What has been your SMALLEST battle?

[macsen rufus]

We've seen lots of accounts of HUGE battles, but I wonder what's the SMALLEST battle you've fought, and the story behind it?

In my case, I'm currently playing a Norwegian (XL) campaign, and had been trying to winkle the Volga Bulgars out of Ryazan. I was about five years march from my nearest artillery, no emissaries or spies nearby, and was besieging a citadel with a garrison of 6 men who had survived the battle. So it seemed the best thing to do was withdraw and re-invade with an army small enough to not make them run straight back into the citadel, yet capable of totally destroying the enemy to ensure the province fell completely.

That's how I came to launch my smallest invasion ever - a mere 4 Mongol Horse Archers to take on 3 bashkorts and 3 urban militia - that's right, a whole 10 men on the field!

As for the fighting, it's pretty obvious. Shoot up the bashkorts whilst staying out of range of their javelins. Shoot up the UMs until the last one runs, then capture him as he flees. Not an epic battle, but fun anyway

[caravel]

I seem to get plenty of those annoying never ending sieges of six men in a citadel. I usually withdraw and invade again next year sending in the smallest unit I've got. I once sent in a single Ghulam bodyguard prince against about 10 UM, and he managed to pull it off.

I must be overzealous hunting every last router down for ransom, because I get alot of them but not enough obviously. It is better to let about 2 or 3 units off the field to ensure a short siege.

On other occasions the enemy routed again, and the process had to be repeated until their was one man left under siege. An assassin sorted that out.

Generally I dislike everything about sieges in MTW. Garrisons under a certain size 50 - 100) should just cause the siege to end like the way a crusade ends when there's not enough men. Also, all sieges should last a minimum of 5 years. There is no incentive to assault when you can wait a year and starve them out. Also you may have carefully planned to defend against an assault against your citadel with all of you JHI and JI, Saracens and Turcoman Foot standing by, but the siege will only last 1 year so the AI decides to sit there... the alternative would have been to use a pathetically small garrison that can last a good few years, but won't stand much of a chance against an assault anyway. If find that I can hold off massive onslaughts some 2 - 3 small units, gaining valour quickly, but once the enemy archers get into range, and really start to wear my men down, the battle is already lost.

[macsen rufus]

Hi Manco - I rather enjoy assaulting castles... I just love my artillery but the casualty rate can be atrocious. But then so's sitting it out. I find the AI rarely assults me if I'm under siege, but then again I rarely give it the opportunity, as I usually counterattack first year. Quite agree though, if the garrison is one man, assassins are the way to go You can't easily get it right - a garrison that can defend an assault will starve too soon.

Sieges are a difficult one to get right in this sort of game, as realistically we should expect one to last weeks or months, but the one-year-per-turn just doesn't accommodate that. At least it's better than in RTW, where the besieging army suffers no losses at all! I think maybe the attrition rate for besiegers should be higher than it is already, as historically sieges were very hard to maintain, due to foraging for a large army, unsanitary conditions etc etc.

[Innocentius]

Speaking on the OT about sieges: Yes, it's a shame sieges don't work all that well in MTW, especially since sieges were far more common than battles.

I've had quite a plenty of small battles, mainly against rebels though so there's really no interesting story behind them (an army of rebels step by step being worn down by the failing AI until they're so pathetically weak that I finish them off). Never think I've been down to as low as ten men in total though
The smallest I can recall was my 6 Horsemen vs. 13 Kerns (VI).

Generally small battles (1-3 units on each side) are among th funniest battles, probably since it's easier to attain victory when you manouvre in small scale. One of the funniest (and easiest) battles I've had was my two units of valour 3 Kerns (trained in that Irish province that gives the morale boost + a 4 star general) vs. 84 rebel peasants with an 6 (yes, six) star general.

[Jxrc]

Playing as the HRE and owing Friesland, my thee ships in the North Sea were sunk by the all-mighty last English ship (sounds familiar does'nt it ?)...

