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  1. #1
    Dux Nova Scotia Member lars573's Avatar
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    Default Re: Essay Help! European Colonization

    Quote Originally Posted by Sarmatian
    Well, Catalan and Spanish are not the same, but that doesn't really matter.
    As far as I remember from college, Columbus was Italian who was living in Spain.
    More like Basque and Spainish are not the same. Catalan and Castllian are both Spainish dialects. Still when examined pieces of writing attributed to Columbus indicated that the pieces were written by someone who grew up speaking Catalan and was taugh to write at a young age.
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    Horse Archer Senior Member Sarmatian's Avatar
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    Default Re: Essay Help! European Colonization

    Quote Originally Posted by lars573
    More like Basque and Spainish are not the same. Catalan and Castllian are both Spainish dialects. Still when examined pieces of writing attributed to Columbus indicated that the pieces were written by someone who grew up speaking Catalan and was taugh to write at a young age.
    Well, I am not an expert on the linquistic matters, but as long as academic circles generaly agree that Columbus was Italian, I am going to go with that.

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    American since 2012 Senior Member AntiochusIII's Avatar
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    Default Re: Essay Help! European Colonization

    Quote Originally Posted by lars573
    More like Basque and Spainish are not the same. Catalan and Castllian are both Spainish dialects. Still when examined pieces of writing attributed to Columbus indicated that the pieces were written by someone who grew up speaking Catalan and was taugh to write at a young age.
    Links? Points to source? Bibliography? That's a pretty different claim from what I've heard. It's not like an Italian in the service of the Spanish Empire is something that uncommon, and Aragon -- Catalan to the core -- had a long tradition of meddling in Italian affairs long before the Italian Wars...
    Quote Originally Posted by Xdeathfire
    Religion did partially encourage the funding of Columbus's expedition. The reconquista just finished right before he left and the the Spanish king Ferdinand and queen Isabella (i think, names might be wrong) were still relatively in a state of religious fervor. They wanted to convert everyone and tried to do so with the Muslims, but they weren't very successful. As a result, they tried to convert pagans and viewed the Indians as pagans thus wanted Columbus to get to India for both economic and religiou factors too.
    Religious fervor is a factor in many of the subsequent expeditions of the conquistadors. However, I seriously doubt the quest for "India" was seriously influenced by that. The first discovery was not driven by the desire to convert the world but to try and pry open Spain to untold riches they imagined to be in Asia.

    Case in point: they didn't know the Native Americans even existed before Columbus accidentally found the "Indians." How, then, could they seek to convert them? It's not likely either that the monarchs would sponsor such an adventure because somehow they think the distant and supposedly powerful people of India would convert en mass to the religion once the ragtag band of European explorers arrive.

    Isabel y Fernando had a lot of ways to express their faith in Almighty God already, I think. There were the Moriscos, and there were the Jews, and there came the Inquisition... and there was Africa...
    Quote Originally Posted by Prince of the Poodles
    Muslim World:

    1. already on the trade routs
    2. somewhat geographically blocked from the major oceans
    3. already expanding into europe(turks) and africa

    Asian World:

    1. Considered itself superior to rest of the world(instructors view, not mine)
    2. no desire to elimenate the muslim middleman in trade
    3. attempted at one time to explore, but mysteriously stopped

    European World:

    1. Economics - open direct trade with asia
    2. spread of religion
    3. desire to expand
    4. more competition among nations than in the other spheres
    5. enlightened outlook on the world
    Muslim world - I think you got all the major points. Your three points fit perfectly the Ottomans, leaders of the Muslim world (minus a few challengers: Safavids, Morocco, etc.) In any case, the only power geographically situated to compete with the Europeans was Morocco, and the Moroccans were never strong enough or even interested enough to try something like that. They had their hands full with themselves, with that big dangerous superpower to their north, with the Berbers, Barbary pirates, and the West Africans...

    Asian world - your instructor most like refers to only China with that point. India was a hodgepodge of states and cultures unlikely to carry such a notion of superiority around. In any case, the point needs to be expanded in that the Ming were strict adherents to the philosophy of Confucius -- among which was moderation and modesty, something quite opposite to the adventurous spirit of the Explorer.

    China also had a famously disdainful outlook to merchants, usually the people who, you know, sail the seas, be Sinbads, go explore new trade routes and all that stuff.

    European World - More competition? Not necessarily. More like more competition that have taken that form in particular.

    Enlightened outlook? That didn't come until the Enlightenment at the earliest, long after Spain had already carved a big, big empire out of the Americas, or should I say corpses of dead Native Americans.

    They sought power and wealth, not scientific interest.

    It is also notable that the first waves of Spanish conquistadors and Portuguese explorers came during a very interesting time: the Reconquista had ended, and Ferdinand and Isabella were left with a large population of restless, ruthless, glory-hungry "freelancers" looking for stuff to do: a very, very dangerous position to be in. After Columbus found the new world, that "energy" had a very fortunate source of outlet, instead of, you know, at the monarchs themselves. After Portugal and Spain won such a critical success, the French got jealous, and they began their own era of exploration. The English and the Dutch followed suit, and the rest is history.

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    Horse Archer Senior Member Sarmatian's Avatar
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    Default Re: Essay Help! European Colonization

    Quote Originally Posted by AntiochusIIIt's not like an Italian in the service of the Spanish Empire is something [I
    that[/I] uncommon
    Or any other empire for that matter. Expecially in a naval capacity. From the top of my head - John Cabbot, he served in the English navy. He was Italian and his real name was Giovanni Cabboto.

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    Dux Nova Scotia Member lars573's Avatar
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    Default Re: Essay Help! European Colonization

    Quote Originally Posted by AntiochusIII
    Links? Points to source? Bibliography? That's a pretty different claim from what I've heard. It's not like an Italian in the service of the Spanish Empire is something that uncommon, and Aragon -- Catalan to the core -- had a long tradition of meddling in Italian affairs long before the Italian Wars...
    The Italian theory of Columbus's origins are that he was Genoese. Far from the parts of Italy that Aragon had a hand in. Also that he learned to read/write as an adult. This was all taken from his official biography. However it may not have been true. He faked being Genoese so that King Ferdinand would trust him.
    If you havin' skyrim problems I feel bad for you son.. I dodged 99 arrows but my knee took one.

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