Merchants: You CAN use many on one resource.

[Shahed]

I just tried the merchant fort i.e

-Build fort using a general on a resource.
-Put in a few merchants.

Each merchant in the fort will now be trading the resource.

I have tried this with 3 merchants in a fort just outside Constantinople, trading silk. All three are n00bish merchants but are making about a 1000Florins/Turn all together in that fort.

Don't know if this is intended but it works anyway.

*sees a mad rush to build forts in Timbuktu*

[Goofball]

Do you need to leave a military unit in the fort for it to stay in existence?

[Shahed]

Nope if there is an agent in it, it stays.

[Handel]

One more exploit

[Gray_Lensman]

I just tried the merchant fort i.e

-Build fort using a general on a resource.
-Put in a few merchants.

Each merchant in the fort will now be trading the resource.

I have tried this with 3 merchants in a fort just outside Constantinople, trading silk. All three are n00bish merchants but are making about a 1000Florins/Turn all together in that fort.

Don't know if this is intended but it works anyway.

*sees a mad rush to build forts in Timbuktu*

Cool! Nice use for those Family/Generals that have lousy traits. Merchant escorts...

[past caring]

Hmmm.......

1) Presumably you build the fort off to the side of the resource a little bit, rather than actually on it?

2) The fort might allow you to put three or four merchants on the resource (up to twenty, I presume?) but does it protect the merchants from getting aquired?

3) If it doesn't, can more than one get aquired at once? Will an 8 ranked AI merchant take out all five of your 4 ranked guys in one hit?

[Slaists]

Forts and military escorts appear to protect merchants from takeovers.

https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showthread.php?t=75216

[GreatWarrior]

But, wouldn't that destory your relationship with the nation that you place the fort on.

[Kobal2fr]

HAhaha, now that's thinking outside the box, or I don't know what is . Of course, it's borderline cheating, and you can only do it in your own lands, but funny still.

[past caring]

I dunno about only being able to do it in your own lands......

Not tried it with merchants, but you can certainly build forts in both rebel and non-player faction lands. My current game as England I got a tonne of forts in Turkish territory to channel the Mongols away from my holding in the Holy Land. Turks don't seem to mind a bit - only a direct attempt to take a province seems to bother them....

[Bob the Insane]

I don;t know if it is cheating... I mean a single enemy combat unit could capture you fort full of merchants and kick them all out with no chance of them stopping it or getting back in again. And using military units to secure and hold economic location for your personal use sounds a reasonable tactic.

The only thing that would make it an exploit is that the AI does not do the same thing...

[SMZ]

forts can be built anywhere - it's just watchtowers that must be built on your own land.... so yeah, you could go to any resource you want and grab a monopoly on it for a whole guilds worth of merchants....

yeah, I suppose a rival miltary unit could capture your fort - but without any military units there, the AI will probably ignore it... areas like Timbuktu and the amber fields are so far in the boonies that nobody bothers them anyway

[Kraxis]

Fort + Merchant(s) = Trade Post

Sending a lousy general to Timbuktu with an entourage of 5-7 Merchants would be highly profitable. Double Gold, here we come!

[Chrisky]

1 General + 5-7 Merchants = Trade Commision! :D

[Musashi]

It's hardly an exploit... I mean it may not have been intended by the devs but it mirrors real world practices of the nobles in the medieval period.

[Cheetah]

Well, I leaning towards to say that it is an exploit. While it is kind of realistic it makes the game too easy. Also as others pointed out the AI is not prepared to do the same tactic and probably will never attack your merchants sitting in a fort. Not to mention that the AI is reluctant to attack forts on the first place. All in all, the AI is probably not prepared to play and to counter this tactic.

[sapi]

It's a great idea but as the AI doesn't do it i'd have to class it as an exploit :(

[Musashi]

Then just don't use it. I like it personally.

[Skott]

I tried the fort thing today in my France campaign. Just doing the wine resources. One thing I noticed is the enemy merchants flat out avoid forts. Since I started doing it not a single enemy merchant has come anywhere near my forts. I'm guessing they dont see my merchant in the forts and so dont come after them. I need to test it more though to make sure its not a fluke.

[Musashi]

They actually can't attack your merchant inside the fort. In fact they can't enter it at all as long as it belongs to you.

[TheSeated]

They actually can't attack your merchant inside the fort. In fact they can't enter it at all as long as it belongs to you.

Then its an exploit.

[Shahed]

Hmmm.......

1) Presumably you build the fort off to the side of the resource a little bit, rather than actually on it?

2) The fort might allow you to put three or four merchants on the resource (up to twenty, I presume?) but does it protect the merchants from getting aquired?

3) If it doesn't, can more than one get aquired at once? Will an 8 ranked AI merchant take out all five of your 4 ranked guys in one hit?

1. You can build the fort wherever the game allows you to. You can build it to the side also, but why notsmack on top ?

2. Yes it does protect them. There's already a thread on that cant remember what it's called.

3. No. AI won't attack merchants with escort or inside forts or settlements.

But, wouldn't that destory your relationship with the nation that you place the fort on.

