Templars Guild

[giskard]

Guilds are not destroyed when you take a city.

If thats true then the AI does not get offered guilds.

Nearly all the towers I conquer get offered lvl1 guilds of 1 type of another.

So we have a mystery here.

Giskard

[Wizzie]

I'd say about 50% of the cities and castles I've conquered have guilds. The Byzantine Empire seemed particularly fond of the Thieves Guild.

-Wiz

[knoddy]

theives and swordsmith guilds are the only guilds that the ai takes. i made a post about this somwhere else, my belief is that they accept the first guild offered to them, and seeing as theives are easy to get thats wot they always have.

[Don Jacopo Caldora]

Played 3 games so far.

Played as England, Denmark and Sicily.

I only got a Templar guild one time, and that was when I took the city of Invernes from the Scot's, and it was already built, I did not build it. I dont think i was offered any other chapter houses that game at all.

Second and third games I got Hospitlar chapter houses pretty easily, espicially when playing as Sicily. I was turning down some of the offers just to get other guilds.

I would think France might have a better chance of gaining templar's, as wern't the origional knights templar Frenchmen?

[Reapz]

I think I can debunk a few theories here. I don't think obtaining the Templar's Guild has anything to do with being a good catholic or going on crusade.

I am playing a second campaign vh/vh as Scotland. The first one I was a good and pious citizen. This time I decided to be as aggressive as possible, basically forget politics and religion, and take every opportunity to seize territory and crush weakened opponents. I have destroyed England and Denmark. I am currently at war with 8 other factions, have no allies, have a papal standing of zero, where it has been most of the game. I have been excommunicated more times than I can count. I have inquisitors, heretics and witches crawling all over my territories. I have never participated in a crusade, in fact have used those opportunities to pillage pious nations that are silly enough to send their armies away to the please the Pope. I was offered a Templar's Guild in York after about 65 turns!

[resonantblue]

The explorer guild gives a % chance to give a general in the city the "Intrepid Explorer" ancillary, which boots movement by 15% and increases sight range, IIRC. Needless to say, this is very, very useful for a general to have.

The alchemist guild gives an ancillary. As do a couple of the other guilds (I forget which). The explorer ancillary is easily the most useful.

[Derfel von Saljeth]

I'm thinking knightly order just pop up when you conquer a said province.
All who played scottland receiver their first templar guild soon after conquering York or Inverness (also without partecipating a crusade), and i'm doing my second sicilian campaign and again i've been offered a hospitaler guild in Tunisis...

[Mega Dux Bob]

I just ended up with three Templar Chapter houses early in the game! I think you have to be in on the first Crusade called as one of the first responders. Interestingly I got the guild in Paris. Now Templar Knights, that one ups Militia Horse.

[Fisherking]

The only times I have gotten the Templars is when I was playing as Scotland. I thought maybe I would pick them up playing as the Portuguese but I quit the campaign to load up the patch…should have played on, ya know.

I was surprised not to get an offer as the French or even as England

[katank]

The AI definitely gets tons of thieves guilds. Their spy happy spamming might have something to do with that.

Some regions are predisposed towards certain guilds. Inverness towards crusading guilds for example. In my English game where I was a very bad Catholic (never went on crusade, excommed, had crusades called against me), I got an offer of a Templar guild in Inverness, turned it down, and then got a St. John's guild there.

[Quillan]

I've rarely seen other guilds in AI hands, although I did take a castle from the Spanish a couple of days ago that had a Knights of Santiago chapterhouse in it.

[Discoman]

I only got the Knights Templar only after conquering the settlement they were in from Scotland. Perhaps getting Templars has to do with chilvary of characters.

[FrauGloer]

Looking at export_descr_guilds, it becomes clear why it's easier to get Hospitallers than it is getting Templars: the only ways to increase the chance for templars are a) have a general join a crusade (+25) and b) train templars (+10 for the settlement, +1 overall) for which you have to have the guild already. For St. John's, you also get bonuses for declaring war on muslims (+10) and having muslim neigbors (+10 for the settlement, +1 overall). As I found this a bit 'unfair' towards the Templars, I changed the file to give those bonuses to them, too. After all, they were a military order and fought against the muslims.

Added lines are in bold:

;------------------------------------------
Trigger 0170_Declare_War_Muslim_Faction
WhenToTest FactionWarDeclared

Condition TargetFactionReligion islam
and FactionReligion catholic

Guild st_johns_chapter_house a 10
Guild templars_chapter_house a 10

;------------------------------------------
Trigger 0171_Muslim_Neighbours
WhenToTest SettlementTurnStart

Condition NeighbourReligion islam > 50
and FactionReligion catholic

Guild st_johns_chapter_house s 10
Guild st_johns_chapter_house o 1
Guild templars_chapter_house s 10
Guild templars_chapter_house o 1

[katank]

Other than for flavor, I don't see any point to Templars. Their base stats are equal to Knights of St. John. However, they charge without orders and are thus less easy to control. They also get 1 fewer armour upgrades. Lastly, their guild building does not provide a health benefit like the St. John's.

[Wardo]

I like to play slow, very slow, so slow that I barely conquer one province every 10 turns during an offensive (1 year per turn).

So, by the time I conquered Scotland with Denmark, they had a Templars guild in Iverness while I had accepted a while before a Hospitallers guild in Jerusalem.

So, now I have both Hospitallers (in Jerusalem and York) and Templars in Iverness. I'm really looking forward to see if I can capture an HRE town with a Teutonic Knights guild!

But personally, I'd like to simply edit them all in my capital at the beginning of the game. If you know how to do that, let me know.

[The Stranger]

it isnt that hard... i can check it for you whne im at home... but maybe sumbuddy will beat me to it...

[FrauGloer]

Other than for flavor, I don't see any point to Templars. Their base stats are equal to Knights of St. John. However, they charge without orders and are thus less easy to control. They also get 1 fewer armour upgrades.

Yep, the missing armour upgrade sucks. That's why I changed their entry in export_descr_unit to give them the second upgrade, too. They don't have a third model, though, so the step from basic armour to partial plate is not represented in battle. IMO, they still look good that way.

armour_ug_levels 3, 4, 5
armour_ug_models Knights_Templar, Knights_Templar, Knights_Templar_ug1

I have no problem with Templars being impetuous, I have yet to see them charge without orders in my campaigns.

Lastly, their guild building does not provide a health benefit like the St. John's.

I hear you on this. To counter this, I added a (rather low) trade bonus to templar buildings. This is historically justifiable, as the templars established one of Europe's first professional banking systems. I also added a 1% conversion bonus to all order houses to represent their religious influence.