Military Escort Does a Runner

[Red Peasant]

Who'd be a civilian driver in Iraq when the troops just leave you to be murdered?
Luckily, this guy got away but some of his mates didn't.

Link

edit: it works now.

[Philippus Flavius Homovallumus]

How about the massive incompetance of all the people involved?

Oops, we missed our turn.

Zero sympathy all round, I'm afraid.

[Lemur]

FWIW, Halliburton does not provide its drivers with maps. Navigation is expected to be performed by the military escort. Insane not to give the drivers every tool they might need to get the heck out, but there it is.

[Spino]

FWIW, Halliburton does not provide its drivers with maps. Navigation is expected to be performed by the military escort. Insane not to give the drivers every tool they might need to get the heck out, but there it is.

Hey man, maps cost money! What, do you think the green stuff grows on trees? Perish the thought that some post-war generation executive should have to sacrifice a few dollars worth of stock options just so some hick driver can find his way out of a shooting gallery... for shame Lemur, for shame!

[yesdachi]

That’s a heck of a career choice! His high school guidance counselor must have hated him.

[Spino]

On a serious note, why do I get the funny feeling that the military escort which cut and ran was a Nat'l Guard or Reserve unit? Can you imagine an active Army unit or, perish the thought, a Marine unit cutting and running like that?

[Major Robert Dump]

this is old

Whos the retard who planned that route through a narrow road in sigle file vehicle formation? One truck gets disabled and the rest are stuck behind him

And maybe if Texas Johnson was a little more concerned with driving his truck and a little less concerned with being a cameraman and taking pictures of bullet holes in the steering wheel his truck might not have stalled. I wonder if every one of those other drivers were doing the same thing

Not to sound flippant, but those guys weren't soldeirs, they should not have been there. I doubt the escorts were very energetic about escorting a large group of unarmed non-military targets who get paid, eat and sleep better than they do. The escort was probably civil affairs, lightly armed and maybe even chics. So the question I ask you....would them stopping have done any good or would that just mean there were two dead american soldiers and a destroyed vehicle in the body count as well??????

What a flippin circus. Any civilians who go over there to make a buck should know exactly what they are getting into, and if not they should have read the fine print in the contracts that say if they break the contract they have to find their own way home. Whatever possessed these guys to say "okay, lets go for a drive!' while unarmed I may never know(probably felons so they cant have guns ROFL even in a warzone)

Halliburton later fired the guy BTW, for work related injuries. All the contractors need to go home and stop wasting billions of dollars paid to them up front. The army could do a better job any day of the week.

[Major Robert Dump]

On a serious note, why do I get the funny feeling that the military escort which cut and ran was a Nat'l Guard or Reserve unit? Can you imagine an active Army unit or, perish the thought, a Marine unit cutting and running like that?

Bite your tongue, Guard and Reserve are getting killed over there, too.

It was NOT marines; and despite the brilliant camerawork and commentary by Texas Johnson, you weren't there, you don't know exactly what happened, and as far as any of us know that military vehicle was surrounded by small arms fire and saw some jibs pointing RPGs at it, at which point the last thing you want to do is stop the vehicle and return fire. It may have stopped up the block and engaged insurgents, the people inside it may have been seriously wounded, and, as stated before, it was prbably just a couple of soldiers who would have been just as effective in that situation getting out and trying to kung fu the insurgents.

I could really give two sheets about civilian contractors in a war zone.

[Reverend Joe]

The guy was driving fine. The problem was that the engine was shot. Not to mention the driver; you cannot drive a large stick shift vehicle with one arm, especially on rocky roads such as the one they were using.

[Scurvy]

this is old

Whos the retard who planned that route through a narrow road in sigle file vehicle formation? One truck gets disabled and the rest are stuck behind him

What a flippin circus. Any civilians who go over there to make a buck should know exactly what they are getting into, and if not they should have read the fine print in the contracts that say if they break the contract they have to find their own way home. Whatever possessed these guys to say "okay, lets go for a drive!' while unarmed I may never know(probably felons so they cant have guns ROFL even in a warzone)
.

The retard deserves to be sacked

The "civilian" rightly expects the army to look after it, even if the civilian is useless, the army still has a duty to do there job, even if this means putting themselves at risk

[lancelot]

I saw this on the news last night...the almost comical bit was the statement from the US higher ups saying that the escort didnt run but moved to find a better position to fight bravely...

I think a civillian is stupid to take such a job but on the other hand if you are gonna escort something then the least you can do is escort it well.

[Major Robert Dump]

The guy was driving fine. The problem was that the engine was shot. Not to mention the driver; you cannot drive a large stick shift vehicle with one arm, especially on rocky roads such as the one they were using.

Are you saying he was driving with one arm because he was shot? He should have been a pro at it, since he was driving with one arm prior to that because he was holding a freaking camera

How do you guys know the escort didn't go to a better position? On the words of Texas Johnson, the vo-tech dropout, who even admits in the interview "I don't know who those escorts were, but...." Was he supposed to recognize them if he saw them amongst the rescue force, did he assume they ran because they didn't come back and kiss him goodnight and tuck him in? Shame on them, killing insurgents can wait! Do you not hear the gunfire? Why didn't they converge on ALL the trucks and kill ALL the drivers, could it be that maybe JUST MAYBE they were getting engaged by these troops you guys are so convinced turn tail and fled?

