again.

Good Luck

OCS is THE WAY TO GO. You'll find West Pointers more drilled in military history and tactics and logistics but I think you'll find that your best officers come from OCS. I really hope there is no confusion between that and ROTC because there's a world of difference.

[Major Robert Dump]

Thanks for the info, never knew squat about how OCS and commissions work in relation to college ROTC because I never bothered to pursue the info. It does, however, make me realize just how much of a waste my degree choice was in restrospect considering I swore off commercial journalism less than a year after graduating. I can't sleep, I hate packing to move.

[Vladimir]

Thanks for the info, never knew squat about how OCS and commissions work in relation to college ROTC because I never bothered to pursue the info. It does, however, make me realize just how much of a waste my degree choice was in restrospect considering I swore off commercial journalism less than a year after graduating. I can't sleep, I hate packing to move.

For comissioning purposes, your degree isn't a waste. Most of the specialized training you'll get before your comission and they just want you to have your four-year degree first (but in some cases, you only need an Associates )

[KukriKhan]

OCS Info They still do Army OCS in Georgia. From what I remember of Army reg's you're eligible right off the bat, and can maybe even enlist for it.

Bravo for wanting to get 'the full Monty' of training, versus some gentleman's refresher course. If you decide to stay enlisted, once you're at your first permanent duty assignment, you'll be a leading candidate for promotion to Sgt/E5.

That and E6/Staff Sergeant, are the most important leadership positions in the Army, in my opinion. Every position/paygrade above that may have delusions of grandeur, but they're really there to support that first-line leader making on-the-ground decisions that directly affect the lives of soldiers.

There's no more honorable title in the world, in my mind, than "Squad Leader". And it sounds by your postings here, that that is what you seek: to make a difference - to make it matter that Bob Dump was here.

The Army has apparently changed a lot since you and I were last 'in', at least according to my son who went thru basic/ait & airborne at Benning. Much less spitNpolish, much more urban warfare training. In his case, he spent a grand total of 6 days at his first perm assignment (Ft Bragg) before boarding a plane to Kuwait, and then a convoy to FOB Speicher, near Tikrit... so you may be in-theater fairly quick.

My deep respect for your desire to help our young'uns do the right thing, and do it well I'm past the age limit for reenlistment myself, or I'd join you.

Best of Luck. And like the fellas above said: Have it your way.

[Samurai Waki]

A man never commands any more respect than a good Staff Sargeant.

[Divinus Arma]

(except a good Sergeant)


If you have the degree- Go OCS. I'll probably be re-joining the service as a reserve officer in a few years myself.

I find that there are two types of career enlisted: (1) Those who truly truly love it, but usually the intelligent ones go to school and later take a commission and (2) Those who are unable to be successful in the civilian world. After my short career in the Corps, I can honestly say this. There are many senior enlisted folk who are simply afraid to get out. They get locked in and have the promise of a paycheck, pension, and benefits and are too afraid to abandon it. I will admit- it is very hard trying to adjust.


Take the commission MRD.