Romanian Factions Requierd

[Russ Mitchell]

Boyar: problem is, some of these minor factions were a royal pain in the butt to their neighbors. It *hurts* when the Welsh or whoever comes in and kicks the snot out of some market town while carting off anything and anyone who isn't nailed down. The Cumans definitely fit in that category, just like the Scots you describe, and the Vlachs don't own any states outright, but can still be a serious problem if they don't like you.

Rebels, otoh, don't really do much in the way of expanding, and you can simply waltz around them to your heart's content on the strategic map. In the game, you can wander through Cuman territory to your heart's content. IRL you took your life in your hands any time you crossed their part of the map without local friendship.

Now, how that circle gets squared? Beyond me: at this point, unless I have a couple projects fall through, I'm strictly an end user.

[Dexter]

I agree that Eastern-Eu is not properly represented in most games, as there regions are not historically accurate, presented poorly, and whiteout there natural recourses, but perhaps before you request a romanian faction you should read a bit of history, as romanian was not used in the medieval period, there were wlachs, and later (much later) moldavians - by the way they loved each other like cat and mouse, but one could newer tell witch is the mouse-.
I can understand that eweryone would like there nation to be included, but hey just because today the map of europe looks the way it looks, it does not mean it always looked the same. See history of europe before WW1 and WW2.
Just a pointer here: the wictors always writhe there history to there liking, not the other way around. My history theacher thought me to be realistic, as it is easy to write history from a perspective - an extreme example: the Third Reich can be presented as a good, self defending state -.
Even the term nation did not unite the people, as you can see the history of France, Germany, etc. By the way Germany was not a single sate until the XVIII-XIX - i have no problem whit Germany i`m referring here only because today Germany is a major member of the EU, yet they dont change there history to fit there goals -.
Sorry to say bet king Stephan the 1 - who was proclaimed a saint - did proclaim, an ruled ower an european roman-christian Hungary that was even recognized by the pope in 1001.
And it seems you are forgetting the point of this game is ... go back in time, take control of an army and change history ... not replay history.

[Speiz_Bankurt]

It would be a mistake to include Transilvania as an independent or a Romanian facton. The province of Transilvania has been ethnically and culturally Hungarian (or Magyar if you will) throughout the entire medieval period. When it was independant for a while, it was only because the rest of Hungary was lost to the Turks and the Habsburgs.

Otherwise, including Wallachia as a faction may not be a bad idea, I mean they were there and they did fight off the advancing Turks on many occasions.... but of course this is up to the developers of the mod who have to look at game balancing issues etc.

Also another note; Romanian historians like to hijack Hungarian historical personalities by changing their names and pretending they were Romaninans. Especially if they accomplished something noteworthy. If this mod is intended to be a total realism mod, it would be a good idea to ignore the Romanian version of history of that region as a reference.

Cheers

[Cronos Impera]

Iancu de Hunedoara was a Catholic Romanian for Zeus's sake.
His father was Voicu Corbu, the descendant of Ion Corbu, a pretender to Litovoi's Kingdom. He was a Romanian baptised in the Roman-Catholic religion. Why must any Catholic in Medieval Erdely be a Hungarian beats me. Religion is different from ethnicity and Romanian historians knew that.

[Kavhan Isbul]

If this mod is intended to be a total realism mod, it would be a good idea to ignore the Romanian version of history of that region as a reference.

Cheers

Second that!

[edyzmedieval]

Second that!

Maybe perhaps the Romanian kings should have allied with the Ottomans and leave the Turks to concentrate on Western Europe.

Remember Nikopole? Remember the thrashing the Crusaders got?
Maybe perhaps you don't know the history. Mircea the Old said: "Let's wait and see what they will do."

But nooo, we are Crusaders! Men of God, we'll never get defeated!!!
You won't, because they were in Heaven from the first moment they engaged the Janissaries.

[Kavhan Isbul]

Maybe perhaps the Romanian kings should have allied with the Ottomans and leave the Turks to concentrate on Western Europe.

Remember Nikopole? Remember the thrashing the Crusaders got?
Maybe perhaps you don't know the history. Mircea the Old said: "Let's wait and see what they will do."

But nooo, we are Crusaders! Men of God, we'll never get defeated!!!
You won't, because they were in Heaven from the first moment they engaged the Janissaries.

