East India Trade

[Franconicus]

I have a rather simple question, maybe someone has the answer.

In the 17th century (1600 - ...) the Europeans started their trade with India around the horn of Africa. I know that one of reasons was that the Ottomanian Empire blocked the direct path.

Now here's my question:

How long did a sea transport take from India (Ceylon) to Spain around Africa?
How long did a sea/land transport take from India to Spain across the Indian Sea, Sues-Port Said, Med. Sea? Without considering political hurdles?

[Rodion Romanovich]

Most expeditions from European bases to the trade targets and back again seem to have taken around a year. So dividing by two and subtracting the time for trading and loading the ships says that it can't have taken more than about half a year, probably a lot less. My guess is three to five months, depending on weather conditions etc.

[Tribesman]

An East-Indiaman would take about two years for the round trip , it would have a workable life of usually 4 round trips .
With improvements in ship design , accurate charting of winds and currents , improved understanding of medicine and food preservation the roundtrip came down to around 6 months .
Overland could take forever . Plus you would get stung for taxes in transit .

[Franconicus]

...
Overland could take forever . Plus you would get stung for taxes in transit .

Why would it take forever. The passage from Sues to Port Said is about 113 km. Even with unloading and loading this should be done in 4 weeks. Plus a much shorter sea passages. I assume the sea passage ariound Africa is 4 times the passage across the Indian Sea and the Med.

If you take 6 months from India to Spain via Cape, then it should be about 1 month in the Indian Sea, 1 month between Sues and Said and another month in the Med. So in total three months. If I am not wrong the passage via Sues takes half the time of the passage via Cape.

Additionally there are a lot of harbors for supply. So you do not need that much food and water and can take more goods. Plus, there are trade opportunities all along the way.

I think the main reason against that route was the political issue (Ottomanian realm) and maybe thieves.

[King Kurt]

I wonder if there is also a question of logistics against the overland Port said to Suez route. I don't know how much cargo was in a trade ship, but let us take a guess at 300 tonnes. Assuming you are going to use waggons - and that assumes that there is a reasonable road - then at say 2 tonne a waggon that is 150 waggons. then assume 6 horses or oxen per waggon, that is 900 beasts to take care off. Not a lot of grass along the route, so all fodder would have to be carried, so more waggons, beasts etc.
So the effort for a ship would be substanial and would require a significant organisation in place. Throw into to the mix the number of ships - a few means an organisation lying idle for long periods, a lot leads to a truely massive organisation.
So maybe it was just a question of logistics - once goods are on a ship, it is easy to take them from A to B with relatively few men. That, coupled of course with security and political issues makes the overland route nothing like an attractive option as it first appears.

[Tribesman]

Why would it take forever.
Could was the word , it was after all the age of sail , and sailing ships can not work to anything like a schedule , and with the contrary winds prevalent in the gulf of suez it makes it even worse .
Since overland involves co-ordinating both the land and the sea passages can you see the problem ?
Kurt touches on the problem of animals and fodder , to that you can add transport staff .
So do you buy and keep the animals and wait until the ship arrives (if it arrives at all) and then keep them at the other end until the outward bound goods arrive or do you have to hire or buy them all when the ship arrives (if they are available , and of course at a premium price due to demand) .

A-B was just so much simpler , cheaper , reliable and more secure .

BTW Franconios the Persian gulf ---euphrates ---overland would be the more used one .