Teen Murderer Says Jail Is Too Hard, Appeals Sentence

**doc_bean** · 12-06-2006, 12:42

Link

Yes, trailling (sp?) minors as adults is not something I support, but I can't help laughing at this guy.

Messner and his attorney said he has already learned his lesson and is ready to go home to help others.

"I want to be an inspirational speaker for troubled teens," he said Monday.

**Banquo's Ghost** · 12-06-2006, 13:00

Most know that I am an advocate for serious and challenging rehabilitation regimes for prisoners that will be returning to society. I also oppose capital punishment.

This young man is clearly a callous and amoral person who helped to kill a defenceless man for fun. He did not/does not regret the killing, merely the punishment it brought him.

The sentence of 22 years is too short. He should be in prison for the rest of his life, with hard labour. Callous murder should always bring a life sentence that means the entire natural life, and with hard labour so it is appropriately miserable and provides the small benefit to society of handmade gravel. I believe one might rehabilitate someone who has a regret and understanding of what he did, but this person does not, even now.

Messner's parents broke down at the denial. His mother said it's unfair, that her son fell in with a bad crowd and prison is killing him.

If prison is killing him, maybe the lesson of what he did to another human being will finally sink in - after another 22 years. Somehow I doubt that this self-centred boy and his blinkered parents will learn any lessons at all.

**caravel** · 12-06-2006, 13:19

He should be left there to rot... nothing more and nothing less. I'm sick and tired of hearing about these poor little scum bags that are victims of broken homes or society etc etc etc and need rehabilitation. They should do the time for the crime, and if there isn't enough prison spaces (a problem that the government over in the UK are dithering over at present), build more prisons, and create a few jobs in the process.

**BDC** · 12-06-2006, 13:32

If he won't reoffend, why bother keeping him in prison? Waste of money.

**caravel** · 12-06-2006, 14:04

This is not about wasting money, it is about keeping the public safe and punishing these types of criminals. There is no way of guaranteeing that he won't reoffend, and if was released and killed someone else, plenty of people would be saying "why was he let out!?"...

Besides that, if there is no real deterrent, such as long prison sentances with little or no home comforts, crimals will be thinking "I can kill, do a few years in a cushy prison, then get out again to do the same".

**BDC** · 12-06-2006, 14:33

Originally Posted by Manco Capac

This is not about wasting money, it is about keeping the public safe and punishing these types of criminals. There is no way of guaranteeing that he won't reoffend, and if was released and killed someone else, plenty of people would be saying "why was he let out!?"...

Besides that, if there is no real deterrent, such as long prison sentances with little or no home comforts, crimals will be thinking "I can kill, do a few years in a cushy prison, then get out again to do the same".

If he's not more likely to reoffend than anyone else is likely to offend in the first place, what's the issue? Punishing people never helped society. I agree with deterrent, but that's not a long sentence. It's a certainty of being caught.

e.g. Sticking 1% of offenders in prison for decades is not going to put people off, whereas catching 99% and sticking them in for a month will work hugely better.

**KukriKhan** · 12-06-2006, 15:56

"I want to be an inspirational speaker for troubled teens," he said Monday.

What prevents him from pursuing this worthy goal? Surely his incarceration allows him pencil and paper. Go ahead, Lad, be inspirational! Keep it up for 10-12 years, and maybe society will learn to trust you.

**Crazed Rabbit** · 12-06-2006, 18:19

I'm sick and tired of hearing about these poor little scum bags that are victims of broken homes or society etc etc etc and need rehabilitation.

He's not claiming that; he's just claiming prison is too hard for him.

If he won't reoffend, why bother keeping him in prison? Waste of money.

He killed a pitiful man in cold blood and expresses no remorse. Should he be let off scott free because he says he won't do it again? That doesn't sound like justice to me.

e.g. Sticking 1% of offenders in prison for decades is not going to put people off, whereas catching 99% and sticking them in for a month will work hugely better.

I'm sure we catch more than 1%. And I doubt sticking people in the can for a month would be any kind of detterant, even if getting caught was assured. Have you thought about this?

I agree with BG (though I'm not against capital punishment). He deserves more.