The next year the English invaded with one units of archers. I had two units of peasants and thought they would do the trick (one to charge head on, one to do the same from the rear). The archers did not run away when I attacked but charged my first units of peasants. Before the other an gone round, the first unit was already running away.... Second charge head on thus and same result ... They loss about 15 guys, I lost about 100 ...

[Alexios]

I once sent in a single Ghulam bodyguard prince against about 10 UM, and he managed to pull it off.

My God! What was his name, Bruce Lee??? It must have looked like "Matrix Reloaded" with him dodging all those arrrows, then beating the heck out of 10 guys once he got into the castle!

On other occasions the enemy routed again, and the process had to be repeated until their was one man left under siege. An assassin sorted that out.

I'm wondering, did you experience a downgrade in the structure, or lose any of its upgrades after the assassination was complete? That's one thing that has always annoyed me about leading an assault: the structure almost always gets downgraded after it's over. And it's really a bloody shame when it's something like a fortress or citadel that's involved.

[Kavhan Isbul]

My God! What was his name, Bruce Lee??? It must have looked like "Matrix Reloaded" with him dodging all those arrrows, then beating the heck out of 10 guys once he got into the castle!

My understanding was that the UMs were in the open outside of the fort/castle.

[Martok]

My smallest battle was in a French campaign. In the very first turn, I scraped together a few troops and invaded Anjou. The English had only 1-2 units, while I had 3 (spearmen, archers, and ballista crew). In the end, my ballista crew won the day, flanking and killing the English general. It was quite amusing.

I'm wondering, did you experience a downgrade in the structure, or lose any of its upgrades after the assassination was complete? That's one thing that has always annoyed me about leading an assault: the structure almost always gets downgraded after it's over. And it's really a bloody shame when it's something like a fortress or citadel that's involved.

A castle is downgraded one level if you siege out the enemy (as opposed to directly assaulting it). That's why, if I'm besieging a Citadel or Fortress, I often choose to assault. The loss of men is offset by not having to rebuild the bloody castle.

[caravel]

My God! What was his name, Bruce Lee??? It must have looked like "Matrix Reloaded" with him dodging all those arrrows, then beating the heck out of 10 guys once he got into the castle!

Not a castle assault, but an open battle. If he'd been assaulting a castle he probably would have dropped on his way up the hill to it.

I'm wondering, did you experience a downgrade in the structure, or lose any of its upgrades after the assassination was complete? That's one thing that has always annoyed me about leading an assault: the structure almost always gets downgraded after it's over. And it's really a bloody shame when it's something like a fortress or citadel that's involved.

Yea. It's effectively the same as invading an empty province, and just taking control of it. There is still a downgrading. This is because my assassin was a clumsy devil, managing to knock the port down, and lean against a castle wall causing it to collapse on the way in.

[macsen rufus]

my assassin was a clumsy devil

[Loucipher]

My smallest battle so far was the battle from my first Polish campaign (no VI installed then, only bare 1.0), where 40 Polish Retainers wiped out a single unit of Rebel Archers without losing anyone
Basically it was nothing to do, just position the riders on the hill, disperse the formation to avoid arrow fire, and then charge them, closing the formation. Then it looked like:
- Impact: 6 archers dead (including General)
- One round of combat: another 6 archers dead (thanks to pushback). Unit routed at this point.
- Pursuit: 48 archers captured.
I was so amused with this battle that I let all the captured rebels go, thereby raising Happiness in the province

[SCRIBE]

Hmm, if memory serves me correct...

It would have to be one or two of my Byzantine battles:

Sardinia (somewhere in the late 1200s - early 1300s), I conquered half the map, Italians were left on Corsica and I think on, Genoa, due to their expansive agressive ways.
I had bought off two royal knights, thus gaining Sardinia as a provence, along with my UM, a ballista, Treb archers and Byz Lancers, I defended the island against the incursions of a unit of vanilla spearman, 1 unit of mounted sargeants, a unit of peasents and a unit of royal knights.
Pretty minor battle. Still beat them tho, my ballistas stayed back and popped arrows while they tried to tread on the hills where my army was.
Quite a cozy battle I should say.

