My General keeps betraying

[Myst]

Hiya

I am playing as Spain and each time I send an army to Portugal to attack, they keep getting lost! Has the army’s betrayed me and joined there country?

How can I stop this from happening?

[Zanshin]

How can I stop this from happening?

Are you sending troops without a loyal general?

[Aenlic]

Yes, you need a general with your troops to guarantee they won't become rebels. You can, however, sometimes get a general out of an unescorted army by sending them into battle without a general. If they win, there's a chance a general will be created in that stack. These battlefield promotion often produce some very nice generals with good stats.

[Sardo]

Yes, you need a general with your troops to guarantee they won't become rebels.

Yeah, well, I'm afraid you have pretty much no guarantee at all that any army will not rebel against you when it's not in a city or castle:


That's the best general in my kingdom, who had just lifted the siege of Gaza by soundly beating the Egyptian army before I hit 'End turn'. Note that he wasn't exactly the disloyal type. He did, however, have a son who also stole one of my armies while leading it toward Damascus. The Egyptians did that one in.

[Kraxis]

Are we certain it is the other factions? Shouldn't the Egyptians be getting him as their general? I mean whenever I have tried to bribe an army (and failed of course) it says that certain troops will disband and other will join me. This entire army has rebelled.

Anyway, that man was a sore loss. With his great retinue and traits, he is a pretty rare find.

[Sardo]

Sorry if that last comment about the Egyptians wasn't very clear; what I meant was that Dawkins junior, son of Perkin here, also went rebel quite a few turns earlier right after I had sent him into Egyptian territory, and the Egyptians subsequently killed him and his troops (I forgot to send them a thank-you note though).

Now the father has followed suit by taking my victorious army and setting himself up as a brigand warlord. So neither he nor his son were bribed, they simply turned rebel - which makes it all the worse: if even the best general in the kingdom can decide at any point in time to screw me over like that, how can I prevent any army from doing the same without keeping them garrisoned all the time?

Also, I only noticed this by looking at the screenshot, but there were two or three units of Dismounted Feudal Knights in that army also, and apparently they were disbanded.

My first thought after this... unfortunate incident was to look up the cheat code to give myself some money and then bribe him back, but I've played on a few turns since then and I've used the extra cash I get from not having to pay that army to train new, better units - and I'm actually secretly hoping for him to attack Gaza, which would result in a nice massacre and sweet revenge, but I won't be holding my breath for that.

[Husar]

Hmm, I sent a general and two units of Teutonic Knights from my capital to a castle and on half the way he got bribed by Sicily or just decided to join them, I don't know. In the following round, my two units of Teutonic Knights, which were apparently loyal and still under my command annihilated him and one of them became man of the hour.

But I pretty often use or have to use armies without general anyway because they either die at the worst moment in a battle(like when I decide to let them kill the last militia unit in a city square, because this seems safe for a mighty general...) or they happen to drink some coffee with an inquisitor who doesn't really enjoy the conversation...

[Vlad Tzepes]

Sardo: There's something wrong with all those Perkins - just yesterday my own 3 stars Perkin general defected while en route from Innsbruck to Venice, leading half a stack.

Beware! Don't trust Perkin series generals anymore!

(what i hate is the lack of the "magnifying glass" when the "traitor to our cause" event occurs:

Counterespionage boss: "Ummm... Sir? there's a traitor to our cause".
Sir: "Arrrgghhh! I knew it! Who? Where?"
C.B.: "Errr... A certain general Perkins, that's P-E-R-K-I-N-S. And we have no clue where he is now"
Sir: "Arrrrggghhh! Find him and kill him!"
C.B.: "Right, Sir. And, ummmm, by the way, Sir? There's an unexpected surge in rebel activity around your capital. There's a full stack camped on the bridge over there, strangely enough, the rebel scum seems to be lead by one Perkins, that's P-E-R-K-I-N-S."
Sir: "How bizarre, how bizarre... Anyway, kill the traitor and bribe the rebel. Try not to get confused this time, will you? Dismissed."

[Sardo]

Well, I haven't yet run into any other Perkins, but I sure as heck am keeping a very close eye on the two remaining members of the Dawkins family - Perkin's other sons who have not followed in their brother's and father's footsteps. They'll be spending the rest of their lives in their respective castle and city alright.

I agree with your point on the magnifying glass - especially when it's just a small stack that has defected (it's rather obvious what happened when there's suddenly a huge rebel stack sitting where you left a huge stack of your own last turn).

[Vanya]

GAH!

Vanya has found that if you stick your captain-led armies in forts, they tend to stick around for the grub.

When moving with no forts to spend the night in, split army into little groups and move them like that. Vanya has seen that small groups tend to not rebel, especially if they are surrounded by more men with your banner. Bring them together at the moment of attack.

Large armies, however, vanish faster than a virgin on spring break.

GAH!

