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**Slaists** · 04-29-2007, 21:04

Originally Posted by PseRamesses

Changing sides? I´ve never encountered that in M2. As a cath I´m allied with all other cath´s and they are at war to the left and right but I´ve never been forced to end an alliance with either of them. Occasionally the pope ask you to terminate an alliance with some x-commed faction but that is another matter.

I did not pay attention to this aspect in MTW2 vanilla (before any patches). If my memory does not fail me, the player was not forced to choose sides when allies attacked each other. This is no longer true in 1.02. If one of the player's allies attacks another, there is a pop-up that comes up asking whether the player would like to stay allied to the attacker. If the answer is "no" (or, to be more precise, "cancel"), the player remains allied with the defender, losing his alliance to the attacker. If the answer is "yes", the player remains allied to the attacker and loses alliance to the defender.

Player receives reputation hit in both cases (remaining allied to the attacker or remaining allied to the defender).

**PseRamesses** · 04-30-2007, 13:29

Originally Posted by Slaists

I did not pay attention to this aspect in MTW2 vanilla (before any patches). If my memory does not fail me, the player was not forced to choose sides when allies attacked each other. This is no longer true in 1.02. If one of the player's allies attacks another, there is a pop-up that comes up asking whether the player would like to stay allied to the attacker. If the answer is "no" (or, to be more precise, "cancel"), the player remains allied with the defender, losing his alliance to the attacker. If the answer is "yes", the player remains allied to the attacker and loses alliance to the defender.

Player receives reputation hit in both cases (remaining allied to the attacker or remaining allied to the defender).

Hmm, that´s CA logic for ya - getting a rep stab for cancel an alliance with an agressor. This has to be modded out!

**Vladimir** · 04-30-2007, 15:59

Originally Posted by PseRamesses

Hmm, that´s CA logic for ya - getting a rep stab for cancel an alliance with an agressor. This has to be modded out!

Or you may want to think about who you ally to.

**Bob the Insane** · 04-30-2007, 18:33

Originally Posted by Vladimir

Or you may want to think about who you ally to.

That is not really fair, if I ally to the Danes and the French early in the game I have no idea whether they will end up fighting later on...

I see the point in maybe being selective but even that does not always follow through... In my latests game the Poles, Denmark and Hungary are all allied and have left each other alone of many turns. However I could start another game and see Hungary and poland getting into an early fight...

One element of truth is that if you ally with everyone you can then you are either going to have this issue at some point (nore than once) or a uniquely boring campaign...

As for the rep hit for lossing an ally, that is hardly surprizing as you promised both military assistance without specifying defense only... I think the defender/attacker style of the question is simply a easy way to post the question without having to dynamically update the contents of the message with the names of factions concerned.

**TevashSzat** · 05-01-2007, 03:51

Originally Posted by Bob the Insane

One element of truth is that if you ally with everyone you can then you are either going to have this issue at some point (nore than once) or a uniquely boring campaign...

I actually have done this with all of the Catholic nations and has essentially made every Catholic nation allied with every other Catholic nation creating a peace within Europe that I have never seen before. All the computers do is to build up cities and train tons of stacks that patrol their borders which lead me to believe that with some careful diplomacy, I may be able to incite a huge war in Europe.

**Ciaran** · 05-01-2007, 09:13

Or not, inciting wars via diplomacy is something I´ve been trying for quite some time now (mostly trying to get other factions to attack me), usually without success.

**Bob the Insane** · 05-01-2007, 14:38

Originally Posted by Xdeathfire

I actually have done this with all of the Catholic nations and has essentially made every Catholic nation allied with every other Catholic nation creating a peace within Europe that I have never seen before. All the computers do is to build up cities and train tons of stacks that patrol their borders which lead me to believe that with some careful diplomacy, I may be able to incite a huge war in Europe.

Unless you are using a mod I believe they will eventually attack you. There are some triggers in the game that mean even your closest, bestest ally will eventually attack you if he has noone else to fight...

Still, interesting...

**Slaists** · 05-01-2007, 16:10

Originally Posted by Xdeathfire

I actually have done this with all of the Catholic nations and has essentially made every Catholic nation allied with every other Catholic nation creating a peace within Europe that I have never seen before. All the computers do is to build up cities and train tons of stacks that patrol their borders which lead me to believe that with some careful diplomacy, I may be able to incite a huge war in Europe.

I actually had a game with the same: all Catholic factions mutually allied. For some time... However, at some point they started to break alliances and attack each other (not me...)

**PseRamesses** · 06-30-2007, 10:12

I think it´s more a random thing, like in real life. I´m currently playing HRE (AD mod) and there has been no wars between my catholic brothers for over 70 years.

**PseRamesses** · 04-30-2007, 19:30

Originally Posted by Vladimir

Or you may want to think about who you ally to.

Seriously, do you really belive that will work???? Have you even played this game? JK

No, the AI attacks regardless of culture, reputation or relations. Until this is fixed I´m seriously thinking of modding this feat out of the game completely.