My other 1 was I think in the Russian steppes (somewhere in the late 1200s), I assassinated the Golden Horde's Kahn shortly after they arrived. They stilled posed a threat with their huge stacks. Eventually through massive defense and a Hail Mary attack against their vanguard I managed to rid them from Khazar and pick them off from what ever remained or retreated.
One last bastion was either Peresyalv or something. They had a unit of steppe cavalry, GH archers, normal horse archers, and a 10 man GH heavy cavalry.
I had a serpentine or a demi culverin with me, along with a kataphract, a unit of Byz Infantry, 2 units of Steppe Heavy Cavalry and a Pronoai Allagion unit.
I pretty much shot cannons at them till I was empty and till I hit them, then just struck them with the 1 2 of charging them down.

A nuisance of a battle, but I did spare whatever remained of them.

[Tony Furze]

Just had three teeny tiny battles against the Vikings, playing as the Picts.

The Vikings sent a single unit of archers to Fib, where I had a unit of spearmen.I put them on loose formation, hid in the trees till they used up all their arrows and chased them off the map. Neither of us lost a man, but my gen. got a star.

Then the Vikings sent 1 unit Landsmen and 1 archers against my 2 units of Celtics and 1 Unit of spearmen. Pretty much the same tactics. I mobbed the landsmen with 200 Celtics.

Finally they sent a unit of Carls to my Archers and Celts. I took as many as I could with my arrows. Then mobbed them. Good for raising gen. stars.

[bamff]

My own smallest was one unit of Urban Militia facing two enemy units of archers. I figured the AI would just stand back and shoot my guys to bits, so thinking that dead is dead, and that they may as well go down fighting, I ordered them to charge down the hill into the archers, who were marching up one unit behind the other.

To my surprise, first archer unit got wedged against second unit and was massacred. Routing survivors panicked second archer unit, who also tried to run. Sadly for them, they left it too late!

I also recently had an instance where the Poles had chosen to defend Prussia with a solitary royal knight....so I invaded (with 32 billmen), and he ran away, so I don't suppose that counts....

[naut]

Yea. It's effectively the same as invading an empty province, and just taking control of it. There is still a downgrading. This is because my assassin was a clumsy devil, managing to knock the port down, and lean against a castle wall causing it to collapse on the way in.

[caravel]

Reminds me of this thread: https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showthread.php?t=71517

[gunslinger]

I can't recall my smallest battle as far as starting units, but I did have one battle where it ended with my king fighting the enemy king in single combat. I wish I had taken a screen shot of those two guys standing on the battlefield all alone. I lost the battle, by the way, because my king got exhausted before his.

[Specialist290]

My personal smallest: Viking campaign, 12 Berserkers vs. 100 Peasant rebels. No losses on my part, and total destruction of the enemy.

There were also 2 units of Huscarls, but they didn't even get to participate in the actual battle.

[caravel]

My personal smallest: Viking campaign, 12 Berserkers vs. 100 Peasant rebels. No losses on my part, and total destruction of the enemy.

There were also 2 units of Huscarls, but they didn't even get to participate in the actual battle.

Easy I'm afraid (and this is not the drink talking this time!). 24 Berserkers vs 100 peasants is a forgone conclusion. In fact 24 Berserkers vs 300 peasants is. This is because berserkers cast off their shirts and run into battle to the tune of the Village People's YMCA and frighten the enemy to death... ok I'll get my coat.

[Specialist290]

I know it was fairly easy, but at the time I had never seen how Berserkers perform in battle, and therefore I was rather pleasantly surprised

[Martok]

Easy I'm afraid (and this is not the drink talking this time!). 24 Berserkers vs 100 peasants is a forgone conclusion. In fact 24 Berserkers vs 300 peasants is. This is because berserkers cast off their shirts and run into battle to the tune of the Village People's YMCA and frighten the enemy to death... ok I'll get my coat.

Caravel, I thank you for making me laugh hard enough to fall out of my chair.

[Evil_Maniac From Mars]

Yea. It's effectively the same as invading an empty province, and just taking control of it. There is still a downgrading. This is because my assassin was a clumsy devil, managing to knock the port down, and lean against a castle wall causing it to collapse on the way in.