"We gotta go back and rescue Texas Johnson! It doesn't matter that we are sorrounded by people firing from rooftops, and sandwiched between a broke down truck and a flipped over truck with no room to maneuver! Get out of the vehicle and give your life to go run for a guy who may already be dead! I don't care if he sounds like Slim Pickins! Get in there!"

[Mooks]

What a cowardly escort. They finally have a visible enemy that they can shoot at and kill and what do they do? Piss their pants and run home.

[Samurai Waki]

Call in an Artillery Barrage on my position!!!

[Seamus Fermanagh]

How about the massive incompetance of all the people involved?

Oops, we missed our turn.

Zero sympathy all round, I'm afraid.

A bit harsh, no? Some poor fellow looks the wrong way and steps in front of a moving bus and my first thought is not "zero sympathy."

Escort may have scarpered -- if so, they should be up on charges. Certainly their performance must be evaluated.

Mistakes happen in tense situations -- you keep working to minimize same.

Do those involved share some degree of culpability in the reported deaths? Yes. However, neither the drivers nor the escort were trying to kill members of the convoy. They are even less "at fault" then had they made a mistake which precipitated a fatal accident.

[Major Robert Dump]

It's obvious who here prefers to see the military as buffoons and cowards, rather than actually paying attention to whats going on in the video. I'm sure you all would have OMGLOLZ!!!111 at the insurgents.

[whyidie]

How do you guys know the escort didn't go to a better position?

Great question. Any answers from lions den ?

[BigTex]

What a cowardly escort. They finally have a visible enemy that they can shoot at and kill and what do they do? Piss their pants and run home.

Are you kiding me, they were on a 1 lane road, with only a couple soldiers as an escort. What are they expected to do at that point. They cleared the road ahead of the trucks, and from the sounds they didn't just abandon them. Not to mention their was a predator watching their position so I doubt highly that they abandon them, in anyway. Which is still irrelavent because Mr. Texas Johnson is a dumb*** redneck and should have been shot with his parents for shaming the great state of Texas.
____________
Speak softly and carry tactical nukes.

BigTex

Ridicolus
"Hilary Clinton is the devil"
~Texas proverb

[Tribesman]

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

That’s a heck of a career choice! His high school guidance counselor must have hated him.

Hey it could be worse , there is an idiot from just up the road who was kidnapped but eventually released , his next job is for Haliburton on Algeria.
Did you ever feic such a fruitloop in all your life
Unfortunately yes

Some people never learn , hey its great money , we got loads of really heavily armed bodyguards and everything ...
Bollox
What ya gonna do when you are an internet celbrity for sick***** around the world and your parents cannot even watch the news anymore incase it sets them off .

******* idiots , don't take the bloody job in the first place .

Sorry about all the * , but thats life innit

[Xiahou]

Here's what appears to be a longer clip. It seems (suprise, suprise) that the bbc cut the hell out of the clip to better fit their story.

[Devastatin Dave]

It's obvious who here prefers to see the military as buffoons and cowards, rather than actually paying attention to whats going on in the video. I'm sure you all would have OMGLOLZ!!!111 at the insurgents.

Nothing new...

[BigTex]

Here's what appears to be a longer clip. It seems (suprise, suprise) that the bbc cut the hell out of the clip to better fit their story.

Yes some more wonderful even and unbiased reporting by the bbc....... What the first "video" misses is that the humvee that pulls off is actually escorting the truck ahead of him. Not to mention on the tape it sounded like there was another humvee behind them.
______________
Speak softly and carry tactical nukes.

BigTex

Ridicolus
"Hilary Clinton is the devil"
~Texas proverb

[Scurvy]

. Which is still irrelavent because Mr. Texas Johnson is a dumb*** redneck and should have been shot with his parents for shaming the great state of Texas.

Thats not very nice, he was only doing his job,

the second vid makes it clear that the escort didnt mess up too bad well done to the bbc for another bit of completely unbiased reporting

[Tribesman]

It seems (suprise, suprise) that the bbc cut the hell out of the clip to better fit their story.

yes Xiahou , they just killed him Oh my god they just killed him, and of course the cavalry came into the rescue and he wasn't really dead as the cavalry refused to obey their orders an returned to the ambush...hmmmm that was a nice house wasn't it , the seventh one on the right , I am surprised the BBC included a nice house in their footage since nice houses don't fit their agenda .

[Spino]

Bite your tongue, Guard and Reserve are getting killed over there, too.

Who said they were not getting killed? I simply called into question the competency and dedication of Guard and Reserve troops as compared to Marines and other active military units. Take note that Guard and Reserve enlistment is down while active service enrollment is either flat or up; clearly the average person inclined to join the Guard or Reserve isn't interested in seeing any kind of action. Furthermore, based on every documentary or special I've seen on the Iraq conflict there is an unusual amount of grumbling and resentment coming from Guard and Reserve units, often drawing an unfavorable comparison their active Army & Marine counterparts who don't exhibit nearly the same level of disdain for their assignments.

