Htw Spin-off Mod - Ancient: TW

[macsen rufus]

Hi Western, no objection, not now that the beta's actually up and available. I was just wary of saying too much beforehand, as you've no doubt seen how many threads there have been about "I'm doing a great mod..." then no release follows

Must say I'm still having fun with the Alisyans, I've played it through to the beginning of the "high" era (1200BC) and my mirmidons have just come on line. (So far the only unit that's era-dependent, but the epetes will dismount to mirmidons as well....)

I'm not sure I trust the Iberocelts - they're my allies but have about 15 stacks lined up around my most northwesterly outpost in Genoa. I think my tough Helladic types can thrash them, but even so it'll be a three-hour battle if they DO decide to invade. (BTW my other allies are the Assyrians ) I've just about crushed the Hittites, and was about to start on the Mycenaeans but they quickly threw a princess at my heir, so I'll hold off a while on them I still have my doubts about whether Alisya should be a "Greek" culture, but not sure what else they'd be at that stage of history. Admittedly in the game's Late era Cyprus was Greek, but 1275BC... hmmm...

What do you think of the economy so far? I suspect it's all still a bit too rich and am tempted to "turn down" the farms a bit more. (Nothing to do with those 15 stacks of Iberocelts on my border, honest.... )

[axel]

hi mate
I cant download them they are all about 5.6 kb and empty files
dont understand i trey to download other files just to check and it works, but your files i cant get
i am on ADSL mate

[western]

Macsen

I agree the economy may be a bit too easy. But I wouldn't want to lose the ability for the AI to build some really big armies, which is one of the things I like at present. Personally, I wonder about going the other way of increasing the cost of some buildings and both the purchase and running costs of some units. Carried over from HTW, many are really low. I think there ought to be a pretty stiff premium to pay for quality troops and economic development, so build decisions have to be thought about carefully (while less thoughtful AI barbarians can get on with spawning hordes). The premium is there now for chariots, but not so sure for other troops and buildings.

Incidentally, looking at support costs, I think the costs for maintaining ships (1:5 compared to purchase price) are the highest I have seen on any Mod. I agree ships should have high support and have always cranked up from the pitiful levels in vanilla. Does trade still pay even at these costs? I have to ask an Alisyan - an Assyrian doesn't know. https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/image.../gc-laugh4.gif

[macsen rufus]

@Axel - I'm mystified. How are you doing the download? Have you tried a right-click and "Save target as..." - that works okay for me, and a left-click just brings up a blank page and the "Open or save?" dialogue box. Any pop-up blocker installed? (Although I don't think that would be the problem, but you never know.....)

Have you tried the smaller files, or just the large, full install? I really can't see why it's not working for you

@ Western - the balance between the unit costs and the "productivity" of the map was one of the first things I spotted once this started to come together, as the HTW units are really cheap at present. But even in HTW I find the economy always takes off and I can train and build in every province, permanently. So I think it may well come down to increasing the cost of things.

As for the ships, I have not edited them at all, so standard HTW stats apply. I will eventually reduce the number of ship-types available (and spread them through the eras) as there are some major anachronisms! For the beta I just needed something that would work As to your question, yes, trade does pay, especially when you have copper as a trade item (as it should be, of course... ) I finally decided to take on the Iberocelts (that 15 stacks has become 30 .....) so took out most of their navy, in the hopes of a civil war. My trade plummeted from a 6k surplus to 3k deficit as they had been my main customers, and I had ships in every sea region with a port.

[dimitrios the samian]

Yihaaa .... almost 50% and ready to resume .....

[axel]

Hi mate
I am downloading now at this moment, it work now dont know why he did nt the first cople of times but now he works thx mate
ill play it this weekend

[macsen rufus]

That's good news, Axel! Glad you can get it now. The only thought I have is maybe we'd used up all the bandwidth for the day (1Gb per day = 4 full downloads).

AND DTS - sorry, I've just looked at my email, and seen your mail! There's a reply on its way, wasn't ignoring it, I just don't check email as often as I come to the org ...

And I notice I've had three "bandwidth limit" notifications from mydatabus.com as well.....

[Iron Lord]

Hey everyone . I just registered for the forums (although i have been playing MTW since it came out) after at least a year or two of enjoying this site. I've been keeping up with your work on this mod for a little while now and I was wondering if you needed anyone else to help you with this project. I am a pretty decent modder, except for creating a new campaign map and completely new units (i.e desinging the unit icons and animations and such) which i am trying to learn now. I am working on a mod of my own, which i plan to release info on soon. I was wondering in addition (if it is not to much of a bother), if i may use perhaps your animations and such from your basic tribal warriors.
Oh and i downloaded your beta. It's addicting . I spent most of this weekend playing instead of modding hehe.

