M2TW: Worth the Price?

[fallen851]

It could do that in STW, but has not got there with the RTW style map.

I think this is the problem. I've only played RTW and the demo for STW, which got me into the series. I held off buying STW because RTW was coming out shortly after I played the demo, then I realized I couldn't play RTW because my comp was too slow, so when I upgraded and remembered about RTW I got it.

Anyways, back to the main point, in the STW "battle trainer", I think I have like 60%, 70% max, win ratio against the AI, in the battle with 2 units of spears, 2 units of archers, 1 heavy cav, and 1 spear cav.

The AI is good. It makes good choices, it uses units well, it creates matchup problems for me, and often overruns me.

I've lost a total of two battles in RTW. One where I foolishly charged some rebels up a mountain with town watch, and the other when the Spanish declared war on me and attack 4 units of town watch on the move, with a full stack including Bullmen, and I don't use lame tactics...

However I've taken on three full stacks, with a 3/4 stack, and won. The game is pathetically easy on the battlefield. If that happened in STW, I'm assuming I would lose bad, since I can hardly handle an equal battle...

Now maybe I just suck at STW, I don't know, but I really want effective battle AI!

[dismal]

My only gripe was dismal sounding condescending, almost patronising to other members who maybe received it as a gift or had it bought for them. Apparently his job and hence earned money makes his opinion more valid because its his earned money. I maybe a little too confrontational sometimes (I'm sure I'll be hearing from econ21 ), but I would never have dreamt of patronising the other members in this way.

The question was "was the game worth the price". I answered how I felt about the question that was asked.

[Moah]

Yes


And I have the answer to the significant other - work abroad! 2 weeks solid every evening gameplay followed by 2 weeks total cold turkey. It's great. Apart from the Cold Turkey. And being away form home for 2 weeks at a time.

Well, apart from the Cold Turkey, being away from home...[what has M2TW ever done for us]

[Matty]

I paid for a new video card (after paying for an extra GB of RAM) to enable me to actually play the game. So its cost me c. 300 USD to play the game. After struggling with low resolution and eyeball tearing slowness on sieges for a couple of months I can honestly say they were the best value purchases I have made in the last year. But then I do have a job. Ahem. LOVE those blood soaked soldiers at the end of a tough battle....

[screwtype]

No it isnt. Most new releases now are mediocre beta's that get the label "gold" and they are put out. You buy a new PC game today at release, you can count on some blemishs. If you like the give and take of testing features reporting bugs and participating in solutions by all means shell out your 50.00.

Personally I dont want to be a paying beta tester.

Me either. I will not be buying M2TW until I hear all the major bugs have been fixed. It's plain to me I'd hate to play the game in its current state. There are some people who actually think RTW is a better game, and that says it all to me.

Quite frankly, I'm pretty much finished with being a fan of the Total War series anyhow. In my opinion the only really good game they put out was Shogun/MI, it's been downhill all the way since. I don't see myself ever buying a full price TW game again, in fact I'll probably wait until they are published by Red Ant Software for $9.95.

[Odin]

Me either. I will not be buying M2TW until I hear all the major bugs have been fixed. It's plain to me I'd hate to play the game in its current state. There are some people who actually think RTW is a better game, and that says it all to me.

Quite frankly, I'm pretty much finished with being a fan of the Total War series anyhow. In my opinion the only really good game they put out was Shogun/MI, it's been downhill all the way since. I don't see myself ever buying a full price TW game again, in fact I'll probably wait until they are published by Red Ant Software for $9.95.

I personally like the time period and I will buy MTW2 some time in the future. That said it is the rare occassion when a PC game is released without some issues (like the spear thing, or cavalry charges). Some guys love the interaction and contibutions you do when you get a early release game.

I tip my hat to them, personally I'll wait until the company patches up thier game to correct issues that should already be fixed. Lots of companies release games and patch later under the guise of "support" and why do they do this?

Mainly because the can, gamers buy the game no matter what. If it wasnt profitable companies wouldnt do it. I understand its a business model and by all accounts (the TW series as an example) its very successful. For me I'll stick with MTW VI with a mod, why? Because its an excellent game refined, patched and modded to get the most out of the system, just like MTW2 will be 6-12 months from now.

[screwtype]

Perhaps I overstated the case a little. After all I haven't even played the game yet, maybe it's better than I've been led to believe.

All the same, I've been very disappointed to hear about all the bugs, especially with the AI and other important issues such as pathfinding and unit balance. When added to the fact that next to nothing has been done to revamp the clumsy campaign game and primitive economic system since Shogun, which have always been major gripes of mine, and it's clear to me that CA are never going to design the superior strategy game I once hoped to see from them.

