Where Have All The Shogun Players Gone To?

[Mystic]

Come out of hiding guys lets get some games and discussion going

[Silver Rusher]

MTW, several years ago.

[MSB]

RTW even more recently.

The thing is Shogun is an old game. People prefer newer 3D graphics (rather than 2D sprites) and an easier to use inteface. That is why they abandoned Shogun and moved onto MTW and RTW. However I do think that a Shogun 2 TW would bring players back to Shogun so that they can compare it to the newer version.

[Silver Rusher]

RTW even more recently.

The thing is Shogun is an old game. People prefer newer 3D graphics (rather than 2D sprites) and an easier to use inteface. That is why they abandoned Shogun and moved onto MTW and RTW. However I do think that a Shogun 2 TW would bring players back to Shogun so that they can compare it to the newer version.

Wrong. Pretty well nobody who started the series at Shogun actually plays Rome (many play MTW though), and very few who started at Medieval even. The only people who seem to like Rome a lot are those that are new to the series. I think 'vets' expect something a lot more like the games they are used to whereas newer players are much more open-minded about it; this is what causes the change of interest.

[Martok]

However I do think that a Shogun 2 TW would bring players back to Shogun so that they can compare it to the newer version.

I'm not so sure about that. The only way most Shogun players (including myself) would probably flock to a sequel is if the units and gameplay was as well-balanced as the original. Given CA's track record in this area has steadily declined since then--not even my beloved MTW is as well balanced--I find that possibility vanishingly small. Not impossible, no, but it is unlikely.

It's probably true that a Shogun sequel would have little problem in attracting newer players, including those who liked Rome. But unless CA were to thoroughly test and play-balance the game like they used to, I highly doubt that most veterans of the original game would return.

[Derfasciti]

I got the Total War Eras package specifically for STW. I wanted to stroll down memory lane for a nice while and I did. Now I'm doing MTW for a bit. STW is a great game and I love it. I hope to continue playing it some other time for sure.

I like the idea of a new STW myself.

[SOSamurai]

Actually Silver, I started the series from STW, and then played MTW, and then RTW, and after loving STW, moving to MTW and not really liking the battles as much and therefore auto resolving campaigns and getting bored quickly, and then onto RTW and playing that more than any other game in the series. I guess I must be the exception.

Never the less, STW is still a great game, and good to play when I'm in that "samurai" mood.

[Mystic]

i play mtw and stw and ill eventually get rtw but im still confused unit wise in mtw. so much changed. (obviously) i got WE when it came out and it took me years to get off :P

[Puzz3D]

I considered working on the Shogun mod for RTW, but limitations in the new battle engine prevent the gameplay from ever being as good as the older engine. This is why I put my effort into Samurai Wars instead.

[Lucjan]

I'm amongst those who have been with TW since Shogun, and I have to say that my current favorite is Rome. Rome's combat has been balanced a thousand times over by different mods and patches, so that's not really an issue for me. What makes me like Rome more than the other two games is the way army movement is handled. The 'Risk'ish army movement from mtw and stw always bothered me, simply province hopping one space at a time, but until Rome that was the only thing available in a strategy game unless you're into hex maps.

[ELITEofWARMANGINGERYBREADMEN88]

I lost all faith in RTW, SP wise and MP wise, so I don't even do SP anymore and some MP to retrucit for my clan. to Me RTW was never balance. I always went back to STW or MTW for a good SP Campgian or MP game.

[Tony Furze]

Well I ve spent this morning loading up Shogun WE and playing a little, too. I ve actually managed to do the full install as well.The additions are really a bonus for the atmosphere and nuance of the game.

Some how I ve never minded getting beaten in Shogun because it looks and feel so tasteful-I m still very very new to the game, but theres definitely a feeling of entering a whole new world...

MTW is really great but I find its wargrabbing frenetic and frustrating for a relative noob like myself.

An extra is my brother has just switched from RTW to Shogun after my chipping away ...