[dimitrios the samian]

Welcome Iron Lord ,, Good to see another excited player enjoying the Bronze Age Mod by Macsen ,, Im also looking forward to sampling it very very soon ,, Tell us a little more about your Mod ? cheers for now ,, DTS

[axel]

Hi and welcome Iron Lord
Its alway s great to see more modders, myself i cant mod and dont have much time to mod becose of my work but if i hade more time i would learn. there are more modders who are asking for help like the new Rome mod see : https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showthread.php?t=79240 i hope this mod will be made as well, Marcus made a wonderfull mod And yes tell us more of your mod please

[axel]

Hi macsen rufus
I have to say i am sorry, Iam keep calling you marcus, a bit stupid from me i ment to say macsen the reason is becose i got a friend who cals himself marcus on line with somme game cald Rune so sorry mate i am really a

[barocca]

just downloaded a copy for a look see :-)

are you going to mention this beta release in the Main Hall?
you should

cheers,
B.

[dimitrios the samian]

Hello Barocca ,, Good to see you at this end of the forum ,, I really do hope you enjoy the game .... Q ,, Would it be possible for you to enlighten me on how you made those really nice campmap peices for Samurai ? ,, I have the necessary time patience & appetite to learn so I can help Macsen with expanding & refining this mod and also fire up some interest and get the Rome mod actively moving along ,, I have checked the Repository & Lab without finding anything ...see my post their ,, cheers ,, DTS

[barocca]

this thread? in the Alchemist Lab

B.

[macsen rufus]

Hi everyone - good to see the Bronze Age community is snowballing! Welcome to Iron Lord and Barocca (one day I'll get back to to my Samurai campaign )

@Iron Lord - the animations are mostly those from HTW, the only changes I've done really is swap a few shields around (ie for the tribal spears etc)

@Axel - Marcus, Macsen, all a bit confusing, no worries! Just don't abbreviate it to Mac, the short form is Macs (because 'cs' is a double letter - there's no 'x' in Welsh )

Don't have long now, maybe back at lunchtime, just thought I'd let you know I've started on the "high" era and introduced a Sea Peoples faction. It's fine to play, but when they're AI controlled, they are seriously inert. Just sit there losing money and influence, and not rampaging through the Aegean and Levant like they should ('barbarian raider' personality my foot!) Might need to move them into the FN_07 slot (Vikings in VI) and see if that makes any difference.

Will also be adding Cimmerians and Prytani to fill up some gaps currently rebel.

[axel]

Hi mate
your ancient mod is wonderfull mate i cant waith till its all finished,
is there any thing else i cane do to help mate?? i am playing the Mycenaears at the moment i will report if i find any thing like bugs or stuff

[macsen rufus]

Hi Axel, glad you're enjoying it. For the time being, a bit of concentrated playing is what's required, and let me know any problems / ideas / suggestions. Especially if you try a few campaigns, keep a track of what the AI factions do. If you find that any faction always takes over, we may need to rebalance things a bit. Also try a few different factions and see how they play - are you struggling for money, is it too easy, does the tech tree seem okay etc.

And enjoy the Mycenaeans, of course, come the patch their 'homelands' will be reduced so that you won't be able to train the better troops types away from the Helladic world And don't forget you can dismount your epetes ...

Meanwhile I'm looking at the "high" era, and will be able to put a patch together for that later.

[axel]

hi mate
ill play a fue campains with different factions and will of course enjoy this lol ill let you know

[axel]

Hi mate
just a question are there no emissary i cant see them mate but other factions are asking for aliens and my second question is are when cane you make horse (cavalerie) i like your mod mate its really good no problems so far

[Iron Lord]

Hey Mascen, I have a few question on how you did a few things for you mod for Horde:Total War if you don't mind as i am having a few frustrating problems. My first question is i can't seem to find where you edit the name of a religion e.g. for when you look at there shield and it says the faction and religion. I've tried changing the name of the religion in the names section but that doesn't work. Do you know how to do that?
I addition, i found this for if you wanted to changed the name of the religion when you look at the religion percentages. Go to TOOLTIP in LOC/ENG and search for religion until you get to where it says for example:
@{"Percentage of the population following the Pagan religion. This value can be influenced by buildings, events, invasions and the actions of agents in this region."}
This can be changed to whatever you want it to be. I can't recall exactly but i didn't think you edited this yet.

