The Godfather, Part 2 [Concluded]

[Seamus Fermanagh]

Just remember, I sleep with one eye open, one foot on the floor and one hand on the trigger of my 12 gague....

...Jillian's still not sleeping through the night?

[Seamus Fermanagh]

I realize this argument has been had in all the other games before, as well as this game, but lets see if I understand this:

-Last round, our chances of lynching an innocent is 22:3, including a lynch of the detective
-We will lose two innocents per round regardless, yet by lynching we guarantee we lose 3, taking into account the 22:3 curve
-I know it makes for boring play, but until we have a smaller pool of innocents, our chances of a good lynching is not increased...if we lose 2 per round our chances will go 20:3/18:3/16:3/14:3...if we lose 3 per round we will taper more quickly to the kill zone at 19:3/16:3/13:3/11:3 but we will also more quickly reach the point where the mafia have the upperhand because of their voting advantage. This, of course, is all assuming our lynchings up to that point have all been bad lynchings. In the case of a good lynching, which we wouldn't know until the next morning after the mob kills are posted, our raw chances of lynching the right person would go down, but our voting and guilt by association reasoning would give us the upperhand.

The basic mathematics of this are correct, lynchings do enhance the "hitting percentage" at the risk of the mafia getting to the point of no return more quickly. That's the basic tension of the game.

However, in this internet version, unless players are forced to vote -- and support and discuss same -- there is no hope of discovering the mafia save by the detective who can reveal only half as fast as the mafia can eliminate. The odds of the detective identifying all 3 mafiosi prior to getting whacked are longer than I'd like to rely on. Lynchings force commentary and voting patterns which can then be used to make targeted lynchings -- at least that's the hope.

It's also why inactives who don't vote at all get removed by the GM and why folks who don't engage in discussion can find themselves on the wrong end of a lynching.

[Cowhead418]

Tally:
Abstain: 11 votes
Drisos: 3 votes
Divine Wind: 2 votes
GeneralHankerchief: 2 votes
Dutch_guy, theRTWGuru and Ignoramus: 1 vote each

Hmmm... I've got a different tally:
Drisos: 3 votes (Me, Sasaki, Crazed Rabbit)
Don C: 3 votes (Drisos, RTWGuru, Sir Moody)
Divine Wind: 2 votes (Major Robert Dump, Xiahou)
GHC: 1 vote (Peasant Phill)
Dutch Guy: 1 vote (BKS)
RTWGuru: 1 vote (Husar)
Ignoramus: 1 vote (Ignoramus)

This means there should be a re-vote based on the tie.

[Seamus Fermanagh]

My tally is off too. I had counted Byz-Knight and thought it 4 drisos from that. Silver?

[Drisos]

Hmmm... I've got a different tally:
Drisos: 3 votes (Me, Sasaki, Crazed Rabbit)
Don C: 3 votes (Drisos, RTWGuru, Sir Moody)
Divine Wind: 2 votes (Major Robert Dump, Xiahou)
GHC: 1 vote (Peasant Phill)
Dutch Guy: 1 vote (BKS)
RTWGuru: 1 vote (Husar)
Ignoramus: 1 vote (Ignoramus)

This means there should be a re-vote based on the tie.

Thanks m8! I might even survive!

I missed Don on the list as well... and he had 3 votes iirc. I claim a tie! Bring me back from the dead!

[Sasaki Kojiro]

Yeah, ByzKnight isn't playing. Or perhaps Silver was posting while Drisos was changing his vote.

Anyway, Don, Myrddraal mentioned the Lemurs enemies thing as well.

[Death Match]

R.I.P the dead. May our detective find the mafiosi quickly....

[Silver Rusher]

Midnight in the Gameroom. All is quiet.

Divine Wind was busy sleeping on the couch in the police office when suddenly the roof was pulled off and the wind howled in.

"Wha... wha... what the heck?!" DW got up with a start and looked up to the sky. Before he knew it, Silver Rusher's gleaming, gold hair-covered face appeared in the clouds.

"WHO MADE THAT TALLY?!" SR's voice beamed into the house of DW.

"Err... I forget. What's wrong with it, though?"

"I WILL TELL YOU WHAT'S WRONG WITH IT! Drisos SHOULD STILL BE ALIVE, AS YOU HAVE THE SAME NUMBER OF VOTES AS HIM!"

"Aww, do I have to?"

"YES! OF COURSE YOU HAVE TO! HOW DARE YOU ASK SUCH AN INSOLENT QUESTION?"

The doorbell rang.

"Hang on, let me just get that..." DW opened the door to see a huge, angry mob of Gameroom residents standing outside. He immediately shut it and quickly spun around, with a shocked expression on his face. "Huh..huh..huhuh... Lemme just sort this out, OK God?" He opened the door again and started talking to the mob.

"Keep it down in there!"

"We have to go to work tomorrow!"

"We're trying to sleep!"