Sir, congratulations. That was the funniest thing I've read all day.

[Motep]

I can beat all of that! 1 on 1. Sent 1 archer to kill 1 fuedal knight. Just thought it wold be funny to do that. Second smallest was assaulting 3 men with 2 of my own! Getting rid of surplus. Both were victories! The latter got me a provence!

[naut]

Reminds me of this thread: https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showthread.php?t=71517

[macsen rufus]

Motep has to win the prize -- you can't get smaller than 1 on 1 (and anyway, who doesn't want a bit of hot 1 on 1 action every now and again )

And Gunslinger, serious battle if you end up with just the two kings duking it out in the field!

And specialist:

I know it was fairly easy, but at the time I had never seen how Berserkers perform in battle, and therefore I was rather pleasantly surprised

.... better than the enemy who were somewhat peasantly surprised

(you didn't see my coat on the way out did you, Caravel....? )

[caravel]

Motep has to win the prize -- you can't get smaller than 1 on 1 (and anyway, who doesn't want a bit of hot 1 on 1 action every now and again )

And Gunslinger, serious battle if you end up with just the two kings duking it out in the field!

And specialist:



.... better than the enemy who were somewhat peasantly surprised

(you didn't see my coat on the way out did you, Caravel....? )

You can borrow mine sir, it appears that your need is greater.

The berserker, slav warrior and celtic warrior is collectively referred to as the topless loon within the game files. It is quite hilarious to watch them hurtling towards a load of peasants. You just think: "run you fools! run for your lives!"

I've recently used some in a viking campaign I'm playing. To be honest I'm turtling along so badly that I'll never conquer anything. I've had a civil war as well, which turned out well because it got rid of my pathetic king. I had trained a new raiding party of 2 berskers and combined them with 3 huscarles from the royals. They did well until they were attacked by the a mercian force 3 times the size consisting of huscarles. I decided to defend anyway. The berserkers I hid in the woods on the flank and the huscarles I deployed in a line up front. The enemy armoured spearmen moved in first and their huscarles moved in on the flank. I hit them with a downhill charge, and charged the berserkers out of the woods into their flanks. Cutting through the enemy ranks, these half naked loons were unstoppable. I could almost hear the enemy general (WTF??!!). But it was probably the smell that did it in the end. The berserkers were never famous for their deoderant use after all and toothpaste was about 750 florins a tube back then (the price of a port!). The rest of the enemy routed and I was left feeling rather surprised to hear the great Viking victory music.

[naut]

Nice battle by the way.

[Scurvy]

Playing as Norway on XL. i attacked sweden the previous turn and although i won we both took very lard losses, and so i was forced to withdraw, next turn, with my newly trained unit of vikings i attacked again, to find myself fighting a whole unit of royal knights and a ballista, after about 30mins of royal knights marching round me in circles, i trapped them in trees and killed them although maybe 3/4 of my unit were lost, i then tried to charge the ballista but it took 3 shots and my men ran

[naut]

Had a similar thing happen when I was the Irish against te Scots! Damned annoying to say the least.

[caravel]

Playing as Norway on XL. i attacked sweden the previous turn and although i won we both took very lard losses, and so i was forced to withdraw, next turn, with my newly trained unit of vikings i attacked again, to find myself fighting a whole unit of royal knights and a ballista, after about 30mins of royal knights marching round me in circles, i trapped them in trees and killed them although maybe 3/4 of my unit were lost, i then tried to charge the ballista but it took 3 shots and my men ran

Extremely annoying in fact. It's the "under fire" morale penatly, seemingly combined with the fear factor that missiles from artillery units seem to cause. The more of them there are the worse it is, especially with battered non elites. I've had the same thing when sending light cav or horse archers against the enemy's straggling ballistas. As they are moving in, the ballistas fire on them and if even one hit is scored it causes a rout. It's best to approach from cover and stay in close formation in this case, as loose decreases morale further.

-Edit: Also don't forget that the artillery crews have insanely high base morale.