Am i the only one who sees this

**calithian** · 12-10-2006, 00:35

First i would like to say congrats to CA for doing the best job they could to make this game absolutely horrible in MP. I would like to thank for not beta testing this game before making it. If you guys did beta test it then you should all be fired. This is the worst total war game yet. You guys have single handedly created MP lobbies with no one in them. I can give a list of games that are a decade old that have a better MP than this. I am sure you all are thinking "It will be fixed in the patch" You are kidding yourselves. I dont think you guys have the capacity to fix this game. Look at what you sold to the public!!!! You should give everyone a refund that bought this game because you know that you are not going to fix a thing.

Congrats guys
please feel free to contact me via email
geoff4jc@adelphia.net

**ElmarkOFear** · 12-10-2006, 05:46

Being bitter doesn't really help much in getting CA's attention to your thoughts and ideas. If you think the MP is lousy, please state why. Many others here have provided their own thoughts (myself included) as to why MP is inferior to STW/MTW's MP and also as to where the game is imbalanced and possible solutions.

It is much easier to complain, to relieve dissappointment, than it is to give thought as to what is necessary to change the game to one's liking, but the extra effort will be rewarded with at least a serious discussion of the matter rather than being overlooked as another useless post which just takes up space.

PS: If your problems are balance issues then the community can make changes to fix it. The only thing we will need do is convince CA to offer it on their official site and then to get the MP community to play it. Unfortunately, the way things are set up changes to balance MP normally create imbalances to SP. This means rather than a "patch" it has to be a "mod" and historically it has been difficult to get a large group of MP players to download and play a mod.

If your problem is with the MP interface, lobby, lack of features which were in past games, lag, disconnects or game mechanics such as camera views and army controls, then those are all items which only CA can repair. Since CA doesn't consider the MP community that large compared to its SP base, you will find they will work on changes to SP before changes to MP.

So if you REALLY want your ideas to be even slightly considered by CA, then it would behoove you to stop insulting those you seek to make those changes. Civil persuasion is what has helped, in the past, to get changes important to the MP community.

Also, please notice I did not have to resort to insults, personal attacks, nor chastising, to explain how to persuade those responsible to make changes to the game.

**YellowMelon** · 12-10-2006, 06:06

Elmark, your methods are noble but have we seen anything ever done in the past by CA? We begged throughout RTW for CA to make changes and they never did. There were ample discussions and even consensus to a small degree on what needed to be changed, but nothing ever happened. Debate is all we can do, because CA never listens. People have prayed and hoped that they would finally do something good with TW and they havent, in fact they botched it severely. I find it odd that games that are abandonware (like wolfenstein et) have less bugs, better online playability, and thus have more multiplayer followings. M2TW is a piece of trash unless you like the sp which is just ok.

**ElmarkOFear** · 12-10-2006, 06:45

To answer your question: Yes, during the MTW days, the MP community came together and produced a long list of bugs as well as wishes for the patch being worked on. It was presented to CA, in a civil manner without any accusations, and quite a few of the changes were made. So THAT is what I am basing my current opinions on. With RTW, I disliked the MP game so much I sold my game back after the first week and have just returned to playing MP with M2TW, so I cannot say what exactly happened then, since I wasn't around.

I do know that posts like the above have never had any effect on getting changes made. Even worse, posts such as the above have had a negative effect. It is one of the reasons CA doesn't participate in the forums much, nor give any information out until the last minute. They have been burned more than once, by the community and have developed a stubborn attitude because of it.

My point is: Angry posts just take up space better served by civil discussions on the shortcomings of the current game. Whether CA takes our advice and changes the game is a moot point. We cannot do anything to persuade them to make changes other than present ideas in a short, concise manner after our discussions and hope CA can see the logic behind doing so. Making accusations, insinuating that CA programmers are lazy or incompetent is only serving to insure CA will ignore such discussions and change what they think needs to be changed without any input from the community.

What is it you do not like about the current M2TW MP to make you consider it "trash"?

For me, I consider it inferior to STW/MTW MP because of those things listed in my first post. You missed a really vibrant MP community which lasted for over 4 years until RTW was released. RTW's MP was put together during the very last week before release and not much thought was put into features etc . . I know this because I was a mod/admin at the .com forums and read posts by CA staff which was discussing such and it was obvious they had just begun work on it. I think you would have really enjoyed the STW/MTW MP days. There were ladders, clan competitions, leagues, tournaments, and so many team games available any time of day or night, you would never have to wait to play. Plus the MP lobbies were much better than the current setup.