Crazed Rabbit

**Ice** · 12-06-2006, 18:28

The judge and the state both argued that being deprived services and being locked away is precisely the point of prison. Warren Messner will spend the next 22 years in prison without the chance for parole.

Atleast someone is sensible. I think the sentence he and the other boys recieved was just. Had they been a couple years older, I would have disagreed and said they all deserve the needle.

**Don Corleone** · 12-06-2006, 18:54

Originally Posted by BDC

If he's not more likely to reoffend than anyone else is likely to offend in the first place, what's the issue? Punishing people never helped society. I agree with deterrent, but that's not a long sentence. It's a certainty of being caught.

Using this logic, wouldn't my ability to prove that the murder I committed was a singular event get me off scott free? That is, let's say a guy catches his wife cheating on him with his brother. He kills the brother. Since he only had one brother, and he claims it was the intensity of the betrayal (namely, by a sibling) that caused his rage, shouldn't he get away with murder in your ideal world?

**Rameusb5** · 12-06-2006, 18:59

Originally Posted by BDC

If he won't reoffend, why bother keeping him in prison? Waste of money.

Prison isn't just about rehabilitation. It's about prevention.

If they let this guy out, then what's to stop ME from going and killing someone and just recanting a week later?

Don't do the crime if you can't pay the crime. I also think that 22 years was a light sentence. I'm also against the death penalty (it's too easy).

**ELITEofWARMANGINGERYBREADMEN88** · 12-06-2006, 20:01

I don't care if he is 8 years old,18,20, or 494994 years old, you kill a defenseless man, you dersve the needle (or get shot IMO)

**BDC** · 12-06-2006, 20:07

I'm sure we catch more than 1%. And I doubt sticking people in the can for a month would be any kind of detterant, even if getting caught was assured. Have you thought about this?

I'm exaggerating, but it's being caught and convicted that puts people off, not the punishment. Maybe it will put off opportunistic wannabes, but a career criminal or whatever is going to know how to not be one of those caught.

**CrossLOPER** · 12-06-2006, 20:23

Originally Posted by {BHC}KingWarman888

I don't care if ...

I don't think eight year old are capable of collapsing someone's chest by jumping up and down on it, let alone bringing them down to begin with. Even if it were possible, I don't think that the eight year old would be found to have adult cognitive abilities.

**Spino** · 12-06-2006, 20:24

Hah! I can't help but be amused by the fact that this teen's story almost mirrors that of Alex, the protagonist from A Clockwork Orange. In Kubrick's famous film version of the novel Alex and his droogs ruthlessly beat a bum for kicks, terrorized a couple and accidentally murdered some health nut spinster who got her head bashed in during a rousing bit of horrorshow fun and games. As soon as Alex entered prison he immediately sought to lessen his sentence by assisting the prison chaplain and eventually proclaiming he had 'found God', anything to break free of the hardships and monotony of prison life! Of course the moral of the story was that given the ability to exercise free will young Alex was at his core, an incorrigible and incurable hooligan.

The fact that Warren Messner and his buddies admitted to feeling completely indifferent to the act of accidentally killing that bum ought to provide some insight as to their true character. Fifteen years of age may seem young in an era when parents baby their children well beyond their infant years but it's old enough to be held responsible for killing without remorse. Let Messner and his droogs rot in prison, society is better off without them.

**Lorenzo_H** · 12-06-2006, 20:28

I say let him suffer.

**doc_bean** · 12-06-2006, 21:04

Originally Posted by CrossLOPER

I don't think eight year old are capable of collapsing someone's chest by jumping up and down on it, let alone bringing them down to begin with. Even if it were possible, I don't think that the eight year old would be found to have adult cognitive abilities.

Does anybody remember how old those English (UK anyway) kids were that killed a todler a decade or so ago ? I know they're released now, when I read that I didn't realize it had been so long, that story had really stuck with me.

**Mooks** · 12-07-2006, 20:40

Keep in mind while this retard is in prison, the state is feeding/clothing and providing him with running water. 22 years of prison equals alot of wasted money if hes not going to commit the crime again.

Still, it would help the kid out if he didnt look like a idiot.