Quote Originally Posted by dopp
Having impetuous pikemen is one of the reasons I suspect the pike formations are not working as intended. As it is now any movement fatally disrupts the formation and getting pikemen to attack rather than simply stand there waiting for charges is rather iffy. The phalanxes in RTW could move at speed with pikes lowered. Here ordering them to move results in the whole unit upping their weapons and then crowding around like schoolkids until they reach the new locations. There's no right/left turn command for sideways movement at all. If the pikemen were intended to hold together like the phalanxes, then having impetuous pikemen who really like taking the battle to the enemy is a bit more believable. It just seems suicidal right now. No shield and poor armor makes pikeman a lousy swordsman.

This is just my opinion, of course. Maybe pikemen were not intended to be as mobile as phalanxes. Someone should test the impetuous pikemen and see if they really break ranks and charge.

You did get the Swiss Confederation erupting in MTW when/if the correct settlements revolted. Swiss Armored Pikemen (SAPs) were some of the toughest units in the game, comparable to JHI. SAPs were often generals' bodyguards and thus had very high valor (exp) ratings, making them nearly invincible.

I concur. Pikemen does not function in the way they should. They are really good in defence but suck when attacking. That is not fine. Every half-trained peasant can grap a pike and form a strong defensive formation. What the Swiss invented (back) was the aggressive use of the pike. Given proper landscape, the strong discipline and the superior fighting moral of the Swiss Gewalthaufen could wipe out nearly everything. That this was not easy to achieve is shown by the great defeat the Scottish suffered at Flodden Edge trying to cope Swiss tactics without proper training and moral, but with a bloody little ditch at the location.

Best thing would be to give some pikemen (f.e. Swiss, Landsknechts, Tercio Pikemen etc.) special battle commands which not every pikemen unit (esp. militia units) can obey.

The pike was one of the core weapons of the time between 1470 and 1600 and should get some love from CA or modders.