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  1. #1
    Nobody expects the Senior Member Lemur's Avatar
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    Lightbulb It's About Time Someone Reined in Those Geologists!

    I expect you're about as sick and tired as I am of wild-eyed geologists shooting their mouths off, saying whatever they like whenever they like. Yadda yadda geology, yadda yadda Earth's crust, yadda yadda data says this. Whatever. I'm glad somebody has the guts to put these wild-eyed rock hippies in their place.

    The Bush administration is clamping down on scientists at the U.S. Geological Survey, who study everything from caribou mating to global warming, subjecting them to controls on research that might go against official policy.

    New rules require screening of all facts and interpretations by agency scientists. The rules apply to all scientific papers and other public documents, even minor reports or prepared talks, according to documents obtained by The Associated Press.

    [...]

    “I feel as though we've got someone looking over our shoulder at every damn thing we do. And to me that's a very scary thing. I worry that it borders on censorship,'' said Jim Estes, an internationally recognized marine biologist who works for the geological unit. “The explanation was that this was intended to ensure the highest possible quality research,'' said Estes, a researcher at the agency for more than 30 years. “But to me it feels like they're doing this to keep us under their thumbs. It seems like they're afraid of science. Our findings could be embarrassing to the administration.''

    [Yeah, whatever, ya long-haired fact-loving geology liberal! Cry me an aquifer with your little fact-based tears!]

    The agency's director, Mark Myers, and its communications office also must be told — prior to any submission for publication — “of findings or data that may be especially newsworthy, have an impact on government policy, or contradict previous public understanding to ensure that proper officials are notified and that communication strategies are developed.''

    [That's more like it!]


    From now on, USGS supervisors will demand to see the comments of outside peer reviewers' as well any exchanges between the scientists who are seeking to publish their findings and the reviewers.

    The Bush administration, as well as the Clinton administration before it, has been criticized over scientific integrity issues. In 2002, the USGS was forced to reverse course after warning that oil and gas drilling in Alaska's Arctic National Wildlife Refuge would harm the Porcupine caribou herd. One week later a new report followed, this time saying the caribou would not be affected.

    So some geode-huggers won't be able to play favorites with the Carbouistas in Alaska? About damn time, if you ask me!

    I was wondering when someone would have the guts to take action against the blatant partisans of rock-based science. I applaud the administration for standing up to the fascists of geology! Bravo! Bravo, I say! The reality-based community is on the run.
    Last edited by Lemur; 12-16-2006 at 21:02.

  2. #2
    Moderator Moderator Gregoshi's Avatar
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    Default Re: It's About Time Someone Reigned in Those Geologists!

    Had this policy been in place in Newton's time, his gravity nonsense could have been stopped. How I'd love to be able to run off a cliff and hang there in mid-air like Wile E. Coyote chasing the Road Runner.

    Thanks for bringing this important issue to the fore, Lemur.
    This space intentionally left blank

  3. #3
    Kanto Kanrei Member Marshal Murat's Avatar
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    Default Re: It's About Time Someone Reigned in Those Geologists!

    Government interference is sometimes good for science, sometimes bad. The government , if they provide money for research, good. If they say "No you can't research this" bad.
    "Nietzsche is dead" - God

    "I agree, although I support China I support anyone discovering things for Science and humanity." - lenin96

    Re: Pursuit of happiness
    Have you just been dumped?

    I ask because it's usually something like that which causes outbursts like this, needless to say I dissagree completely.

  4. #4
    The very model of a modern Moderator Xiahou's Avatar
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    Default Re: It's About Time Someone Reigned in Those Geologists!

    The government should know better than to expect accountability from one of it's bureaucracies. They should be free to spend tax dollars however they see fit without oversight.
    "Don't believe everything you read online."
    -Abraham Lincoln

  5. #5
    Nobody expects the Senior Member Lemur's Avatar
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    Default Re: It's About Time Someone Reigned in Those Geologists!