But if they can't or won't design a good strategy game, at least I want a decent action game, and the plethora of bugs and AI inadequacies indicate that for whatever reason they are no longer delivering even that much.

And when all is said and done, I've already got three TW games on my hard drive, do I really need another one, especially when it's apparent the gameplay if anything has been going backwards since Shogun? I'm afraid the answer is no. If the AI had been getting better with each new release, I'd probably be lining up to put my money down along with everyone else. But when I know I can get better gameplay and more entertainment from Shogun, why bother?

So there's really no incentive for me to keep supporting this company with my dollars. My only real interest in M2TW is to see how much better the graphics are than in previous games, but I'm certainly not going to lay down AU$100 for the privilege.

TW is definitely in the "budget" category for me now, my interest is primarily in good, complex, immersive, and preferably historically realistic strategy games and that clearly isn't what CA is about. I'm really not sure what they're about anymore, except perhaps selling as many units as humanly possible, but if that's their overriding focus, they won't be selling much to me.

[Odin]

Perhaps I overstated the case a little. After all I haven't even played the game yet, maybe it's better than I've been led to believe.

A lot of very smart gamers think its a great game, I have no doubt its going to be a gem, but all precious stones need to be polished.

All the same, I've been very disappointed to hear about all the bugs, especially with the AI and other important issues such as pathfinding and unit balance.

I guess this is where you and I differ, I am not dissapointed at all, I have come to expect that new release games arent always up to snuff. As I have said, some guys love to be in on the fix, some (like me) prefer to wait until the games got a little patina on it.

TW is definitely in the "budget" category for me now, my interest is primarily in good, complex, immersive, and preferably historically realistic strategy games and that clearly isn't what CA is about. I'm really not sure what they're about anymore, except perhaps selling as many units as humanly possible, but if that's their overriding focus, they won't be selling much to me.

Well you and I have a completely different outlook, I think CA makes a pretty good game when its all said and done, Ive gotten a lot of enjoyment out of STW and MTW (didnt get RTW, not intrested in the time period). While no game is perfect, CA and the TW series certainly dosent mince its message on what you are getting, its a graphic intensive battle simulation with some strategy elements thrown in.

[Steph]

Yes, having just played the MTW VI series this is a step up "warts and all". Not having played the RTW series I have no comparison issues but I am satisfied and waited till the first patch came out before I purchased. Have been playing vanilla and with mods.
If your CPU needs an upgrade then it's worth it to upgrade and get the game. Keep in mind it doesn't not need anything major if you have upgraded in the last year or so. My system is decent and I am very happy with the video card settings on low. It is still a visual experience and runs great.

Couldn't say better :D
Would have voted "yes", but I dont know how to vote.

Stéphane

[Stlaind]

I think a lot of people like to kvetch on the forums.
Yeah, the game may well have been rushed, yes there is bugs.
But if you honestly think that neither is going to be the case, you've got no clue about the software industry as a whole.

[screwtype]

A lot of very smart gamers think its a great game, I have no doubt its going to be a gem, but all precious stones need to be polished

I'd like to believe that, but I have little reason to. Was RTW ever fixed? They stomped most of the serious bugs, yes, but did they ever fix the somnolent AI? No they didn't.

I've just reached the stage where I no longer kid myself that a patch is going to fix the gameplay flaws. Yes, I think many of the bugs will be fixed, but I very much doubt the AI is going to improve noticeably from this point. If I'm wrong, then I'll happily go and buy the game. But I'll believe it when I see it.

I guess this is where you and I differ, I am not dissapointed at all, I have come to expect that new release games arent always up to snuff. As I have said, some guys love to be in on the fix, some (like me) prefer to wait until the games got a little patina on it

I definitely think the smart thing to do is to wait. Not only do you get the game cheaper, but when you finally do get it, you get the benefit of all the patches and all the mods. That way you haven't grown tired of the game before it's even been made halfway playable. You're coming to it fresh when it's at its best.

Well you and I have a completely different outlook, I think CA makes a pretty good game when its all said and done, Ive gotten a lot of enjoyment out of STW and MTW (didnt get RTW, not intrested in the time period). While no game is perfect, CA and the TW series certainly dosent mince its message on what you are getting, its a graphic intensive battle simulation with some strategy elements thrown in.

Yes, I'm not saying it's such a bad paradigm, just that they did it better the first time around, and I see no reason to repeat the experience with inferior gameplay.

Eye candy is all very nice but it certainly isn't worth the cost of a full price game, in fact it's not worth much at all in my book.

[Slug For A Butt]

But if they can't or won't design a good strategy game, at least I want a decent action game, and the plethora of bugs and AI inadequacies indicate that for whatever reason they are no longer delivering even that much.

