AK-47 'War-master' & the History of 'Cheap War'

**spmetla** · 12-13-2006, 22:34

AK is a great weapon in the hands of anyone with knowledge of the basic fundamentals for shooting. Some Iraqi security guys are great shots while a lot of them can not hit the target at all, with these guys though they absolutely refuse to acknowledge that they are causing the misses and instead blame the gun. While the sight isn't as good for leading targets as the M16 style sights I can still hit what I'm shooting at up to 250 meters. Past that range the M16 is king.

I'm just glad the guys that were shooting as us were of the untrained variety.

**Vladimir** · 12-14-2006, 18:06

Originally Posted by Watchman

...or the AK wielders properly trained to begin with ?

Pffft...You don't train people to use the AK, you tell them: Load magazine, pull trigger.

**Kagemusha** · 12-14-2006, 18:23

Originally Posted by Vladimir

Pffft...You don't train people to use the AK, you tell them: Load magazine, pull trigger.

I think Watchman included AK clones in his statement.After basic training, some 30% of Finnish conscripts can score 93 or more points with ten rounds at 150 m distance with target shooting on Rk 62, the bullseye (10 points) diameter being 100 mm.

**spmetla** · 12-14-2006, 18:43

Well you Finns are surrounded by Ruskies, Vikings, and those crazy Germans across the pond, shooting good is a life nessasity!

**Watchman** · 12-14-2006, 22:58

You can get a bonus vacation slot if you score high enough in the army basic training, which I suspect has more to do with it. My brother would've gotten one once except his last round turned out to be a dud, which did not make him very happy.

And the only thing he had shot before the army were those assorted light-guns some arcade shooting games have...

**Kraxis** · 12-15-2006, 04:10

Originally Posted by Watchman

You can get a bonus vacation slot if you score high enough in the army basic training, which I suspect has more to do with it. My brother would've gotten one once except his last round turned out to be a dud, which did not make him very happy.

And the only thing he had shot before the army were those assorted light-guns some arcade shooting games have...

Agreed... incentive to shoot well makes a whole world of a difference.
When I went throught the same with the G3, I told myself to do be the bloody best shot there was. Two days on the range and I was an inch from a badge. However it rained when we shot for badges, that is not good for accuracy when you have iron sights (having to blow out water and having it dropping on your face from the hood is rather disruptive for marksmanship).
But I considered it a good achievement for a beginner with perhaps 6 hours of shooting under his belt.

**Seamus Fermanagh** · 12-15-2006, 05:20

I'm glad Spmetla was facing mostly religious shooters. That .22 thing is scary -- you made a chilling point.

**Oleander Ardens** · 12-15-2006, 12:00

Even little training helps at getting good results in a one-way shooting, as I can attest. After around 7 hours of air gun pistol shooting over some weeks i scored 331 out of 400. The worldclass shooters get at best up to 390, according to my teacher - however the closer you come to 400 the harder it is to make progress, almost a logarithmical curve

Bullseye (10) 11,5 mm, any ring adds 8mm...

The Pistol seems to more fitting for me than the rifle, because I'm according to my teacher a fast, impulsive shoother. Still I scored well over 310 out of 400 with it. The world record is 600/600 and 104.1/109. As I think of myself of a rifle shooter I will work on my position and calmness...

10=0,5mm 1ring=2,5mm

Anyway I think that we all agree that even little shooting training makes more than acceptable rifleman - on the training ground. Shooting on a battlefield is far different...

Cheers
OA

**IrishArmenian** · 12-15-2006, 17:16

Originally Posted by Vladimir

Pffft...You don't train people to use the AK, you tell them: Load magazine, pull trigger.

No, we learned to take it apart and assemble it in 30 seconds. We were all trained. And a few of us, such as myself, were trained with variants too.

**Vladimir** · 12-15-2006, 20:59

Originally Posted by IrishArmenian

No, we learned to take it apart and assemble it in 30 seconds. We were all trained. And a few of us, such as myself, were trained with variants too.

Ya, I was just teasin' Watchman. I've actually fired a few rounds (5 or so) from the Egyptian version of the AK; Mahdi, Mahadi, MuaDeeb, whatever it's called.

I was surprisingly impressed with the weapon. The accuracy was decent and more important, it just felt goood

. The M-16 wasn't nearly as much of a pleasure to shoot as that weapon. Strange really.

**IrishArmenian** · 12-16-2006, 22:46

Yes, I find the AK-47 to be near perfect in its proportions. It feels just heavy enough, and the rifle butt seems to be a natural fit. The placement of the trigger is great too. It isn't the most widely recognised and used gun for nothing!

**spmetla** · 12-21-2006, 08:12

Hey Alex of Macedon, empty your PMs so I can reply to yours.

And to all others, sorry for the OT post.

**Ibn Munqidh** · 12-24-2006, 22:39

Hi,

Murat, I would like to question your claim that the m-16 has better penetration than the ak-47. I do believe, that the 7.62 Russian has better penetration and ballistics, than the 5.56 NATO, big time. The 5.56 holds the edge when it comes to recoil, and trajectory, but the downrange energy retention of the 7.62 is priceless.