I could really give two sheets about civilian contractors in a war zone.

Well bully for you. True, these civilian contractors knew the risks when they signed up but like it or not they are instrumental in our overall effort to rebuild Iraq's infrastructure. Coalition troops can't do everything, especially since they're seemingly shorthanded as it is. Do you honestly believe the existing military assets in Iraq are sufficient to do the job by themselves? Taking a devil may care attitude with regard to the life of civilian contractors in missions like these only makes our job harder.

I also think you're taking some people's criticism of this particular escort unit a tad too personally. Regardless of whether this is indeed a case of cowardice or that the video footage is woefully inadequate for telling the whole story I do not believe everyone in this thread is judging the entire US armed forces based on a single incident.

Which is still irrelavent because Mr. Texas Johnson is a dumb*** redneck and should have been shot with his parents for shaming the great state of Texas.

What planet are you from?

[Major Robert Dump]

I don't think the even the BBs version shows that the escort messed up. furthermore, the version released on Ogrish a year ago doesn't show it either. Clearly, if there were any screw up it were the choice of route for the convoy, which may not have even been the escorts fault anyway. You also have to keep in mind that in tight neighborhoods like that the insurgents create blockades to hinder movement and intelligence.

This guy in the convoy was expecting everyone to stop and come back for him. Taking a shot in the arm does not prevent one from hopping into one of the passing trucks, nor apparently, does it prevent you from using a video camera and making whiney commentary the entire time. If this guys intent was to play dead and hope the insurgents passed him by, screaming into the camera and holding it up to take pictures is not the way to do it.

He panicked. They all panicked. Several trucks got disabled. People were yelling into the radio. I highly doubt he was on the same frequency as the escort, probably only the convoy leader was. So if the CO watching on the predator tells the escorts to keep pushing out of the hot zone, the CO most likely has no idea which truckers are alive and which are not. May be hard for the escorts to communicate that info because, ya know, they are in a firefight and may even be wounded

And, as I stated before, this guy didn't even know who his escorts were, so how can he be a good judge of whether or not they stayed in the area? If he were abandoned and not rescued for 45 mins, why didn't he get killed them? What kept the insurgents off him? Coalition bullets maybe?

One thing I am curious about is where they convoy was headed, what they were carrying that it took such a low priority (1 escort) and whether or not the two escorts survived. Personally, as the guy on the other end of the predator watching it unfold, if I thought the situation was too much for my soldiers I would not send them back for the truckers and rather order them to supress and hold ground. I'd rather lose 7 civilian truck drivers than 7 truckers and 2 soldiers.

[Major Robert Dump]

Spino: no, of course I dont think the existing military resources are enough to do the job in Iraq without contractors. Of course, had we used the funds funneled to contractors instead on military assets then yes, as a matter of fact, I do believe they could handle it. This is all hindsight of course.

It's not a devil may care attitude. Read the last line of the post just above this one

[Scurvy]

I agree with most of that, but i think the military have to take into account the complete uselessness of civilians, obviously the drivers would panic...they are'nt trained for it, therefore they need to ve thoroughly looked after (ie. radio set for them etc. - although i realise this could be difficult)

again your complete disdain for civilian lives in combat seems a bit much, i would argue that putting the soldiers at risk is better than putting the civilian at risk, they know what they are in for, and are trained to deal with it...

[Major Robert Dump]

again your complete disdain for civilian lives in combat seems a bit much, i would argue that putting the soldiers at risk is better than putting the civilian at risk, they know what they are in for, and are trained to deal with it...

Complete disdain for civilian lives in combat? Heh. How, exactly, does saying I wouldnt send troops into certain death to save a convoy thats already been lost mean i have complete disregard for civilian lives?

Those truck drivers were not innocent Iraqi civilians. Those truckers were civilian contractors getting financially compensated -- very well I might add -- and were also all adults. They made the decision to leave the comfy states and go into a warzone to make some money. Haliburton didn't trick them and tell them they would be on a fishing boat for the summer up in Alaska. I fail to see how sacrificing soldiers would have changed the outcome of that video.

Do I want to see American (or any other contractors) killed? Of course not. Do I put more value on the life of a Iraqi civilian than the life of a contractor? No, but while the values are eqaul they are also of different types. Obviously, those trucks weren't carrying nuclear warheads or school children. And whether I'm on the ground in combat or watching a drone video and calling the shots, the focus is going to be on us killing the badguys -- an intergral part of which is us staying alive -- not running in and trying some bravado crap to save a truck driver.

Those soldiers did far more good for the overall mission by keeping themselves alive and killing insurgents than by running in and getting shot up trying to rescue Texas Johnson.

[Philippus Flavius Homovallumus]

I think that the mistake seems to have been when the escort took a wrong turn.

Aside from that, I've seen a couple of other videos where American regs panicked, cut and run. The only one where it turned out properly was when there was a Brit in with them and he had the gunner lay down the rounds with the 50. cal.

If you go into a war zone you're dead until you come out again.