    Quote Originally Posted by Xiahou
    The government should know better than to expect accountability from one of it's bureaucracies. They should be free to spend tax dollars however they see fit without oversight.
    Xiahou, please be reasonable! Nobody is suggesting accountability for dollars spent! All the Administration is asking is that these geological hippies vet all results before speaking to anyone. We're talking about controlling information, not research.

    Sheesh, accountability for dollars spent? That is some serious pre-9/11 thinking.

  6. #6
    The very model of a modern Moderator Xiahou's Avatar
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    Default Re: It's About Time Someone Reigned in Those Geologists!

    Quote Originally Posted by Lemur
    Sheesh, accountability for dollars spent? That is some serious pre-9/11 thinking.
    Sorry- I really do love freedom though.
    "Don't believe everything you read online."
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  7. #7
    Iron Fist Senior Member Husar's Avatar
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    Default Re: It's About Time Someone Reigned in Those Geologists!

    I agree with Gregoshi, now that they didn't stop him I have to buy flightsims just because I cannot do it myself.


    "Topic is tired and needs a nap." - Tosa Inu

  8. #8
    probably bored Member BDC's Avatar
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    Default Re: It's About Time Someone Reigned in Those Geologists!

    The rocks don't lie.

    However Bush might hate it, they say they are 4.5b years old and not made personally by a god.

  9. #9

    Default Re: It's About Time Someone Reigned in Those Geologists!

    Quote Originally Posted by BDC
    The rocks don't lie.
    They don't do much of anything.

  10. #10
    Senior Member Senior Member Reenk Roink's Avatar
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    Default Re: It's About Time Someone Reigned in Those Geologists!

    Quote Originally Posted by BDC
    The rocks don't lie.

    However Bush might hate it, they say they are 4.5b years old and not made personally by a god.
    (emphasis mine)

    It would be difficult to justify the latter part of your statement, even metaphorically.

  11. #11
    Gangrenous Member Justiciar's Avatar
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    Default Re: It's About Time Someone Reigned in Those Geologists!

    Quote Originally Posted by BDC
    The rocks don't lie.
    No, but the Caribou are devious bastards.
    When Adam delved and Eve span, Who was then the gentleman? From the beginning all men by nature were created alike, and our bondage or servitude came in by the unjust oppression of naughty men. For if God would have had any bondsmen from the beginning, he would have appointed who should be bound, and who free. And therefore I exhort you to consider that now the time is come, appointed to us by God, in which ye may (if ye will) cast off the yoke of bondage, and recover liberty. - John Ball

  12. #12
    Master of Few Words Senior Member KukriKhan's Avatar
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    Default Re: It's About Time Someone Reigned in Those Geologists!

    Googling 'Jim Estes', the guy cited as saying: "...that's a very scary thing. I worry that it borders on censorship...'' shows that the guy has been very active the past 30 years, and apparently unfettered in how he and collegues release their research results to the public - he's a sought-after sound-bite guy by all the mainstream media (especially on matters of marine biology), and he's never had to check with his USGS bosses before.

    Now he has to, and doesn't like it, after 30 years of independence. But he's getting a USGS paycheck, so I can see where they're coming from; they don't want to be uninformed and caught flat-footed. They should tread this new "must report to HQ" rule very lightly, and Prof. Estes should cry foul if they try to suppress anything. Shouldn't be a problem, since Fox, CNN, et al have him on speed-dial.
    Be well. Do good. Keep in touch.

  13. #13
    The very model of a modern Moderator Xiahou's Avatar
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    Default Re: It's About Time Someone Reigned in Those Geologists!

    Quote Originally Posted by KukriKhan
    Now he has to, and doesn't like it, after 30 years of independence. But he's getting a USGS paycheck, so I can see where they're coming from; they don't want to be uninformed and caught flat-footed.
    That was more or less what I was thinking when I heard this. Some of these government researchers don't grasp the concept of being at least somewhat accountable to their employer who's signing their paychecks. Asking them to report anything major to their managers before running to the press doesn't really sound like an unreasonable burden.

    Also, good research, Redleg- your Google-fu is strong.
    "Don't believe everything you read online."
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