Then stick to an action game, with or without the bugs. This isn't an action game! This, as with most TW games, is a good mind stimulater as long as you don't take the easy cheap ways to win such as all out cav attacks (M2) or phalanx wall in the corner of the map (RTW). Not using these lame tactics isn't "restricting yourself", it's just playing the game the way it should be.

Eye candy is all very nice but it certainly isn't worth the cost of a full price game, in fact it's not worth much at all in my book.

We read different books, it is to me. Why don't you stick to STW instead of bitching about a game you haven't even played yet?
Christ... this is what it has come to. Even people that have never played the game jump on the bandwagon and bitch about it, what chance do CA have? As far as I'm concerned you have no valid opinion of this game until you have played it.
Stop jumping on the bandwagon! Make your own mind up.

[alex9337]

Best game I have ever played. I thoroughly enjoy it. Prior to this, my favourite game was RTW.

This game has been out for now, what, approximately 9 weeks? I got it the first day and have averaged about 20 hours (minimum) per week, for a total of 180 hours of play so far.

For $50, that makes my cost per hour (to date) to be a little over $0.25 per hour.

I am by no means anywhere near being bored with this game yet and I look forward to more patches and more great work by the modding community to extend and enhance my enjoyment even more!

Eventually, I fully expect my cost to use ratio to drop to a fraction of a penny per hour. There are very few forms of entertainment that can match this.

I love the time period, role play the game in my head while I play and am not overly concerned with "achieving" the pre-defined victory conditions that have been set. Actually, the payoff that you get to see when you "win" isn't great, anyway.

I realize that this, like any computer game, has its limitations. However, this does not detract from the splendid graphics and for me, the sheer enjoyment derived from tinkering around with a game that deals with my favourite area of study.

I heartily recommend that you purchase this game if you can enjoy it like I can.

"To me, Lewellyn, To me!"

[Callahan9119]

i havnt read all these posts, but i said no it isnt worth the price; especially if you are forced to upgrade even 100 dollars worth of ram to play it.

if you started your TW experiance at rtw then u will prolly love this, as do some die hards who just love anything TW. i find it quite lacking in content and depth. besides graphics and diplomacy issues {that have been dying to be fixed since STW} there wasnt really much done to the game....although instead of making the ai fight smarter they just made it charge you right away, which oddly enough does seem to make the fights more challenging

i like the new map that rome brought, but i am still so mad that my favorite aspect of MTW was left out, glorious achievments, i have faithfully bought every single TW game since shogun, and if this was STW2 i would be perfectly happy to have only the option to conquer, as this is what actually happened to japan, but its just cheesy doing it in europe i think....and with each installment i see a continued lack of vision on the part of CA

i mean i wasnt even done with my first campaign as the english and i was already bored and thinking "didnt i just do this as greece"

the short campaigns are ok, but the long ones are so tedious and the fact that i'v done this for the past 5 years just makes it mind numbing...just waiting for a good mod to hopefully be made, or they make an expansion for this set back in japan, or a well made mod to this game adding a glorious achievments type game

if i could actually get online to play my opinion might be different, but as of now my cd key printed inside my game is "invalid" even after going to documents and settings and retyping it, but what else is new

[ASPER THE GREAT]

Well now, I have been playing war games for 30 years now. and the TW games are by far the best ever!!!! With the bugs included. I bought SG+invasion, ME+inv, Rome+inv, and even screwed around with the mods a bit. The price tag of $40 or $50 might be high for our younger players, but for an adult????? MEII is by far the best graphics, and AI that CA has put out and you can patch it all you want, but it still gives you hours of enjoyment . I wait till some games come on the market & read PC Gamer to see if the game will be worth the box it comes in (sometime the box is better than the game lol ). If you are posting on the ORG that says you play the TW games and if you did not buy it yet "THAT IS YOUR FAULT AND YOU SHOULD BE ASHAMED". I say it is a must have for any war gamer of any age... GO BUY IT TODAY .

[Odin]

did not buy it yet "THAT IS YOUR FAULT AND YOU SHOULD BE ASHAMED". I say it is a must have for any war gamer of any age... GO BUY IT TODAY .

I dont own the game, but have played the total war series a lot, I have been on these boards since early 04 and consider myself somewhat informed on current issues with the series. There is enough data on the boards, and history with CA that one can make an informed opinion.

Sure if you have the game your in a better informed position, but setting forth conditions by which to post an opinion and its validity seems a bit forward for a person on thier 3rd post.

Perhaps a little more cache before we tell others what they should be ashamed off?

[screwtype]

There is enough data on the boards, and history with CA that one can make an informed opinion.

I agree, and I'm certainly not going to go buy the game just to confirm to myself that it wasn't worth the money!