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  1. #1
    Senior Member Senior Member econ21's Avatar
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    Default Re: The Will of the Senate - Senate Deliberations IV

    [NUMERIUS AUREOLUS]: Legate Mamillus, do not worry, your qualities are not overlooked by all who serve the Republic.

    Senators, I believe now is the time to discuss Rome's future direction. The Consul has done a superb job bringing down Carthage. She now stands as an empty shell of her former self, her generals skulking in barren desert provinces while Roman civilisation begins to take root in her great cities.

    Where now should Rome look for the next challenge? Senators, I believe we face a clear choice: east or west?

    There are some here, I fear the Consul himself is among them, who believe the right direction is west. There are calls here to prepare for war against Iberia. I support those calls. Those who wish for peace should prepare for war. Strengthening our western defences is only prudent.

    But I emphatically do not support the demand that we start a war of aggression. It would be reckless and bloodthirsty to start a new war with Iberia. Have we forgotten that we are still engaged in four other bloody wars - with Seleucia, Ptolemy, Thrace and Carthage? Only this season, Praetor Coruncanius had to fend off a Consular sized army of Thracians. Senators, we have enough fighting on our hands already! Senators, a war of aggression is not the Roman way. We do not start wars - we finish them! To spill the blood of Romans and innocents for mere conquest and greed is dishonorable. But there is no greater honour than to fight to defend our homeland and to end war.

    Senators, it may be that the day will come when we must strike Iberia. If, like Gaul under the reign of Consul Lucius Aemillus, she marches into our lands and clearly intends to strike at us, then a pre-emptive move would be justified. Indeed, the constitution allows such a strike without a Senate vote for a declaration of war. But that day has not yet come. Iberian armies do sometimes wander deep into our lands. But successive Consuls have shown great restraint and the wandering Iberians have done no harm to us. Iberia does not intend to attack us at this time.

    This has been proved beyond all doubt by the current Consul. His stunning and bold Viberi maneouvre, which I opposed, showed beyond all doubt that Iberia is not presently interested in taking our settlements - even if offered up undefended. She is fixed on her war with Germania and for as long as that continues, we may be able to avoid war with her. I say we let sleeping dogs lie. Indeed, we should support our ally Germania, with gifts of gold, to keep this conflict running for as long as possible.

    Instead of launching a great conflagration in the west, I say this: let us use this window of opportunity to settle old scores in the east. Seleucia and Ptolemy are still great powers, with vast hinterland resources. Only this season, we have seen Prusa - a settlement well within our borders - stand against us, as rebels loyal to Seleucia. Let us move decisively against these vile Successor states. Do not forget their unprovoked attacks on us. Do not forget the Co-Consul, my mentor, Publis Pansa, lying dead on the field at Maronia. Do not forget their armies ranging deep into Thrace, forcing Lucius Aemilius to adopt scorched earth tactics while we scrambled to muster the men needed to stop them. Let us not let them regain their former strength. If pitiful Thrace can summon up a Consular army to try to breach our frontier, how many such armies do we think Seleucia and Ptolemy can produce in the next six years? No, passivity in the face of such potential, such danger, is folly.

    Senators, after the next election, I plead with you: unleash me. Let Legio V and the other armies of the east march. Let us march, yes, right down to Antioch. But then further - to the Nile and to destroy Ptolemy. Let us seize the western cities of Seleucia - rip out her heart and let Parthia and the other eastern factions feast on her dying corpse. Our future must not be a war without end. We must impose a Pax Romana and allow our citizens to enjoy the fruits of their labours, without the burden of endless military campaigns.

    Senators, we have sat on the defensive in the east for too long. It offers vastly richer pickings than Gaul and Iberia. It houses our real enemies - factions of great power. The east is where we must go. Turning west would only needlessly create new enemies and deliver a few barbarian villages.