[naut]

People prefer newer 3D graphics (rather than 2D sprites) and an easier to use inteface.

That may be true in your case, and the case of many of the RTW noobies. However, I have found many of the 'vets' detest the new interface, I am not a fan of it either. Its to large and clunky, yuck.

Most of the 'vets' aren't perturbed by the 2D sprites, they just make us feel older, .

Like of mind we are not.

[Mystic]

good to see some support :) is anyone still hosting a fakeserver?

[R'as al Ghul]

is anyone still hosting a fakeserver?

Yes, I am.

Look here for information on the fakeserver

MP section Sword dojo.
The "I'm in the foyer, now!" thread



R'as

[Takeda Itetsunaba]

I think a new STW is in order, it'd be cool to see an updated version of STW anyway.

[MSB]

I think a new STW is in order, it'd be cool to see an updated version of STW anyway.

That may be true in your case, and the case of many of the RTW noobies. However, I have found many of the 'vets' detest the new interface, I am not a fan of it either. Its to large and clunky, yuck.

I do admit that the RTW interface is a little bit messy, but it was much easier to use than Shogun's. I got RTW first and from their I expanded out to get MTW and later Shogun. MTW/STW was quite hard to master after playing Rome due to it's harder to "work out" UI and it's right click for everything mouse style. It took some getting used too, but eventually I mastered it.

[Drisos]

SOSamurai, nice to see you, perhaps we can meet for some games soon.

Indeed most people did go and play MTW, but only very few went playing Rome. (for more then a few days, anyway :P)

I must say I totally dislike the Rome battles after I've had STW. "Once someone plays STW, he can't like games with less cool battles anymore."

Basically there's about zero people playing shogun right now, but it has it's ups and downs. I might come again. I think there's a lot of people hoping CA brings a STW2 with nicer battle engine than RTW, nicer graphics but still the nice atmosphere that stw had..

but hey Mystic, have some games this afternoon? (afternoon for me, GMT)

[Dexter]

Hy .. I do occasionally play Shogun WE .. I even play the original ... MTW .. not bad but 1 turn 1 year ... come on .. and Rome .. nice .. but 2 turns and year over .. is there a way to change that ? I Shogun it would be nice to play 12 turns a year ... training should take 3 months or so .. same for Rome and Medieval *WI too ... it would be more realistic .. why should it take almost 12 years for a crusade to reach it`s target ... and if you kill all your enemies men .. why should he have them replaced so soon ??? from where ? in Shogun that is the main factor for me to set unit size to max or 100 ...
Someone knows how to change this ???
Got to work .. HAVE FUN PLAYING !!! - thats wy there are games ... not to kick the keyboard in rage - ...

[asherba2]

I don't know what it is - maybe the map of Japan, the wondrous simplicity, the focus on just kicking arse...

But no TW has been as magical for me as Shogun. I played Shogun as every faction on the hardest skill level and enjoyed every minute of the ninja plotting, giesha stabbing, no-dachi wielding, goodness.

MTW and RTW are good games, but for some reason Shogun captivated me.
I would be very much interested in a Shogun II, but I probably wouldn't want any changes other than an update in the graphics. To me, complicating factors like agents that die and other things that create tons of micromanaging instead of strategizing... I'm not a fan. So what if it's like Risk, I love risk! ;)

[Motep]

Well, I currently have only rtw and mtw (no expansions, v. 1.0), But I would still play Shogun. It sounds like a great game and I could get past the 2d units. So you may see me the stw threads next year!

[spmetla]

I'm still playing Shogun. After watching all that Samurai Champloo on Adult Swim I got back into a feudal Japan mindset. Certainly enjoying it, I always play Imagawa so I'm back to conquering Japan.

[CrossLOPER]

I play it, but not as much as I want to. It's a fun and very challenging game. Too bad that the interface is a bit lacking, otherwise it's all good.