[Gorm]

I had a Spanish general who was a faction heir and a successful crusader become a rebel in a Moorish provence and take the whole danged crusader army with him!!! These guys had recently taken the city as part of the crusade I asked the Pope to start. I have no idea how this could have happened. Maybe he did not get back to his family in Spain fast enough??

[monkian]

I've never had a genral rebel whilst playing very late into an English campaign

[danfda]

I've only had captains rebel. Lots of those, but never a full-fledged general. Though I've seen other factions's generals up and decide they want to be like spring break virgins.

[madchoochter]

Never had a general betray yet, but had plenty of captains. Especially in Spain. Something about the place just seems to turn 'em. Not had a problem in England or France, but they are more Christian than Spain is so it might be tied to religion or civil unrest. I have noticed that I can turn a lot of Portuguese soldiers into rebels by sending spies and assassins to Lisbon and Pwotsit to create unrest. Very handy when your focusing on driving out the Moors from Iberia but want to keep Portugal busy or deplete their forces so you can take them out as soon as your done with the Moors.

Are you keeping the council of nobles happy? I don't know what the penalties are for not doing noble missions long term (keeping them happy seems to gives cash bonuses now and then), but generals are noblemen iirc so perhaps they are more likely to rebel if you ignore those missions. Just a theory.

[Fat Buddha]

Though not a general betrayal, I have found it nearly impossible to keep units from going rebel. For instance I was making units in nottingham and autopathing them to Caenarvon. Building 3 at a time sending them across solo. After about 6 turns i looked at the caenarvon castle and there were still only 2 troops. So i looked at nottingham. Nope they weren't there. Then i noticed the pile of grey flags in my land. Apparently all 18 units individually decided to go rebel. everyone made it half way across england and then said the heck with it i like it here.

Curious i then made 2 full stacks of units and sent them. poof! half way across both betrayed me. So now i had 18 single units and 2 full stacks of rebels. in the middle of england. what are the odds i figured. so i sent a full stack of my most expensive units. i figured hey they are payed well... why would they turn coat? sure enough the got half way and... they stayed loyal. i was happy. next turn though just prior to making it to the castle the turned.

I turned off thhe game and found a book to read.

I can say i have only been able to move non-general escorted troops from one city to another about 60% of the time.

[Daveybaby]

I suspect that its not all down to the stats of your generals, but more due to the stats of your faction leader.

[Durallan]

if your king has little to no authority and most people regard him wetter than a wet blanket being washed in the middle of the monsoonal rains, then most of your troops will become turncoats. I had this happen in my scottish empire, I owned the entire world and had a legacy of great kings, but as soon as I had a stupid king, suddenly no one wanted to follow him anymore.

[Von Nanega]

if your king has little to no authority and most people regard him wetter than a wet blanket being washed in the middle of the monsoonal rains, then most of your troops will become turncoats. I had this happen in my scottish empire, I owned the entire world and had a legacy of great kings, but as soon as I had a stupid king, suddenly no one wanted to follow him anymore.

Yep, had this happen when I was playing England.

[seneschal.the]

Use forts - identical to cities when it comes to defections (they won't ever defect).

Whenever I capture Italy I have a small army, forted, a bit west of Bologna. The cities only have as much garrison as they can support for free. Keeps control of the entire region nicely by being able to reach every city in 1 turn, reinforcing in case the AI wants to assault. (Or I get bored and just sally out and kill them - with the broken AI not doing anything)

[pdoan8]

Do having a good diplomat (or spy, I'm not sure of which) travel with the army reduce the chance of army will rebel/deflect (bribed)?

It seems to help a bit for me. So, whenever I have to walk an army some where, I always have 1 dip (2+ infl), 1 spy and may be an assassin going with them. If the army is led by a general, I might add a priest (2+ piety).

[Booga]

Chivalry is also a factor in loyalty. If you plan on crusading, best send your king and heir too. High-chivalry generals like their ruler to be straitlaced like themselves, and especially if your king happens to be Darth Vader, they'll be pretty restless. The same goes for piety and excommunication, by the way. If an army defects due to excommunication there's a special notice for it, though - some dreck about how the guy can't follow a ruler who'd fight his fellow Christians. This seems to happen soon after excommunication, so at least you can weed out and destroy the problematic ones first.

[supadodo]

Yup, general loyalty means nothing if your king has no authority.Learnt that once. But I do remeber something quirky when playing barbarian invasion. My king went rebel! and all the nice elite clibinarrii with him poofed in magic disloyal dust. Anywho, a good tip to prevent generals from rebelling is to always give them something to do. If you leave them standing for a few turns then they will go rebel but just march them about aimlessly and they remain okay- probably because of all that exercise which makes them look buff and thus increasing their happiness hehe. well it works for me.

[PseRamesses]

I´ve never lost a general or another unit since I started packing a spy with them.

[DukeKent]

I have never had a stack rebel with an assassin it. In fact I always put an assassin with any General that I don't trust. Guess they are the Medievel version of the secret police