Lost an Army

**Jagger** · 12-04-2006, 06:18

I just lost a full army of my most modern troops commanded by a 22 year old captain. One turn, it was there, the next turn, I see three rebel units. I didn't get a message or anything, but I am assuming it was bribed. But I really am guessing.

Again, assuming it was bribed, how do I protect them from being bribed? I am on turn 120 and I don't have enough family members for all armies. So what do I do to protect myself in the future?

**Quillan** · 12-04-2006, 06:26

You can't prevent bribery absolutely. You can make it more expensive, is about all. The easiest way is to add more troops to the stack, since the cost is directly related to both the number and type of troops in the stack. Beyond that, adding characters to the stack also increases it. Add a spy, or a diplomat, or a priest. The bribing diplomat has to pay for ALL of it.

However, if it was led by a captain, I'd be more suspicious of a revolt. Not all troops can be rebel, so if the captain revolts, he'll lose any troops which can't be rebels. Depending on the composition, that could reduce a large stack to 3 units. On the other hand, in my Byzantine campaign I did have a Danish army whose general died - right after the crusade ended - revolt, and I had to destroy and 18 unit rebel stack right in the middle of my territory.

**Whacker** · 12-04-2006, 06:30

Originally Posted by Quillan

You can't prevent bribery absolutely. You can make it more expensive, is about all. The easiest way is to add more troops to the stack, since the cost is directly related to both the number and type of troops in the stack. Beyond that, adding characters to the stack also increases it. Add a spy, or a diplomat, or a priest. The bribing diplomat has to pay for ALL of it.

However, if it was led by a captain, I'd be more suspicious of a revolt. Not all troops can be rebel, so if the captain revolts, he'll lose any troops which can't be rebels. Depending on the composition, that could reduce a large stack to 3 units. On the other hand, in my Byzantine campaign I did have a Danish army whose general died - right after the crusade ended - revolt, and I had to destroy and 18 unit rebel stack right in the middle of my territory.

Errr... You had a non-general led stack revolt?? I thought that loyalty was a named character-only trait. I'll admit I only got about 40-50 turns into my campaign before I stopped, but I didn't suffer any revolts at all, much less from a generic nameless captain-led stack.

**Jagger** · 12-04-2006, 06:31

I am not convinced it was bribery because there was only a single one star hungarian diplomat in the area. And I didn't see it happen during the AI's turn.

If they rebeled, is it related to the province cities happiness? What causes a unit to simply rebel? I noticed a large French army do the same a few turns earlier except the whole stack appeared to turn into rebels.

**Barry Fitzgerald** · 12-04-2006, 11:13

This is a problem I have noticed too. Captains almost always desert or get bribed...but they don't seem to go to other forces..just the rebels.

And it happens far too often. In rome they tended to get bribed by other factions..more so than joining the rebels...

I would also like to see a return of MTW1's civil war faction split...shame not to see it here....

**Beefeater** · 12-04-2006, 11:24

Captains sometimes go brigand. I haven't found it to be all that often, and it has happened to me more frequently near the start of a game than later on. I think it may be linked to your King's authority, but this is just a suspicion at this stage.

**Debe2233** · 12-04-2006, 12:19

I think its definately linked to your leaders authority, i had a totally insane leader with 1 authority and my non general lead armies were revolting left right and center, i decided to arrange a little "accident" and suddenly they were fine with my new 5 authority leader and i had no more rebellions.

I cant prove its the reason but a wild stab in the dark and id guess faction memberless armies use authroity as a kind of loyalty so a 1 authority leader means all your faction memberless stacks are running around with 1 loyalty, just a guess mind you.

**dopp** · 12-04-2006, 12:22

Yes, captains will go brigand quite a bit. I never send stacks anywhere without proper generals to lead them.

**Jagger** · 12-04-2006, 17:02

I just checked my faction leaders authority. It is one. He just recently became faction leader after the assassination of my previous leader by the Danes. That is probably the problem....

Any way I can get his authority up?

I just checked the manual. Low authority faction leaders are more likely to face rebellion. But it doesn't say anything about what factors impact authority or how to increase authority.

**KristianSax** · 12-04-2006, 18:03

If you have a worthy heir waiting in line then just send your king off to battle, exterminate some infidel towns until you run out of luck and the king dies :)

**cambrax** · 12-04-2006, 18:16

You'll generally gain authority over time, or by excelling in battle. I don't really hold with suicide missions for my king, doesn't seem right somehow. I prefer to let them (try) to grow into the job.

**Fearless** · 12-04-2006, 19:07

I lost a 15 unit stack. One minute it was there on the isle of sicily next turn it had gone! POOF!!! just disapppeared gone forever. checked me castle..nothing there!!. had spies everywhere but they couldn't find it.

**Jagger** · 12-04-2006, 19:13

I think we should get a message when an army disappears like that. Either state they were unhappy and rebelled or were bribed or something.

The sudden disappearance of an entire army without notice makes me wonder whether I am just losing my mind a bit earlier than predicted.

**swell** · 12-04-2006, 20:35

Originally Posted by Jagger

I am not convinced it was bribery because there was only a single one star hungarian diplomat in the area. And I didn't see it happen during the AI's turn.

If they rebeled, is it related to the province cities happiness? What causes a unit to simply rebel? I noticed a large French army do the same a few turns earlier except the whole stack appeared to turn into rebels.

What causes armies turn rebel is the line :
"rebelling_characters_active" in the descr_strat.txt file.

And it's a big problem for AI factions with big provinces, like Russia or Moors.
You can disable it: ";rebelling_characters_active", but you have to start a new campaign.