Getting Good Cav Charges

[Carl]

I know this was discussed to death in another thread, however I never saw a clear consensus achieved, so I’d like to hear how you manage it, (unpatched BTW). As the method I used in the Gold Edition Demo, (right click once and let them walk up, then they lower lances and charge once in range), just doesn’t work at all. They get spread out while walking and then do terrible as they don't do a formed charge.

In addition, when I tell units to withdraw from combat I’m getting an annoying situation where they literally ignore the order totally, and I know they are ignoring it was other selected units do it but one or 2 always ignore it and keep fighting.

Between these two problems I’ve lost easily a half a dozen generals and 1000's of cavalry in just 4 campaigns (I’ve quit most of them because of this bug). It's particularly troublesome in battles that are against me as I often use bodyguard cav charges in RTW to turn the tide. This doesn’t work in M2TW, and it utter murder winning such battles.

[econ21]

I'd like to hear this question discussed in the context of the post-patch game (no objection to discussing it pre-patch as well). I suspect most gamers here have patched the game and cavalry charges were changed with the patch to make them easier to get off.

[Skott]

Prepatch couldnt get charges to work at all. Post-patch its sorta hit and miss. Sometimes they charge and sometimes they dont. Most times they dont I'm experiencing. When they do charge properly its amazing to watch! The AI doesnt seem to have any trouble doing it though. Obviously CA needs to do some more work on the cavalry charges.

Just my two florin

[Foz]

Yeah... some thoughts:

1. Get the patch. It helps a ton. Also, it seems that the charges will go off with single- or double-click attacks post-patch which is really great if you need your guys to hurry, but still charge. For me, even the post-patch charges weren't totally spot on though. That brings up 2:
2. Mod charge distances in the export_desc_unit.txt file. The originally proposed changes here were to set units with original settings to the new settings as follows (via find and replace):

stat_charge_dist 30 -> stat_charge_dist 9
stat_charge_dist 40 -> stat_charge_dist 12
stat_charge_dist 45 -> stat_charge_dist 22

Props to --HorseArcher-- for the idea and initial modification. 30 and 40 are the 2 charge distances used for infantry, while 45 is that of cavalry in the vanilla file. The benefit of lowering the charge distances is that the units will maintain a good tight formation for much longer into the approach, only breaking into a charge much later. This in turn tends to keep them grouped better even as they impact, and additionally makes the charges go off correctly more (almost 100% from what I've seen) of the time.

For my tastes, though, 9 and 12 were too low for infantry - the guys are almost close enough to shave each other before they start trying to charge, and it's especially weird looking if the target tries to counter-charge. I tried the following, and was much more pleased - the charges are still more accurate than vanilla settings, and happen late... but not so late as to look unnatural:

stat_charge_dist 30 -> stat_charge_dist 15
stat_charge_dist 40 -> stat_charge_dist 20
stat_charge_dist 45 -> stat_charge_dist 22

That's what I'm using at the moment, though I will probably push the cav setting up to 25. Having it at 22, I've watched as an infantry group counter-charged, and the cav just barely got lances down in time. An extra 3 should do the trick I think... plus 15/20/25 looks really nice

[Skott]

Keep us posted how that works out for you, Foz. I may try your mod myself but I'll wait for you to test it a bit more before changing the distance myself. looking forward to your results.

[Hamburglo]

Arrange cav 3 ranks deep, perpendicular to the target at a decent distance.

Right click on the target.

Press R.

Watch.

The only vital part of a charge now is that before the cavalry begin the final lances-down charge they must be facing the target unit directly and be in a coherent formation. Giving them plenty of time walking (or running) towards the target outside of charge distance helps them bind together a lot. A couple of small things can still hinder them, such as the target unit being spread all over the show but its less hinderance than it was pre-patch. Works 99% of the time for me, and when it doesn't, I know what I did wrong.

If you keep in mind that they're an OFFENSIVE weapon, and you use them accordingly, you'll have muchos success. The 1st units to hit the enemy line in my battles are the heavy cavalry. Once they've killed their lot, withdraw them and throw in the infantry. You could withdraw and charge again if they're not taking too many losses. Offense, offense, offense!

Its still very difficult to charge in settlements although its a minor sort of point.

[RTKBarrett]

In multiplayer ive found units with lances such as knights are best used two lines depth... its important to have them lined up with the target before the charge otherwise it becomes a bit messy.
Myself and others have found that once a cavalry unit draws swords after initial charge then reforms, they rarely go back to using their lances... Ive tried alt + attack and its had better results with the charge *use of lance* than just double right click.