Predicting a rush?

[RTKBarrett]

I dnt know about u but there are certain occasions when im playing where i get this feeling "He's going to rush me..."
Rushing has been used in tw long before i even considered buying the game, and there have been many arguments concerning whether its a "valid" tactic, whether it requires skill etc but im not going to start a topic to discuss that as its been done.
Im simply starting a topic for ppl with any experience to put down there past encounters with rushes and what they have done in order to succeed against them...
Now for a rush to be successful im sure u will agree it requires:
- Surprise
- Speed
- Coordination of movement from the whole build *inf and cav*
- And a coordinated attack which attempts to leave a weakspot in the enemies line for exploiting

Im posting a replay in this thread just to demonstrate a few things in practice... In this specific game i was lucky enough to have played against a build i had encountered previously.

Therefore from the start i formed far back to give me time to assess the situation and form some sort of counter. I had brought 4 mounted xbowmen and used them from the off to harrass the enemies cavalry, by splitting them in two groups i was giving myself the chance to fire from the front and back to obtain maximal damage... This diversion also gave me enough time to form up my main force in how i saw best *Moving my strongest cav to match the enemies on the opposite flank/closing xbowmen's formation and using them as an extra barrier of bodies*

By making him move quicker than he would have expected, he made a mistake in that he left several cav on his right flank stranded to my own and the returning mounted xbowmen. I took advantage of this moment and quickly charged+flanked to gain an edge as fast as possible.

I then tried to move my infantry at an angle to make him move more but unfortunately was not quick enough and he was able to catch them off guard... however this turned into gd fate as by sending the bulge of his force in to the centre, it left me with a great opportunity to hit him from both sides. The rest was a simple flank and mop up... i did make a few mistakes not including the movment of the infantry.
- Firstly i did not have the foot xbows firing on what i would consider the best units
- I left it quite late unintentionally before i sent in the famiglia ducale

The surprise was not there, the coordination of the attack left him open and therefore i was able in beating the rush...
However this would have been alot closer *more a game in his favour* had i not formed back as far as i did... I think this replay should prove to Elmo and other doubters the power of a mounted xbow *or 4 *

http://www.megaupload.com/?d=AZO1AK8L

Questions/Comments/Arguments welcome

[Stig]

Well there are two kinds of rushes:
1. The Start Rush
2. The In-Battle Rush

The Start Rush is obvious, make a run for it
What I mean with the in battle rush is this ... and only work in Early Era:
In almost every of my battles you get a archer fight in the beginning, and everyone waits till that is over to move. When you have archers with normal range you are in Rush-range of the enemy. If he isn't paying attention that much (like me sometimes grabbing a beer, or whatever) you can easely suprise him and have him locked before he even knows it.
Keeping a wide front helps as well, so you can move around his flanks ... and most importantly HA do far less damage, as your opponent will mostlikely decide to attack you head-on with missiles instead of from the flanks, as he can't be bothered to move them round.

BTW, don't be scared of Horse Archers, with all their arrows they'll normally kill a max of about 60 men, I mean you bring about 1200, why bother? Mounted Crossbowmen are stronger yes, but if you keep calm and don't rush in you do yourself a favour, just let him fire at you, they don't do that much damage.

[Abdul]

When I rush, I use a tactic that all but your teammates will look down on.

All cav

I find that it is deadly. Some people keep saying "noob army you suck", "easy to use" etc. But when the same guys use it on me and just throw the cav in it does not work. In mtw it worked well because of the swipe bug (now that was easy to use), in vi it didn't work so well, with rome i don't know (hated the game), and it m2tw, it is my favourate tactic.


*waits for abuse*




Abdul or |C|GOS|Mole

[Paolai]

When I rush, I use a tactic that all but your teammates will look down on.

All cav

I find that it is deadly.
Abdul or |C|GOS|Mole

yes it works ALWAYS.

[Stig]

nope it doesn't, come fight the Staked Longbow Army

[Paolai]

nope it doesn't, come fight the Staked Longbow Army

charge the back.

[Stig]

charge the back.

you can't

[Paolai]

you can't

already answered also on the other topic. All cavs + 1 art if you like the circle. And, cavs that do not run do not die. YOu just have not to charge, click behind the units and walk (do not run). Try by yourself.

But all cavs + 1 art it is easier.

[CeltiberoMordred]

Don't you find sad that the only way to get a chance vs an all cav army is camping in a square of stakes? I do.

Apart from that, if my enemy's plan is sitting and doing nothing from the beginning, I'm not interested in playing. AI is funnier.

[ElmarkOFear]

One sure way to know if your enemy is going to rush is if he chooses the Aztecs. :) Barrett, do you have to register at that site to download files? I see the description, but not any download button.

[RTKBarrett]

One sure way to know if your enemy is going to rush is if he chooses the Aztecs. :) Barrett, do you have to register at that site to download files? I see the description, but not any download button.

When u click the link mate, in the top right hand corner there should be a small box to enter text. Next to it is a 3 digit/letter code that u have to enter, once u do that its a simple download to the mtw2 replay folder

[pike master]

one thing that goes in the aztecs favor is that they have 75 men archer regiments but you have to break the 4 unit limit and spend extra so you can get enough to have a good defensive ability plus spearmen are cheaper for the aztecs than any other spear unit in the game.

i havent tested it yet but they could actually do good defensivly but you would have to depend on cav help from your teammates.

[ElmarkOFear]

Thanks Barrett. I will look at those replays after work tonight. :)

[machiavelli69]

really a gg Barrett,
the maneuver on the left against his mailed knights deserve an applause ;)

I noted that the opponent has concentrated all infantry in the center not supporting the cav on the sides (i.e. with the pikes) and he has exposed (keeping it completely stuck) the cav on both sides to devastating charges!

[Kronos]

Quote:
Originally Posted by Abdul

When I rush, I use a tactic that all but your teammates will look down on.

All cav

I find that it is deadly.
Abdul or |C|GOS|Mole

yes it works ALWAYS.

I've found that it never works from personal experience of having it used on me.
Played a total of about 10-12 1v1's where the opponent has used all cav, and with a normal balanced army it's easy to beat to such an extent that a good player which i would class myself as would not have to really try very hard.
It gets slightly more complicated when they have a good selection of horse archers in their army so u have to try to beat them with w/e you have. This may be due to the fact that i use quite a bit of cav in most of my army builds, but most ppl do, and the players that have used this on me are by no means n00bs, but actually fairly decent when u get them in a normal game.

[Monarch]

I personally just really dont like all cav. I dunno I just feel dirty using it :P

But seriously, I think its important to have some sort of anvil for your cav spam hammer. I've noticed many of the good players when cav spamming at least get some peasants, just so say hold up enemy infantry. I think whats making Moors so popular is the sudanese tribes man, and also factions like france/scots with cheap pikes.