    In the past, I have been accused of warmongering, of recklessly pressing for expansion in the east. Those charges were false, baseless lies. I started no wars, but merely worked hard to end two: with Macedon and Greece. This I achieved: my men slew the last King of Macedon and the last King of Greece. I say - let us provide the same service to the oppressed peoples of the Kingdoms of Seleucia and Ptolemy.

    The lies told against me were malliciously spun by a vast Aemilli conspiracy seeking to set up myself and Praetor Coruncanius in order to advance the political ambitions of my late step-father, Augustus Verginius and Marcellus Aemillius. Unforeseen events frustrated that coalition but I fear it is on the march again. My step-father may rest in the earth, perhaps roaming the underworld in search of more Gauls to slay. But Marcellus still stands, frustrated but powerful - the de facto ruler of Afrika. I have no doubt he regards as his right the Consulship, which was his to claim four years ago but which he fumbled. He is resentful of his nephew assuming power before him and will stop at little to secure what he considers rightly his.

    But this time things are different from when the lies were first told against me. Now we are indisputably at war in east and it is my rivals, not me, who stand as the warmongers. And it is expansion in the west that is reckless, while an advance eastwards is only prudent. I say we move east and I intend to stand for Consul on that platform. Who will stand behind me?

  2. #2
    Oza the Sly: Vandal Invasion Member Braden's Avatar
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    Default Re: The Will of the Senate - Senate Deliberations IV

    Senators,

    I for one would like nothing better than to finally settle our issues with the Seleucids. Placed as I am, on our far Eastern border and with a Consular sized formation, it seems that I am ideally placed to strike against our enemies here and put these whelps to flight.

    I am, at the behest of the Republic and will follow her instruction to the letter.

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    AO Viking's Tactician Member Lucjan's Avatar
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    Default Re: The Will of the Senate - Senate Deliberations IV

    Numerious, are you so bold as to presume to make a bid for the next consulship before mine has even ended? This does not insult me, it shows ambition, willingness to carry on my actions where I have left off.

    However..I do not feel that such extensive eastward expansion would yet benefit the strengths of the Republic. If Marcellus promises to maintain the borders "as is" in our Asian lands, when my consulship ends, I will stand behind him should he make a bid for the consulship. Provided there is nothing of any significance that I would have to dispute him on.

    As for the specifics of my stance on Asia...I would agree to expansion only to the settlement of Sinope and the isle of Cyprus.
    Last edited by Lucjan; 11-10-2006 at 13:57.

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    Research Shinobi Senior Member Tamur's Avatar
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    Default Re: The Will of the Senate - Senate Deliberations IV

    (letter from Appius Barbatus)

    I for one, Senators, will stand with Senator Aureolus on this issue. I have been here in the East for some time now, seeing the people and buildings and farms and mines of these new provinces. And there is wealth here beyond anything that Iberia could offer; anything, I say, short of Rome itself.

    Copper mines? Pah. Let us talk of iron, gold, rubies, diamonds, trees of myrrh and cyprus, and the black water they burn here instead of tallow. All these riches, and only the ghosts of what once were the mighty empires of Seleucia and Aegyptus to face for them.

    How can we possibly consider taking the war to Iberia? In six years do we wish to give our legionaries land for their families where they must live in the mud hovels of the barbarians? Or do we wish to give them a reward fitting to their unwavering service, a land rich in civilisation and wealth?

    The citizens of Seleucia and the Ptolemites cry out to us to free them, to bring the peace of good Roman government, of law, the Gods, and the legions. Let us not lay aside this opportunity, or spill good Roman blood to defeat dirty-haired barbarians who will give us nothing in return but their fleas.
    Last edited by Tamur; 11-10-2006 at 21:11.
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    Default Re: The Will of the Senate - Senate Deliberations IV

    Ah, our esteemed Numerius Aureolus makes his presence known once again in our hallowed halls. I almost missed his ranting and warmongering in here. Almost.

