Questions about Rome Total War

[Spidey]

I'm assuming that, since I'm new, I cannot post anywhere but here. These questions (and this note) would be better under the Rome TW topic, but I will post it here because, well, it's the only place I can.

First, I'm new here. Great forum, by the way.

I've read the RTW manual and Froggy's very helpful guide. Yet, some questions remain:

1. I've played RTW for several weeks now and it seems the game is much more random that MTW (which I played for years). In MTW, you could pretty much expect the same AI reaction to whatever you did. In RTW, I've noticed I can play a faction once and it's quite easy; the next time it's like going to the dentist it's so hard. Anyone have the same experience?

2. Squalor. I know from reading the above guides that we just don't know a lot about it. I know that, as my population increases, so does my squalor. At about 5000-7000 population, I'm usually running about 20 to 25% squalor. Question: Is that high? Should I try to fix (and thereby increase my population rate) or just make little collars for the rats and call them pets?

3. Negative income streams. Okay, I know that some cities pay more for troops than others, so they end up running a negative income stream. Still, some of my cities get to be around -700 or -1200 (particular if I'm playing the Romans). At the same time, I'm bringing in 5000 or 6000 in gold. Question: should I worry that my cities are losing TOO MUCH money? Should I try to fix it? Is this a common experience or am I missing some key element to the game.

Thanks to anyone for commenting.

Spidey

[Braden]

1) Yes. AI is far more random, even replaying the same save game produces a different result when you click that “End” button sometimes.

2) Rats are great Pets. Learn to love them and their potential for the Plague and its guaranteed population reduction properties. Seriously though, squalor is a major problem and potentially an unrealistic side of the game. There isn’t any building or provision you can put in a settlement to reduce it in real terms (as far as I know). The only proven way of reducing it is moving population via recruitment of units. The key with %’s is that Face – as long as you have no Riots or Rebellions be happy.

3) Keep tabs on Governors and check for negative income traits (and other negative traits). Don’t worry too much about negative income from cities as the calculations are a pain, but as long as you make sure your Governors do not have those nasty traits and that your corruption level isn’t too high (in the faction summary screen) then you’ve done as much as most players do.

Oh, and welcome to the forums! These am da bestest!

[econ21]

1. I've played RTW for several weeks now and it seems the game is much more random that MTW (which I played for years)... Anyone have the same experience?

Honestly, no. I thought MTW was more random. But I know BI has a substantial random element.

2. Squalor. ...At about 5000-7000 population, I'm usually running about 20 to 25% squalor. Question: Is that high? Should I try to fix (and thereby increase my population rate) or just make little collars for the rats and call them pets?

I don't worry too much about squalor. I have the impression Rome, Carthage etc can reach 80%+ squalor in the late game. "Fixing" squalor seems only temporary - public health investments just seems to increase population and bring the squalor back eventually. I do build public health buildings fairly promptly to avoid plagues but even that is more of an aesthetic thing than a gameplay one (unless it's a key troop producing or frontline settlement). I just build a lot of happiness buildings to offset squalor and think hard before I build anything (esp. farms) that increases population growth.

3. Negative income streams. ... Question: should I worry that my cities are losing TOO MUCH money? Should I try to fix it? Is this a common experience or am I missing some key element to the game..

The city balance figures are totally useless, IMO, as the troop support costs are not really tied to any one city at all. Cities with negative balance are probably your big earners, as they have more people, so more tax revenue.

But what I've started doing is looking at the city details when I queue a building of economic value (e.g. a port) to see how much the income is projected to rise (the greyed icons on the income line). Sometimes you find an investment is incredibly profitable and sometimes it will have zero effect (e.g. if the trade partner of your city is your enemy). Also, as Braden says, keep an eye on your governors too - try to set taxes to high and keep your faction's balance below 50k to avoid economic vices.

[bedlam28]

Welcome to the org spidey,

Not much to add, other than to give the best advice I found when getting done by squalar;

1) never get farms past land clearance - you cant destroy them and whilst they surge your population to start, the surge continues until your city is rebelling at every turn.

2) try to avoid the Temples etc that promote the same, as its far more beneficial to choose better Trading or War than growth, you will get slaves at each city you take, and you can move men from a big city to a struggling one by making peasants and walking them to the needy city and dispersing them.

If anyone has alternative advice I'm still learning too...

Good luck and if you see a white rat in amongst the blacks his name is Bob - look after him

[sbroadbent]

1. I've played RTW for several weeks now and it seems the game is much more random that MTW (which I played for years). In MTW, you could pretty much expect the same AI reaction to whatever you did. In RTW, I've noticed I can play a faction once and it's quite easy; the next time it's like going to the dentist it's so hard. Anyone have the same experience?

