Quote Originally Posted by Puzz3D
It's actually 2760 + 660 = 3420 being used to counter 3 pav xbows costing 1470. So the guy was at a disadvantage monetarily in the melee when his 8 ranged units didn't beat the 3 pav xbows.

Puzz, if you reread the posts you would agree with me. Its not about total florin count, its about getting what you paid for.

he didn't use the hybrid in the initial shootout in the first place, just in the minut before melee to counter. Regular bows are NOT good vs armoured units. They are very effective vs LIGHT units (exception is longbows or units with similar "armour piercing" characteristics).

So if you look beyond the florin count you could conclude the following

- Crossbow units have superior range. If they are pavise they have superior range and better protection. In this fight it was actually 2 vs 3 pavise. I have run tests with missile units and we can conclude that peasant archers are not effective vs pavise crossbows. They weren't designed that way.

- regular bows are overall cheaper but have no real other advantages

- hybrid units are often armoured, do a good deal of damage in ranged and close combat, but are ofcourse pretty expensive. IMO they should be used as support units (on the flanks or behind the main line to counter horsearchers for example).

Now, there are more things to consider - unit specialism:

Crossbows are usefull vs any other unit in ranged combat. If you get pavise crossbow units you have well protected armour piercing units (but a bit sluggish).

Peasant archers are only usefull at shooting at light infantry/archers or at regular crossbow units. They are however very cheap.

Hybrid units are not ment to be used in the shootout. Their value is in peppering enemy infantry/cavalry/horsearchers after the main shootout. When the going gets tough, you can use them as infantry.

Something else to consider. Unit deployment. Crossbows fire in a rather flat trajectory. regular archers in a more curved way (something of a ballistic missile). If you deploy your units in a double line vs crossbows you WILL take more casualties. Deploy your units in a single line and you are less vulnerable.

I have played around 30 games online now, and overall the missile balance is ok IMO.

Quote Originally Posted by Puzz3D
Are you saying an xbow + archer (330 + 220 = 550 florins) beats a pav xbow (490 florins) when the units are used properly?
Maybe, but only if the pavise crossbow user is a fool. Peasant archers are simply not effective vs armoured units. It's really that simple. But they are good cannonfodder. if the pavise user shoots the peasants and not the crossbows, he will loose in the end.