New WWI IH

[Ferret]

Just checking interest and rules atm. This is the sign up phase, the game will start in late June/early July. THIS IS NOT HISTORICALLY ACCURATE!

Map:


Factions:
Great Britain - Julian the apostate
France - woad&fangs
Russia - Sarmatian
Germany - empty
Austria-Hungary - empty
Ottoman Empire - makaikhaan

Scandinavian League (Denmark, Sweden, Finland, Norway) - SwedishFish
Coalition of the Lowlands (Belgium and Holland) - scottishranger
Italy - Lt. Pinard
Serbia - shlin28
Bulgaria - Sarathos
Romania - {BHC}AntiWarmanCake88
Greece - King Jan III Sobieski
Iberia (Spain and Portugal) - Caius
Switzerland - Baby Boomer

Leaders:

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

Britain: John French, Douglas Haig, John Jellicoe, Horatio Herbert Kitchener, Lloyd George, Asquith

France: Raymond Poincaré, Georges Clemenceau, Joseph Joffre, Ferdinand Foch, Robert Nivelle, Philippe Pétain

Russia: Nikolas II, Grand Duke Nicholas Nikolaevich, Alexander Samsonov, Paul von Rennenkampf, Nikolai Ivanov, Aleksei Brusilov

Germany: Wilhelm II, Erich von Falkenhayn, Paul von Hindenburg, Reinhard Scheer, Erich Ludendorff, Dieter von Franken

Austria-Hungary: Franz Josef I, Karl I, Conrad von Hötzendorf, Arthur Arz von Straussenburg, Anton Haus, Maximilian Njegovan

Ottoman Empire: Mehmed V, İsmail Enver, Wilhelm Souchon, Otto Liman von Sanders, Mustafa Kemal, Nafiz

Scandinavian League: Bjorn, Hjalmar, Lars, Torvald

Coalition of the Lowlands: Albert I, Dries

Italy: Victor Emmanuel III, Luigi Cadorna, Armando Diaz, Luigiof Abruzzi

Serbia: Radomir Putnik, Petar Bojović

Bulgaria: Vladimir Vazov, Nikola Zhekov

Romania: Constantin Prezan, Alexandru Averescu

Greece: Hippolytus, Antiphos

Iberia: Cristobal, Eduardo, Alfonso, Julio

Switzerland: Henrik, Wolfgang

Populations (stolen from Motep )

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

France - 39,500,000
United Kingdom - 45,500,000
Germany - 67,000,000
Ottoman - 21,000,000
Russia - 159,000,000
Italy - 35,600,000
Austria-Hungary - 51,500,000
Serbia - 4,500,000
Bulgaria - 5,500,000
Iberia - 46,000,000
Switzerland - 4,000,000
Greece - 4,800,000
Scandinavian League - 30,000,000
Coalition of the Lowlands - 12,500,000
Romania - 5,000,000

Starting Military: (also stolen from Motep )

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

France - 8,400,000
United Kingdom - 8,900,000
Germany - 11,000,000
Ottoman - 2,900,000
Russia - 12,000,000
Italy - 5,600,000
Austria-Hungary - 7,800,000
Serbia - 700,000
Bulgaria - 1,200,000
Spain - 8,650,000
Switzerland - 500,000
Greece - 300,000
Scandinavian League- 1,500,000
Coalition of the Lowlands - 800,000
Romania - 900,000

Rules:

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

money:
starting treasury=amount of leaders*1 million

income=1/2 population per turn

defences:
standard trench:costs 80,000 per cm on map and takes 1 turn to build. Each cm holds 50,000 infantry max.

fortified trench:costs 150,000per cm on map and takes 1 turn to build, requires trench already in place. Each cm holds 50,000 infantry max.

underground dugouts (bonus from artillery):costs 200,000 per cm on map and takes 2 turns to build, requires fortified trench in place. Each cm holds 40,000 infantry max.

artillery: costs 10,000 per battery, used to bombard enemy before an assault. Costs 1,000 per turn for each battery while firing. Can cause 60-360 casualties per turn of firing per battery. 1cm range on a 200% version of the map.

upgrade soldiers: (note that it is only possible to advance men up one tier per turn, no jumps from untrained to elite)

untrained:newly recruited soldiers.Can recruit up to 10% of population each
turn for 1 per person.

standard:all starting soldiers are standard, costs 1 per soldier otherwise.

specialised: costs 5 per soldier

elite: costs 10 per soldier

best of the best:costs 15 per soldier

population:goes up by 5% per turn, can be gained faster through conquest.