Hmm, I've only played a couple campaigns as the Julli, so I haven't noticed any wide variations. My last two Julli campaigns seemed to be turning out about the same though in one Germania had gave me a bit of trouble, while in the current they have been a bit slow off the start. Gaul was fairly easy to deal with in the first but have had stronger numbers in this one. I played one previous to these two (mostly to learn how the game works), and the Brittons were the tough faction to deal with.

So, I suppose each campaign can vary, which is a good thing, though I've heard that MTW seemed to have more randomness.

2. Squalor. I know from reading the above guides that we just don't know a lot about it. I know that, as my population increases, so does my squalor. At about 5000-7000 population, I'm usually running about 20 to 25% squalor. Question: Is that high? Should I try to fix (and thereby increase my population rate) or just make little collars for the rats and call them pets?

I wouldn't say that that is very high, but your population is likewise not that high. One of the patches caps squalor at 100%. Unpatched, squalor can really cause some problems as it will keep rising. You get to 100% squalor at or around 24K population. I did some calculations, and you need to max out as many happiness buildings as you can. You can't really reduce the level of squalor in a settlement without setting you back in teching up, all you can do is build the happiness buildings to try to offset the penalties. As the population rises, you need more and more garrison troops to babysit the population. Unlike in MTW, the troops need to actually be sitting inside the city to contribute to the garrison troops. You could have 10K of troops camping outside the city gates and it won't matter.

A question I have is what is the most cost efficient unit to use as a garrison in a city? Meaning which gives the best boost to garrison for the least cost. I've used Town Watch but for 20 units of useless town watch it's 2K per turn and above 30K population I was only getting 30% boost.

The only way to reduce the squalor is to reduce the population. Ideally this is done after you've done your final government building upgrade, as the buildings you can construct are based on your palace level, rather than population. Some ideas:

- Let the settlement get captured, and then retake it. Once taken, Exterminate the population.
- Try to encourage the plague to come to your city. If necessary get some spies roaming if a plague comes up and try to get him infected. Get back to the city and hope he infects the city. I had a city of 18K drop down to 11K when the plague randomly hit one of my original cities

3. Negative income streams. Okay, I know that some cities pay more for troops than others, so they end up running a negative income stream. Still, some of my cities get to be around -700 or -1200 (particular if I'm playing the Romans). At the same time, I'm bringing in 5000 or 6000 in gold. Question: should I worry that my cities are losing TOO MUCH money? Should I try to fix it? Is this a common experience or am I missing some key element to the game.

Spidey

From what I have heard, just ignore the numbers that the city gives. From what I have heard, it divides your expenses by the number of cities to determine each city's share of the expenses. So, if your army upkeep is 10,000 and you have 10 cities, each city's share is 1,000. If one of your newly conquered cities is only producing say 500 from Farms and taxes, the game will report that city's income as -500.

[GottMitUns]

I'm new to RTW also, but so far:

Randomness: I totaly appriciate it about RTW. One thing -in retrospect- I did not like about MW was how it worked like clockwork. Save game and replay and you can expect the same exact things to happen.

Squalor: I am finding that doing everything possible to limit population while also building public health to the maximum helps. I recruit new units from cities with the highiest population/growth, rarely ever upgrade farming unless a specific city has a really really low growth rate, and make a point to exterminate the population of newly conquered cities.

The good thing about squalor is that it forces you to manage your cities rather than just build maximum populations, build up a huge war chest and fly through the turns conquering and building armies. Kind of changes the formula for this type of game. I just wish there was some way to knock squalor way down for a few turns in a well established city. Like leper colonies or ghettos or some way to isolate the dirt and the dirty to its own exlusive area some place outside the city walls. That would make a "different" battlefield veiw of a settlement, dirty poor people festering away in dirty little tent-camps crowded along the walls of the city.

[Roy1991]

The randomness is much better than in MTW, but still not very good IMO.
The movement of armies for example is pretty random, with different result if you save and reload.
But if you look to the campaign as a whole, you know nearly exactly what's going to happen.

-The Julii & Britannia conquer all of Western Europe, and both can't pull off a decisive victory over eachother.
-Either Pontus or the Greeks stake all of Asia Minor, just to be driven out by the Egyptians within several decades.
-Macedon takes out Thrace and often also Dacia.
-The Brutii take Greece & Macedonia.
-Carthage and Numidia fall to the Scipii.
etc.