Crusade - target province back in catholic hands

**caravel** · 09-21-2006, 13:16

Originally Posted by matteus the inbred

Another is that the AI appears to be able to pick its own route to the target, usually coincidentally(!) involving walking through all of your heavily garrisoned provinces and picking up lots of your troops, often repeatedly, whereas as the player you have to follow a pre-selected route, or go by sea.

Verry annoying. This always happens to me around the eastern Turkish/Byzantine provinces. The crusade seems to be en route to go into Lesser Armenia, but then zips into Rum, then gets beaten and heads off on another route, even if it's longer. I make a point of chastising these AI crusades mightily, to the extent that I cannot wait to annoy the pope and provoke some more.

Originally Posted by Jxrc

Since I have sometimes managed to get a AI crusade disbanded, I was wondering if it does not depend on how you conquer the province. Perhaps that if you use only you "regular army" (and nothing else), the AI crusade stops while if you have crusade involved in the process the AI keeps on going ? not sure though ... will check when I get the opportunity

You can get the AI crusade disbanded by sending your own crusade to the same province as the AI crusade and getting your's there first. Also if their chapterhouse is destroyed the crusade is gone. Crusades will also disband due to desertion when they finally run out of men.

**Geezer57** · 09-21-2006, 14:26

Originally Posted by Caravel

You can get the AI crusade disbanded by sending your own crusade to the same province as the AI crusade and getting your's there first.

Nope - see Martok's post for how it works.

Originally Posted by Martok

Unfortunately, that's just the way the game mechanic works. If you own a province that's the target for a Crusade, you have two choices:

1.) Turn over the province to the Crusaders, and then pay a big ransom for your army (if you have no neighboring territory for them to retreat to); or
2.) Refuse to turn over the province, fight an often-massive Crusader army, and then be summarily excommunicated. It's one of the few things about Crusades that I can't stand.

I don't much like it, either, but it does make for "interesting times".

**caravel** · 09-21-2006, 15:09

Originally Posted by Geezer57

Nope - see Martok's post for how it works.

Sorry but I'm not so sure that's how it works. If as a catholic faction you invade and take a province that is the target for another catholic faction's crusade, or your own crusade gains that province, rival crusades for that province will disband. If it was your crusade that was beaten to it's objective then you will see the message about the province being back "in the hands of true catholics", and of the crusade being disbanded. Catholics don't hand over provinces to other catholics due to a crusade. This only occurs where the objective is a rebel province and they believe they can't win.

I know this because I very regularly declare crusades targetted at the same provinces as my rivals, then beat them to the target by sea. Their crusade always disbands, it never continues on it's way until it reaches my province and asks me, another catholic faction, to hand it over.

One of my common strategies as the French or English is to crusade to Palestine, and build a chapter house there. If one of the rival crusading factions decides to send a crusade to tripoli, I immediately declare another one from Palestine and send it straight in with some back up. The AI crusade vanishes never to return, often sparking a civil war in their homelands.

Excommunication is another matter of course.

If for example, you are Novgorod and the French declare a crusade for rebel controlled lithuania, and in the mean time you invade it and take it. When the crusade arrives, you will see a message that the crusaders "explain that they have been "sent by god" asking you to hand over the province. Also vice versa if you were the french in that situation you may see a "hand over the province peacefully" message.

**matteus the inbred** · 09-21-2006, 15:17

Odd, because I have definitely taken a crusading province objective with a crusade (as the French) and then had another faction's crusade (Italian) turn up and demand I hand it over...perhaps there are other factors at work here, such as if my crusade was declared after theirs but got to the objective first?

**caravel** · 09-21-2006, 15:19

Very odd...

If you had become excommunicated after declaring the crusade that may have caused it. I wonder if there are any other factors involved...

**matteus the inbred** · 09-21-2006, 15:26

Originally Posted by Caravel

Very odd...

If you had become excommunicated after declaring the crusade that may have caused it. I wonder if there are any other factors involved...

Nope, not that. I have standard MTW VI, no mods...it is odd. Still, I've been mistaken before, could just be a product of my ageing memory and too much alcohol abuse when I were a lad...! But I am pretty sure about this one.

**Geezer57** · 09-21-2006, 15:23

Are we playing different versions (v2.01 for me) of the game? Because I don't know how many times, as a Catholic faction, I've taken a province by Crusade in the Holy Land from a Muslim faction, and had another Catholic faction's Crusade march up to the province border and demand I hand it over, or face battle/excom for refusing. Just like in Martok's games.

This game sure is deep - you never know what will turn up!

**caravel** · 09-21-2006, 15:27

So what does the 'the province is back in the hands of true catholics, the crusade is now disbanded' (not exact quote) message pertain to? I'm playing MTW/VI 2.01.

**matteus the inbred** · 09-21-2006, 15:37

Not sure if I've encountered that...however, I have an HRE campaign on the go right now and it's Crusading time, the French are actively on the Crusade trail too, so I will see if I can bring about a race to the objective.

**Martok** · 09-21-2006, 20:35

Well this is all very strange.

My experiences have been identical to that of Geezer57 & matteus the inbred, where an AI Crusade demands I turn over the province. This is even if I'm Catholic, and even if I myself had conquered that province with a prior Crusade.

I certainly can't (and don't) believe Caravel is pulling our collective leg, however. I think there must be some game condition (a condition we players are unwittingly meeting) that triggers the AI Crusade to either disband, or triggers it to not disband and then demand we hand the province over to them. (It almost seems as if CA pulled a prank on us and released two versions of the game.

)

Originally Posted by matteus the inbred

...perhaps there are other factors at work here, such as if my crusade was declared after theirs but got to the objective first?

This could potentially explain it, but didn't Caravel say that he'd launched Crusades after the other faction(s) had already sent a Crusade towards the same province? Either way, I think further investigation is warranted. I suggest we do some more "research" and see what we can find out.