technology:
light tanks:100,000 to initially research and then 500 per tank.

heavy tanks:a further 200,000 to research and then 1,000 per tank. Far more effective than light tanks.

gas:200,000 to research, 2 per soldier for gas masks. Effective against defences. 1,000 per gas bomb.

machine guns:50,000 to research and a further 200 per gun, can only be used in defence.

armies: can be of any size but may only move into enemy territory if they number at lest 50,000, must be commanded by a leader unless garrisoning a fort or city.

orders:send me what soldiers will accompany each leader which defences will be built, and research for new technology, the places each army will head towards and any upgrades you wish to purchase. I will post the deadline for the next set of orders.

alliances:
GB-France-Russia
Germay-AH-Ottomans
all others neutral but can join the main alliances publicly or privately and may even form their own alliance (eg-balklans alliance between Serbia, Bulgaria and Romania)

battles:if two forces hit each other then I will use the following method of deciding the battle:

army strength:
soldiers:untrained:0.1 each, attack and defence.
standard:0.5 each, attack and defence.
specialised:1 each, attack and defence.
elite:1.5 each, attack and defence.
best of the best:2.5 each, attack and defence.

light tanks:30 attack and 40 defence
heavy tanks:50 attack and 60 defence

machine guns:+50 defence each, no attack.

gas:100 attack per bomb.

trenches:
standard: x1.5 defence for infantry
fortified: x2
dugouts: x4
military base:x10 for garrison

to resolve battle:
total attack strength of attacking army and total defence of defending army timesed by a dice roll. Highest number wins and casualties will be randomised.

Transport by sea: costs 1 per soldier, 20 per tank, 50 per battery per cm of sea to transport. Maximum of 4cm movement in one turn. Note that you may not transport through the Dardanelles or the gap between Denmark and Sweden without the owning faction's permission or if they are no troops in the immediate radius.

Military bases: can garrison up to 500,000 troops, cost 500,000 to build and take 2 turns to build. Can only be built in friendly territory.

Capitals:loss results in massive economy drop, can garrison up to 2,000,000 troops and has the same defensive bonuses as a dug out.

Leaders:tell me which direction you would like them to move, average of one or two cm per turn. Can have any amount of soldiers with them.

research:it is only possible to research one item (eg:light tanks, gas or machine guns) per turn due to lack of manpower on the scientific front.

Spies: can detect enemy troops in a rough estimate of numbers and rough placement on the map. However Elite and BoB class troops can not be detected.

suggestions welcome.

Current Wars:
Entente vs Central Powers
Germany vs Lowlands
Austria-Hungary vs Serbia

more to be edited in...

[Lt. Pinard]

I'm interested. I was Italy in the last failed WW1 interactive and I still have all the research and battle plans had I made.

[Csargo]

I'd play Germany.

I still have the starting navy sizes of all the nations in a graph if you would like it.

The specific problem I had was a way to calculate how battles would go. I couldn't figure anything out to simulate them, and that was the biggest reason why I had to prematurely end my game. I hope you can figure out a way.

[Ferret]

okay I'll put you in, I am still writing the rules but they should be done soon.

edit:navy sizes would be great thanks

[Csargo]

You don't have any PM space.

[Ferret]

sorry, I do now.

[Caius]

Iberia (again!) for me!

[KarlXII]

Your map seems to be a little off. Finland was part of Russia at the time, unless the Russians would like to cede that territory to the League ?

[Csargo]

What's up with the dots on the map? I'll send my orders in tomorrow or Sunday.

[King Jan III Sobieski]

Greece rules!

[Ferret]

@Sarmatian:there is already rules for transport via sea, read the first post.

@scottishranger+Pinard:there is no rush, the deadline is the end of June...

@Sarathos:just state where the leaders will be in a general area and say how many troops will be with that leader and how many in each military base/capital.

[Sarmatian]

@Sarmatian:there is already rules for transport via sea, read the first post.

Must have missed it. Sorry, my bad.

[Sarathos]

I would like to take Bulgeria, lucky last.

[Ferret]

I know the map is a little off, but it is close enough for me

The black circles are Military bases, they have their own section in the rules.

Sarathos has been added.

And just to make clear, initial deployment is just deployment, you can't build trenches yet. And leaders can go anywhere in your lands (so far everyone has put them as a garison).

[Sarmatian]

Your map seems to be a little off. Finland was part of Russia at the time, unless the Russians would like to cede that territory to the League ?

Hmm... Let me think about it... NO!