Probably, why not ask for military access ? Or better still get them to declare on you and then go and wrap up their resources.

HAhaha, now that's thinking outside the box, or I don't know what is . Of course, it's borderline cheating, and you can only do it in your own lands, but funny still.

I don;t know if it is cheating... I mean a single enemy combat unit could capture you fort full of merchants and kick them all out with no chance of them stopping it or getting back in again. And using military units to secure and hold economic location for your personal use sounds a reasonable tactic.

The only thing that would make it an exploit is that the AI does not do the same thing...

It's hardly an exploit... I mean it may not have been intended by the devs but it mirrors real world practices of the nobles in the medieval period.

Well, I leaning towards to say that it is an exploit.

Then just don't use it. I like it personally.

Ok. About exploit usage and such, using cheat commands etc. My view is pretty simple.

If you think something is an exploit I would discourage you from using it and report it in the bug/enhancement thread.

If you enjoy using it then go ahead, it's your game and you paid for it. Nobody can dictate how you play. So use cheats whatever, enjoy yourself, that's what your 50 bucks are for.

Personally I classify it as a bug, or an oversight by the devs. It's probably an unintended loophole. I'm not going to report it myself because this thing is actually fun and there's a lot of FAR more pressing issues. If anyone wants to report it, feel free.

What you could do also is to report it and ask the devs to make the AI do the same in future updates. Now that would give resources even more value on the map. Anyway trade posts are old as man himself, whenever something valuable was found, someone would go and hog it. Then someone else (like the army) would come along and (for a cut of the cake) protect the resource hog, so it would be nice to have this kind of addition in the game. You don't have to wait for the devs you can already do this.

I enjoy it and I am going to use it to train up some merchants, possibly even to counter the absurdly broken VnV issues which lead me to have cities without good governors (hence less income).

I'm nearing the end of my own personal empire goals (not the ridiculous 45 provinces, conquer the universe) and all the micromanagement is tedious, all the agent micromanagement specially so.

I think it's really fun. Give it a shot once and it removes some micromanagement from the game. I love the trading part and for me this is just another option when I feel like doing it.

[Musashi]

My feeling is that it's realistic, even if the devs didn't intend it it should stay. If I'm a noble and I have a minion who's making me a bunch of money trading my resource, it makes tons of sense (And was done in real life all the time) for me to provide him with a military guard and even fortifications. No other merchant would be able to horn in on his business under those circumstances.

[Shahed]

Agreed. Just look at the experiences in Indonesia, in America, India, Africa.

As I said as well it did happen and the devs should expand on this.
Adds another line to the game.

[Musashi]

Of course, if you want to be even more realistic about it, putting up a trading post in this fashion should have a chance of causing the formation of a town ;)

[Shahed]

Now you are talking business !.

[Vladimir]

I think this is the most exciting "feature" of the game so far. I may even sneak in spies and assassins as a subterfuge base!

On Very Hard, is anything an exploit?

[chunkynut]

I don't think this is an expliot as I've never seen the AI factions make a fort let alone a fort in a economically strategic location!!

I think this gives the game a new angle, forts should be used a lot more and now they have worth for the expense. My forts (when I bother to make one) have been attacked, when in a militarilly strategic location. You would have to plan your campaigns around going through certain bottlenecks or take out forts causing them.

[Skott]

I'm not going to debate the morality of forts and merchants. Those that think its an exploit I respect that opinion. Those that dont think its an exploit I respect that opinion too. Thats all I got to say about it. To me its not worth arguing.

Now I been playing around a little more with forts and merchants in my French homelands and after leaving the merchants in the forts I have noticed two trends. They dont seem to get as much money as those not entrenched in forts. I need to test this more because it could just be a fluke or how I'm doing it.

The other trend is that while in forts no enemy merchants came around. Soon as bring my merchants out of forts all the surrounding factions send their merchants towards my merchants. It kinda looks like the game AI can see my merchants and makes a beeline for them. I'm going to test this more by moving my merchants in and out of forts and see if the AI merchants respond to it or not.

[Shahed]

The theory that merchants in forts make less money is false, I believe.

You can verify that easily by:

1. Put merchant in fort.
2. Hit end turn.
3. Check the income from THAT merchant by right clicking him.
4. Make note of that income.
5. Remove merchant from fort. (hence destroying the fort)
6. Hit End Turn.
7. Move merchant back on resource.
8. Hit End Turn.
9. Check the income from THAT merchant by right clicking him.
10. Make note of that income.
11. Compare the income figures.

I've tested this on the Western bank of the Bosporus, outside Constantinople. Here you find 2 instances of Silk at equal resource value. A merchant in fort (of equal finance skill) made the same as a merchant outside the fort.

The theory that merchants in forts disperse AI merchants may be true in some cases.

However in Constantinople I have seen hordes of AI merchants, no matter, if my merchants were in forts or not. They've even horde-ed Constantinople when all my merchants were in Timbuktu (literally). So it may apply in some cases but did'nt seem to apply in my case.