"Listen," DW yelled out to the crowd, "Drisos should not have been executed. There should be a tie vote between me and him. The tally was wrong."

A bolt of lightning hit an empty spot in the crowd, and Drisos appeared, looking dased and confused.

"Cast your votes now, people. Me or Drisos. Who are you going to lynch?"

The Correct Tally:
Abstain: 11
Divine Wind: 3
Drisos: 3
GeneralHankerchief and Don Corleone: 2 votes each
theRTWGuru and Ignoramus: 1 vote each

Note: In a tie-vote, you may abstain but you may not Vote: No Lynch. As long as you voted in the original round, however, no warning will be handed out. You may only vote for Divine Wind or Drisos, or you can abstain.

[Major Robert Dump]

Oh dear, I needs to sleep on this.

on second thought, since I can't edit, my vote still stands with Divine Wind. I don't like the chief of Police role as the likelihood that he could be mafia, so I'll vote the Chief no matter who it is. Sorry DW, its best to keep the untouchable Chief-thingy rotating. Of course, any detective please feel free to chime in via a PM and I may change my vote if I beleive you, either way I think I'm doomed to a horrible death...theres no reason to believe I'm not mafia, and no reason for the mafia not to kill me.

In my own defense, the selection of Drisos seemed purely numerical circumstance. The only person I don't trust is all of you. If Drisos were CP I would vote him just as well.

vote: Divine Wind

[Sigurd]

Note: In a tie-vote, you may abstain but you may not Vote: No Lynch.

Damn... we are barking up the wrong tree here.
Vote:Abstain

[Peasant Phill]

Sorry haven't had enough time to go true all the posts so
Vote: Abstain

[Sir Moody]

Vote: Divine Wind

honestly i dont think either ar emafia but we have to kill someone and the rebel in me says lynching the police chief is a good thing

[Dutch_guy]

Vote: Drisos

I don't think it's best if we rotate our chief of police, yet. We have no evidence against him, and if there ever will be I'm sure the detective will find out.
It just doens't feel right to change the CoP now, what if he's innocent and we put a mafioso on the position ?

Sorry Drisos, but this just seems best to me.

[Seamus Fermanagh]

Vote: Drisos

I accept the idea that someone has to go -- but I'd like to see others commenting more. The only real purpose to an early execution -- aside from the Godfather catching the chop due to random luck -- is to generate voting records and commentary/rationale for same to produce a body of evidence.

So far, the primary reason for Divine Wind getting cross-bolted to a wall is that another Godfather in another game got picked as the police chief, so that requires us to kill our top cop immediately in this game. His posting behavior hasn't been outlandish, so....

Mind you, I hope a detective has done a quick exam of D.W., since he can only get whacked in a lynching, we'll need some warning if he is hinky.

The surprisingly resilient Drisos (btw, lethal injection is better, too many people don't die promptly when electrocuted!!) drew a modicum of suspicion for the style of his early discussion. This is thin evidence at best, and I was tempted to abstain for that reason, but I will support the effort to move forward.

Silver, if possible, a list of votes with names/initials at the executions would help us tally/excel chart geeks keep up. My chart still does not jibe with yours

[Husar]

Vote: Abstain.

I'm a lot more curious about other persons.

All we ever have to go on for sussing out mafiosos are from who they kill. Yeah, it's the first round, but if you look back through the other games Lemur was in, it's become almost an Org joke to harass or lynch him. It's weak, I know, but it's the first round. We gotta start somewhere.

We as in you and the other two mafiosi?

R.I.P the dead. May our detective find the mafiosi quickly....

Those four points actually bother me as they may mean you gotta hide something, for example your real opinion.

Of course, any detective please feel free to chime in via a PM and I may change my vote if I beleive you, either way I think I'm doomed to a horrible death...theres no reason to believe I'm not mafia, and no reason for the mafia not to kill me.

Now given you were Mafia and the detective really made the mistake of PMing you?(I know I could have PMed you pretending to be the detective, but I feel like a nice guy today and it might not be kosher with Silver)
Anyway:

Just a couple things I noticed.

[Don Corleone]

So Cowhead and Drisos got the count wrong, I'm not the run-off candidate?

Between the two, Drisos has contributed more to the ongoing discussion and has made more statements by which he could be called into account later. Divine Wind has made those kinds of statements that can be reconstrued later.

I've got my eye on a couple of other folks that are saying enough to actually show up as not zero in a ranking of postings, but don't actually say anything. I would much prefer to vote for one of them, but as I'm limited to one of two options:

Unvote: Abstain
Vote: Divine Wind

[Sasaki Kojiro]

Vote:Drisos

The first round is the round where the Chief of Police is least likely to be mafia. With less people there is a greater chance of him being a mafioso. If we leave the same person as CoP the detective can investigate him instead of having to investigate each new CoP.

[Proletariat]

We as in you and the other two mafiosi?

Oh, for God's sake... Yes, Husar. 'We' as in myself and the other mafioso.