STW's MP was run off a dedicated EA server and it had passwordable private chat rooms, permanent ban and ignore functions, and really added to the atmosphere of the game.

MTW's MP was very much similar to STW's except there were no longer any passwordable, private chat rooms, and the game was now an Activision product. However, it WAS run on a GameSpy server like those today. I am not sure how many people realized this, since the MP lobby was set up to look like part of MTW's game (just like STW) and not as some generic-looking MP lobby. It too, added much atmosphere to the game. So play MTW's MP to see exactly what a GameSpy lobby could look like and what features it could have, if CA wanted to put the time into it. I am not sure, but the original programmer for the MP lobbies may have moved on to another job or another position within CA. I miss his work. It was excellent.

RTW's and M2TW's lobbies were both done at the end of the games' development, right before release. I think that is why they decided to go with the standard generic lobby setup and not one which looks like a part of the existing game. There isn't a permanent ban or ignore function, and the game info. has some important info. missing (which was there for STW/MTW). The importance of a permanent ban/ignore function is it allowed for the community to police itself. Those players who were there just to cause problems, could be ignored permanently and also be banned permanently from your hosted games. This kept a lot of players in line and prevented one person from ruining a whole server's worth of MP games.

All we can do is reqest CA makes changes to these lobbies and hope they make it a priority for the patch.

Hope this helps explain my views a bit better. :)

**Orda Khan** · 12-10-2006, 13:53

All your points are valid, Elmo. The problem is that we really don't see much emphasis on MP, never have and IMO never will. There was plenty of feedback about the state of MP in RTW, polite or otherwise but we saw little response. We were told by CA that M2TW MP would receive significant improvement and it hasn't. To anyone who remembers the lobbies you mention and the activity, it is hardly surprising that people vent their frustration.
M2TW is the only game in the series that I did not buy on release, I still haven't bought it. My trust has been broken and I feel genuinely sorry for those who spent a lot of money upgrading their PC's in anticipation of a game that promised so much

......Orda

**Fenix7** · 12-10-2006, 15:37

Elmo, you were missed since the end of .NET and you only made a post or two on this forums since RTW was released.Good to see you back and even if this is only for a while.

**|Heerbann|_Di3Hard** · 12-10-2006, 15:57

Originally Posted by Orda Khan

My trust has been broken and I feel genuinely sorry for those who spent a lot of money upgrading their PC's in anticipation of a game that promised so much

......Orda

Thank you. I will wait for a patch and if the patch is(n't) as expected I sell the game on ebay. I have bought hardware for 300 euro, that I can use for other games.

**Puzz3D** · 12-11-2006, 18:46

Originally Posted by ElmarkOFear

Many others here have provided their own thoughts (myself included) as to why MP is inferior to STW/MTW's MP and also as to where the game is imbalanced and possible solutions.

We offer an alternative. It's called Samurai Wars. It uses a battle engine that's superior at simulating unit combat than the RTW/M2TW engine. We have a unit stat for MP that's fully independent from the SP stat. We have the biggest maps on which to play. We have excellent unit and faction recognition on the battlefield. We don't have artillery and elephants, but we do have guns which are not overpowered or underpowered. We have a better MP lobby than either RTW or M2TW offers. We are going to have an era where clans can have their own custom banner to play under, and Samurai Wars doesn't cost $50 usd.

**ElmarkOFear** · 12-11-2006, 18:58

So you were finally able to separate the SP from MP stats? Nicely done Puzz.

**calithian** · 12-12-2006, 04:26

Elmark as i suggeted...you dont play this game....So basically it is like you are giving a reply with no knowledge whatsoever right? Or wait, you have knowledge of STW and MTW and you are an admin here? Your comments are about as valuable for solutions as you claimed my first post was. Do you not play MP for fear that you will get as angry as i am about this? This game is done. They have ruined this game and will see no more unless they do a few things. Please quote me on this gents...... They will have to get rid of Gamespy or upgrade their service. They will also have to patch this game untill for 100 bugs...... The patch will be out thursday.... If these dont improve tremendously then they can all put their heads between their legs and kiss their butts gbye

**Yun Dog** · 12-12-2006, 04:36

why because you wont be playing it anymore...

Ya well thats what alot of people said after RTW...but they (CA) are still here, and thankfully still producing games

no the only Butt they will be kissing goodbye ..Hopefully... is yours....

and good riddence

dont like the game - dont play it

and dont let the door hit you in the ass on the way out

kthxbye

**Cheetah** · 12-12-2006, 06:19