Ok, guys just a couple of suggestions:

Right now, income is 1/2 of the population. Good idea, simple to calculate. But this also means that Russia is going to have income more than two times bigger that the second placed. Russia in the WW1 wasn't really the richest state, and having greater income than Germany and UK put together is bit "unbalancing". So maybe we can make specific rule, like in the case of Russia, income is 1/3 of the population, not 1/2?

Second, Serbia needs to be "buffed up". This was the golden age of the Serbian military. Serbia stopped three AH offensives (which were supported by Germans) and even counterattacked and regained control of almost entire country. Only in 1915, when there was terrible typhos epidemics in which 70,000 soldiers died and when Bulgaria entered the war and opened a third front, did Serbian army started to withdraw. Even with typhos, lack of food and several time bigger opposing armies, Serbian Army managed to withdraw in good order to Corfu. When they reached Corfu, average soldier looked like he just got out of Auschwitz, only skin and bones. But nevertheless, they recovered, and some time later, together with French armies they managed to win several stunning victories, breakthrough of the Thessaloniki front among them. Althought they lacked supplies, they were highly motivated and drilled, most of them being veterans of the two Balkan wars, and under excellent commanders.

So, just a few touch ups to steer the IH in the right direction. If we see AH gobbling up entire Serbia in the first attack, and then Russia winning everything because of its huge income (right now Russia has an income of 80 millions, while Central Powers together have an income of 70 millions), it's a bit of a "turn off", at least for me. Not that I would mind having the highest income, as I'm leading Russia, but I would rather have a bit of realism...

[Sarathos]

Some very good points, I say we make it everyone verus Russia.

[Ferret]

well seeing as you are Russia then I doubt there will be any opposition to this new rule. I have been looking at the old threads and thinking about what to do with Russia. If everyone agrees it is low enough I will lower it to 1/3 of their population.

About Serbia: I have also been thinking about making some countries have less troops but far more powerful ones and suchlike. How about a rule that states that all Swiss forces start off as specialist and 400,000 Serbians are specialists. Would this be to everyone's satisfaction or should the Serbians be made more powerful?

I'm glad to see the rules are finally being questioned, I wrote these all in one go and have not tested them at all so all suggestions are welcome.

edit:I was also thinking of nerfing Iberia slightly (sorry Caius) because at the moment if the joined the Central Powers France will be annihilated, especially if Italy also joins them. Though I suppose this opens up more chances for diplomacy, Caius could demand tribute every turn for peace or something, anyone think that Iberia is too powerful?

[PrinceofTroy]

Should we send you the initial deployment now? And can we start diplomacy yet, like making alliances and stuff?

[shlin28]

well seeing as you are Russia then I doubt there will be any opposition to this new rule. I have been looking at the old threads and thinking about what to do with Russia. If everyone agrees it is low enough I will lower it to 1/3 of their population.

About Serbia: I have also been thinking about making some countries have less troops but far more powerful ones and suchlike. How about a rule that states that all Swiss forces start off as specialist and 400,000 Serbians are specialists. Would this be to everyone's satisfaction or should the Serbians be made more powerful?

I'm glad to see the rules are finally being questioned, I wrote these all in one go and have not tested them at all so all suggestions are welcome.

edit:I was also thinking of nerfing Iberia slightly (sorry Caius) because at the moment if the joined the Central Powers France will be annihilated, especially if Italy also joins them. Though I suppose this opens up more chances for diplomacy, Caius could demand tribute every turn for peace or something, anyone think that Iberia is too powerful?

I DEMAND A STRONGER SERBIA!!!

[Sarmatian]

well seeing as you are Russia then I doubt there will be any opposition to this new rule. I have been looking at the old threads and thinking about what to do with Russia. If everyone agrees it is low enough I will lower it to 1/3 of their population.

About Serbia: I have also been thinking about making some countries have less troops but far more powerful ones and suchlike. How about a rule that states that all Swiss forces start off as specialist and 400,000 Serbians are specialists. Would this be to everyone's satisfaction or should the Serbians be made more powerful?

I'm glad to see the rules are finally being questioned, I wrote these all in one go and have not tested them at all so all suggestions are welcome.

edit:I was also thinking of nerfing Iberia slightly (sorry Caius) because at the moment if the joined the Central Powers France will be annihilated, especially if Italy also joins them. Though I suppose this opens up more chances for diplomacy, Caius could demand tribute every turn for peace or something, anyone think that Iberia is too powerful?

I agree, I don't believe we need to buff up Serbia anymore with better troops, since it would be even worse to see Serbs taking Vienna. Strengthening Serbia's defensive position makes more sense, like placing trenches (1st level) on it's border with Austria. It would also make sense since terrain on Austro-Serbian border was very difficult (river crossing and big mountains).