If it wasn't obvious to anyone else, I was referring to the villagers.

[GeneralHankerchief]

We're giving the Detective way too much trouble if we keep killing off our cops. Let him get a good read on DW first.

Vote: Drisos

[Divine Wind]

Gah!

Well im sure your probably innocent Drisos, but I have to look after my own skin mate.

Vote: Drisos

Id just like to remind the detective to investigate me, and see im an innocent Chief of Police just trying to make a living.

If I am investigated and proved innocent, I will benefit the town as I will be one less person that can be touched by the Mafia, raising the chances of us actually lynching one of them. This will be useful at the end of the game, as i would be one less suspect. I realise the detective wont reveal im innocent for quite a few rounds, but its worth keeping me for the reason I cant actually be touched.

Something to think about I guess.

Oh and question for Silver Rusher. If I am killed can I still think up the executions?

[Major Robert Dump]

unvote: divine wind
vote: drisos

One vote is shaky as the other. You're right about the detective vs the CoP. We will never find out as the detective takes a day to get results.

As for me saying the detective should send PMs and possibly getting PMs from people who were posing as the detective, well thats exactly what I want, thats exactly what I would expect, and I don't see why Silver would disapprove as it adds substance and confusion to the game. I'm not mafia, but alas no one took the bait into trying to fool the nooblet

[Divine Wind]

The detective should not start pm'ing members just yet, incase he accidently pms a mafia, and would surely be executed in the next round. We need the detective to stay alive as long as possible.

This is the only way of ensuring victory for the villagers.

[Drisos]

Now this is weird... the choice seems to be between me and Divine Wind. I'm possibly a mafioso, but it's also possible that I'm the detective. Divine wind can have only mafioso as special role. So, basically, why on earth are you taking me down instead of him? Now I'm not the detective, but you people can't know that.

This voting for me is pretty massive... keep it in mind for the endgame, where you'll notice I was innocent and I can have a little nitpick. (with a big :P)

gah.. well I'll be dead soon, this time, really. I'm not going to speculate after the dead, after being killed twice no seriously, I'm busy enough.

btw nice write-up, Silver Rusher.

[Big King Sanctaphrax]

Vote: Drisos.

There's not very much between them, to be honest, but voting for the CoP on the basis that GH was mafia in the last game seems like a really silly idea, so Drisos it is.

Are we allowed to reveal ourselves as the detective by PM in this game? I ask as in Kage's game it was a public reveal or not at all. I don't have a problem with private reveals, personally.

[Husar]

Oh, for God's sake... Yes, Husar. 'We' as in myself and the other mafioso.

Now you are angry because I discovered your mistake?

If it wasn't obvious to anyone else, I was referring to the villagers.

That's what you say now.

[Divine Wind]

Hmmm... I've got a different tally:
Drisos: 3 votes (Me, Sasaki, Crazed Rabbit)
Don C: 3 votes (Drisos, RTWGuru, Sir Moody)
Divine Wind: 2 votes (Major Robert Dump, Xiahou)
GHC: 1 vote (Peasant Phill)
Dutch Guy: 1 vote (BKS)
RTWGuru: 1 vote (Husar)
Ignoramus: 1 vote (Ignoramus)

This means there should be a re-vote based on the tie.

Wooooah!

Hang on, is it just me or is the voting here wrong again? Should this not be between Drisos and Don? I just went back and could only see two votes for myself, so why am I up for a vote anyway?

I think youve counted it up wrong SR.

[Don Corleone]

I asked about that, Divine Wind.

On a side-note, can the mafia execute our Chief of Police?

[Husar]

I asked about that, Divine Wind.

On a side-note, can the mafia execute our Chief of Police?

I think not, which leads me to my next point that pretending to be a noob is a pretty good Mafia cover, don't you think, Don?

And keep in mind that I am throwing around attacks, which makes me very likely to be Mafia as well, doesn't it? Now I gotta think of a defense argument against that...

[Xiahou]

Guess I'll stick with my first impression:
vote: DW

[Don Corleone]

I think not, which leads me to my next point that pretending to be a noob is a pretty good Mafia cover, don't you think, Don?

And keep in mind that I am throwing around attacks, which makes me very likely to be Mafia as well, doesn't it? Now I gotta think of a defense argument against that...

I thought about that. What's more, if somebody else were mafia, wouldn't it be in their best interest to keep me in the game for as long as possible, slowing down the discussion and making you all revisit logic puzzles you've solved long ago. Truthfully, I think it's nice that you strive to keep newbies in for a little extra time, but the cold hard logic is even if you're pretty sure they're not mafia, you've got to kill every newbie, cause they slow down the discussion and reduce the ability to put things in perspective. Wait, did I just make an argument for y'all to do me in?

Okay, if the mafia cannot kill the chief of police, that changes my vote (though I would really hope the chief of police would be top of the list for the detective).

Unvote: Divine Wind
Vote: Drisos

Sorry Drisos, nothing personal. Just cold hard logic.