Romanian kings, you mean from Alexandru to Mihai?

And trust me, I know my history, just disagree with mainstream Romanian historiographers, especially when it comes to their attempts to steal and misrepresent the medieval history of their nowadays neighbors.

Therefore, as far as this mod is concerned, I second Speiz_Bankurt's advice - Romanian interpretations of history are to be taken with a grain of salt, at best, especially when they come from angered teenagers, who start sentences with "maybe perhaps".

[edyzmedieval]

What's wrong with the fact that some dukes, like Janos Hunyadi (Iancu de Hunedoara) was born in Alba Iulia?

Romanian kings, from Basarab I to Mihai the Brave.

Angered, no. Annoyed, yes.
We couldn't make our imprint on history because we were always in the middle. We were forced to defend, and we rarely attacked. How could you possibly attack when you got Hungarians, Poles, Mongols, Byzantines, Ottomans and Kievans at your gates?

Ok, if we take it like this. Why should Bulgaria and Serbia be included? Hungary, ok, because they were important. But why Bulgaria and Serbia should?

[Incongruous]

Second that!

Third it!

At the start of this period the Vlach were, in all respects a minor semi-nomadic people. Whereas by the the end of the 11th century the Serbians had proved themselves to be the major Slavoc power. Not only that, but gameplay wise, the Serbian millirtary has some really interesting options. What with thier adoption and adaptation of Magyar, Latin and late Ottoman arms and armour.

[Mircea85]

Also another note; Romanian historians like to hijack Hungarian historical personalities by changing their names and pretending they were Romaninans. Especially if they accomplished something noteworthy. If this mod is intended to be a total realism mod, it would be a good idea to ignore the Romanian version of history of that region as a reference.

Good joke!!! Every nation likes to hijack the history of their country and their region (Hungarians included, Romanians too).

The province of Transilvania has been ethnically and culturally Hungarian (or Magyar if you will) throughout the entire medieval period.

Another good joke!!! Culturally yes (the social elite of Transilvanya was hungarian or more exactly catholic, because they were orthodox, the romanian nobles were excluded), but ethnically, NO, the bulk of Transylvania's population was and still is of romanian entichity. Because of their religion, romanian were excluded from nobility, and they were peasants. For more about this you should read the book Ardeal, a romainan land by the american writer Milton Lehrer and especially Gesta Hungarorum by Annonymus (a medieval hungarian official), chronicle of Simon of Keza, Descriptio Europæ Orientalis, Chronicon Pictum of Vienna, about monk Ricardus.

About a romanian faction in XI century: the first true romanian state, Wallachia gained the independence in 1330 (battle of Posada), the second, Moldavia, in 1359. Before those dates, the romanians north of Danube and Charpatians were organized in little duchies called cnezate or voievodate which payed tribute to the nomadic tribes(cumans, pechenegs, mongols) E.g. Gelu , Glad and Menumorut in Transylvania and Salunus in Pannonia (IX century), Litovoi, Ioan, Farcas, Seneslau in Wallachia (XIII century).
The area of today Romania should be populated by romanian rebels with armies made of archers and peasants. The largest town in romania should be Campulung, town founded by romanians and germans from Transylvania led by the semi legendary voievod Radu Negru or Negru Voda (XIII century)
A bulgarian doomination, north of the Danube was a formal one and not a real one. The romanians north of the Danube helped bulgarains led by Asan brothers (they were at least partialy of aromanian origin).

[Russ Mitchell]

Sorry, Mircea, but you're presenting a serious geographic distortion. Seneslau was a voivode in *Oltenia,* which, just like *Muntenia,* was trans-Carpathian... and had fark-all to do with Hungarian transylvania except in the middle of the 14th century, when certain Hungarian kings decided they wanted to extend their power to exercise more than nominal rulership over the region (and then got his butt kicked in a running mountain ambush).

Having gotten your history from the unfortunately not-dead-yet Ceaucescu-era "support-this-historiography-or-lose-your-job" narrative is one thing -- I can understand that, having had to engage in some serious de-programming regarding how I teach several episodes in U.S. History that are not at all what students have been taught to believe previously. But presenting minor Oltenian lords as if they somehow have *anything* to do with medieval Transylvania, on the other side of the Carpathians (let alone suggesting that the Vlachs were any sort of serious presence in 9th-century Pannonia), is simply dishonest.