Also, you said were not gonna have navies, but I guess it would be possible to transport troops by sea, no? To keep it under control I suggest that each country can only transport 500.000 soldiers each turn and that they reach their destination in two turns (if there is a friendly port of course) in case of the Entente and three turns in case of Central Powers. Why longer in the case of Central Powers? Well to give at least some benefit to Britain and France since they wont be able to use in any other way their powerful navies...

When transporting anything other than soldiers (like machine guns and tanks later) it could go something like this:
1 machine gun = 100 soldiers
1 artillery piece = 200 soldiers
1 light tank = 500 soldiers
1 heavy tank = 1000 soldiers
To limit the possibility of delivering huge amounts of soldiers and equipment in just a few turns

Also, when recruiting new armies, those troops should be taken out of the population of the country (thus hurting income) so that we don't see armies 50,000,000 strong later in the IH. I don't know if you already had this planned, I assume you did, but just checking.

One more thing, Elite Ferret, you said geography and terrain won't have any effect, I guess for fear of over complicating the game. I think we can implement at least something and still keep it simple, namely, mountains and rivers. But, not to over complicate it we could only use really big and important mountains and rivers lake Alps, Balkan mountains, Pyrenees and Danube, Volga etc... to give some bonuses to the defenders. Just a suggestion. Also maybe some bonuses for the defenders if the opponent attacks by water.

Now something not IH related, for everyone who is WW1 geek like I am . Great risk-style strategy game about WW1. Simple yet highly addictive, with great AI, and possibility of playing with 5 other human players (3 in the Entente and 3 Central Powers). It's abandonware now, so for all those who like WW1 and don't have it yet, I present you Fields of Battle

[Ferret]

Players who haven't sent in orders this turn, but did last turn:
none now

Players that haven't sent in any orders yet:
PrinceofTroy
Baby Boomer

as you can see this is around half of the players.

I am opening up Austria for anyone to take as it is no good having one of the major powers unplayed

As for those on the first list, they have until Sunday 10:00 GMT

[shlin28]

No Austria playing? Awsome

*Hums the Serbian national anthem*

[Sarmatian]

Just to announce that Bulgaria and Greece are officially members of the Entente. Any attack on them by a neutral country will be considered the same as the attack on Russia, and Russia will respond accordingly and decisively. That goes for an attack on any other member of the Entente of course.

I'm sure the official declaration of war on the Central Powers by Bulgaria and Greece will follow shortly...

[King Jan III Sobieski]

Just to announce that Bulgaria and Greece are officially members of the Entente. Any attack on them by a neutral country will be considered the same as the attack on Russia, and Russia will respond accordingly and decisively. That goes for an attack on any other member of the Entente of course.

I'm sure the official declaration of war on the Central Powers by Bulgaria and Greece will follow shortly...

To the enemies of the Greek nation:

[King Jan III Sobieski]

I, Constantine I, King of the Hellenes (Κωνσταντίνος A', Βασιλεύς των Ελλήνων) was born on 2 August 1868 and have ruled Greece since 1913. The organization of the 1896 Summer Olympics has been one of my most proud accomplishments; I appointed a committee to prepare Athens for the Games and kept a close watch to ensure that their tasks were completed.

Greece, under my leadership, will continue to persevere in this conflict.

[Ferret]

Still awaiting initial deployment from:

Great Britain - Julian the apostate
Austria-Hungary - PrinceofTroy
Ottoman Empire - makaikhaan
Scandinavian League - SwedishFish
Italy - Lt. Pinard
Bulgaria - Sarathos
Switzerland - Baby Boomer

If things go well I will move the start date to next week so we can get this rlling earlier. I've played a quick test game with a simpler version of the rules and haven't found any glaring flaws, though you guys will find some I'm sure

It is not a bad thing if you miss initial deployment as I can do that for you unbiasedly but from now on if two deadlines on the trot are missed I will look for a replacement, unless I am notified that a certain deadline cannot be met. Thanks guys.

[shlin28]

YAY! ITS BACK!

FEAR TEH UBER MIGHT OF SERBIA!!!

[Ferret]

it was never gone lol, it did say in the first post that it wasn't starting 'till Summer but I may be able to do so earlier now so I wanted to make sure everyone deployed the way they wanted rather than have me do it

[King Jan III Sobieski]

YAY! ITS BACK!

FEAR TEH UBER MIGHT OF SERBIA!!!

Calm down, my Balkan brother. We must tread carefully in these troubled times.

[Sarathos]

So, has the game started yet...?