[Emperor Aurelius]

I started at Shogun and enjoy Rome actually. Personally despite all the negative hype Rome got it was actually a very well made game. The campaign map was much more challenging, as well as more accurate of the times. The graphics were much better and the interface much easier to use.
In addition tehre were more battlefields. Depending on where two opposing armeis met each other in a province there would be a different battle map to fight on. This was much better than the only one battle map per province of shogun and medieval.

Not to say shogun had its days. I liked the AI and idea of Shogun in general as well as much more. Shogun revolutionized strategy games. It AMAZED me as the only medeival strategy game I ever played was Age of Empires. Shogun (took place in medieval Japan right?) ,with its advanced diplomacy, campaign map, battle maps, massive battles opened my eyes to how awesome the total war series was!

I quickly went into MTW and then later RTW cause of Shogun. Shogun was a good game. But it seems to me that each game CA makes is even better than Shogun. Its not cause Shogun is a crappy game either. Even now I believeit to be very fun game. With each game CA adds on more features and improvements (with some exceptions). It really just depends on your tastes.

As for Shogun II?
NO. I'll tell you why:
I believe in a "Shogun II" so to speak. But not like some people think of it as Shogun with better graphics. I'm thinking of having the campaign map include more of Asia such as Mongolia, China, and Korea. That would make a good game now! Shogun is an awesome game. But why do people play MTW and MTW2 so much? Because of the DIVERSITY. Each faction is different. Very few of their units are the same. Russian war wagons, byzantine varangians, turkic Janissaries, Venetian archers and Venitian Heavy inf...and so on and so forth. There are so much variety in culture, economy, geography, and military.
So I would support shogun II if they add in more countries other than Japan. Several Chinese factions could be added in. If I'm not mistaken weren't there also several Korean kingdoms vying for dominance (sorry my Asian history is somewhat sketchy)?

Put them in with Japan. In my opinion Japan should be limited to only a few factions and the rest of Japan rebel. Then work on mainland Asia. It would be fun, it would have the Japanese factions (for all you die hard Japan fans), and would also appeal to the MTW, MTW2 crowd because of the diversity of hte factions.

[Lucjan]

I'm itching for them to get the clue and get around to Three Kingdoms: Total War already. Romance of the Three Kingdoms...I'm sure you all know what I'm talking about. Fall of the Han in China, rise of Dong Zhuo and Lu Bu, the coalition of Cao Cao, Liu Bei, Yuan Shao, Yuan Shu, Sun Jian, Gongsun Zan, etc.

Much diversity there, great, diverse landmass of China... I don't see why including Korea or Japan would be an issue either, but it's a different time period than Shogun.

[caravel]

I went to MTW as soon as it was released, then MTW/VI when that was released. I didn't make the transition to RTW. I've played it a few times, but it doesn't hold my interest for long. I sometimes go back to STW on occasions, but I do sometimes find it featureless and linear, in the campaign environment, compared to MTW. The MTW campaign is better than the STW one.

[BDC]

STW is only good because it's so simple. More like chess than later games in the series. RTW was just poor...

Plus the STW weather effects were brilliant. Really really added to the atmosphere.

[ELITEofWARMANGINGERYBREADMEN88]

STW was balanced, easy selections of armies, good tatics, good players,etc.....

[Dunhill]

I'm not so sure I'd be interested in a Shogun II produced by the current programmers/developers. I haven't purchased MTW II, as I don't think it has the gameplay I'm after at the tactical level.

I'm hoping a grognard-level game like STW/MTW will come out soon that is fully moddable. There are some games out there that allow for such heavy modding of unit stats, but I think we have a year or two before we get a great multiplayer game that was like what STW used to be.

I'll keep waiting.

[econmists]

I stared TW with the Shogun, in fact I still have the old CD case on my desk. I haven't touched it for years though because the other games are simply superior IMO. I guess it depends why you play the series. The main reason I play is for the battles, the campaign itself is just a nice little addition that I usually fool around with for a couple months. What keeps me coming back is the combat, and the variety of units and their visual appeal as well as the new special abilities and terrian just outpaces Shogun in everyway.