    Quote Originally Posted by Numerius Aureolus
    But I emphatically do not support the demand that we start a war of aggression.
    Quote Originally Posted by Numerius Aureolus
    Senators, after the next election, I plead with you: unleash me. Let Legio V and the other armies of the east march. Let us march, yes, right down to Antioch. But then further - to the Nile and to destroy Ptolemy. Let us seize the western cities of Seleucia - rip out her heart and let Parthia and the other eastern factions feast on her dying corpse. Our future must not be a war without end. We must impose a Pax Romana and allow our citizens to enjoy the fruits of their labours, without the burden of endless military campaigns.
    Come on, Senator. You used to be much more persuasive than this. And I am anything but the de facto ruler of Afrika. As we speak, I am currently marching to the minor port of Lepcis Magna with a Praetorian-sized force, while Flavius Pacuvius commands his mighty army and takes the major coastal cities.

    Senator Aureolus' words betray him. Listen to his language. "Unleash me," he says. He wishes to take Legio V all the way down the Levant to the Nile in order "to destroy Ptolemy." And then, for Seleucia, he wants to "rip out her heart and let Parthia and the other eastern factions feast on her dying corpse."

    And he calls me a warmonger. Wow.

    Our Eastern border is now stable, thanks to the motion passed in the midterm session. But once the Carthaginian Expedition is finished, we will now border Iberia pretty much everywhere. From the Strait of Gibralter to the forests of Germania, there will be a tense peace between the two great powers of the West. Soon, it will break. They are barbarians, they know nothing other than war. We much teach them, brand it into them, that war with Rome is folly.

    If we head east, we risk disturbing our borders and making Rome no longer the center of the Republic. But if we go west, we further secure our borders, get rid of an extremely dangerous enemy, and, once again, making Rome the center and most important city of our great Republic.
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  6. #6
    Bureaucratically Efficient Senior Member TinCow's Avatar
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    Default Re: The Will of the Senate - Senate Deliberations IV

    I also stand with Senator Aureolus. Our many wars have begun for numerous different reasons, but our objectives have always been the same: benefits for the Roman people, be they in security, wealth, slaves, or other things. There is little to be gained from Iberia. The barbarians are of little threat to our trained Legions, especially with the strong border that Consul Servius Aemilius has so masterfully constructed.

    Yet in the East, Seleucia and Ptolemy control vast and prosperous territories. With Italy, Greece, Macedon and Carthage already under our control, the Eastern territories are the only rich lands in the known world not subject to Republican rule. Wars must be fought for the benefit of the Roman people. There is no benefit to be had in Iberian territories. Let us continue to push eastwards.


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    Senior Member Senior Member econ21's Avatar
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    Default Re: The Will of the Senate - Senate Deliberations IV

    [NUMERIUS AUREOLUS]: I am grateful for the support from some of my esteemed colleagues in the Senate.

    Marcellus, you do realise that a warmonger is someone who starts wars? And not someone who finishes them? Here, we have another name for a man, like myself, who wants to defeat his enemies and works relentlessly to achieve that. We call him a Roman.

    If you propose merely to wait for war to break out with Iberia, I have no quarrel with you and apologise for ascribing to you a position you do not hold. But if you seek to start that war, then you do indeed deserve the name of a warmonger.

    Tell us, Senator, suppose you were not the de facto ruler of Afrika, but of Rome herself, what would you have us do?

  8. #8
    AO Viking's Tactician Member Lucjan's Avatar
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    Default Re: The Will of the Senate - Senate Deliberations IV

    It seems decided then. Our work in fortifying the frontiers has been completed almost in its entirety. Finishing Carthage's last coastal lands in the west is all that truly remains, and then our focus can be extended solely to the east. I will leave the next consul with a Rome that has never before been so secure in her own borders, is growing ever more secure and happy in her own lands, and is ready to take on the task of putting the remaining successor states in their place, beneath the foot of Roman might!

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