My other question is that I am having a problem with a UNKNOWN_unit_type problem when i am trying to add in a few new units. Now i know how to fully add new units and graphics and such. From everything I have read in the forums as farback as i can go, this is usually caused by a additional tab or something like that. Even when i go back and remake the unit in the Gnome from scratch i still get this error. So i end up spending way to much time trying to add even just one unit. So my question is how did you avoid this kind of problem/do you know what i am doing wrong/any tips on making new units?

I know i am asking alot of question, but if you can help me in any way that would be awesome.

[macsen rufus]

Quick update: new shields for the Hittites (as seen on the swordsmen only so far):




Don't have long right now, but @Axel: in early era horses were really only used for pulling chariots the only cavalry available is the Amazigh Horsemen (Libyans only) and the Cimmerian Cavalry (steppe provinces only) There will be more available in the LATE period when the Assyrians learn how to ride & shoot properly.

Emissaries come from the Law Court for "civilised" factions (I think that includes the Greeks). For the Pagans, the "Shaman" acts as emissary (Pagan Sacrificial Shrine).

@Iron Lord, I'll be back at lunchtime

[cegorach]

It is a matter of careful copying/pasting where Gnome has little to add.

Basically if you have copied just one tab more/less than you should you will get this problem.

Another thing is the waste left by Gnome in the ending lines of crusader file - if you add massive amounts of data you will notice that sometimes even dozens of units can appear twice, but as not legitimate entries.
These will be seen as data 'without connection' appearing after the last real unit.
The only solution is to eraze such data by simple deletion, though with some care I must add.



There is one very good solution when adding new units to the game - copy the data and paste it , though not at the end after the last unit, but rather somewhere before it, all you need to copy the whole space between the unit before and the one after - including all spaces/tabs etc and place it in the same way somewhere lower.


BY all the data I mean this:

AlgerianNaval	INFANTRY	250	6	1	0	80	80	1	DISCOURAGED	"MUS_REBELS(-10), MUS_LOYALISTS(2), MUS_PEASANTS(2), MUS_BANDITS(-20)"	FN_TURKISH			"POVERTY_STRICKEN(5), DESPERATE_DEFENCE(70), CATHOLIC_EXPANSIONIST(70), CATHOLIC_NAVAL_EXPANSIONIST(70), CATHOLIC_TRADER(70), CATHOLIC_CRUSADER_TRADER(70), CATHOLIC_EXPANSIONIST_CRUSADER(70), CATHOLIC_DEFENSIVE_CRUSADER(70), POPE(70), CATHOLIC_DEFENSIVE(70), CATHOLIC_ISOLATIONIST(70), ORTHODOX_DEFENSIVE(70), ORTHODOX_EXPANSIONIST(70), ORTHODOX_STAGNANT(70), MUSLIM_PEACEFUL(70), MUSLIM_EXPANSIONIST(70), MUSLIM_DEVOUT(70), BARBARIAN_RAIDER(18), REBELS(70), CLOSE_TO_SUPPORT_LIMIT(33.5)"		"{GUNSMITH2,SWORDSMITH}"	"ATTACKER,ANTI_SPEAR,STRONG"		ALL_PERIODS	NO	"HEIGHT( 85 ), RADIUS( 25 ), SCALE( 120 ), PROJECTILE_TYPE( SBOW ), SAMURAI( NO ), MARCH_SPEED( 7 ), RUN_SPEED( 11 ), CHARGE_SPEED( 12 ), MIN_TURNSPEED( 2 ), MAX_TURNSPEED( 8 ), TURN_TO_MOTION_SPEED( 8 ), MAX_INMOTION_TURN( 96 ), FORMATION_WIDTH_SPACING( 75 ), FORMATION_LENGTH_SPACING( 75 ), ENGAGEMENT_THRESHOLD( 1500 ), CHARGE_BONUS( 4 ), MELEE_BONUS( 3 ), DEFENCE_BONUS( -1 ), ARMOUR_LEVEL( 1 ), HONOUR_LEVEL( 4 ), AMMO( 5 ), FORMATIONS_PREFERRED_NUM_ROWS( 3 )"	NO		"own_unit_tooltip1, own_unit_tooltip2, other_unit_tooltip1,  other_unit_tooltip2"		"PESTUCAV, YES, YES"		"FN_TURKISH, FN_PERSIAN, FN_MAROCCAN"	"ID_TUNISIA,ID_ALGERIA"	"Missile, Shocktroop, Spear, Cavalry"	"SKIRMISH(1), ADVANCE_PARTY(1),
OUTFLANKING_FORCE(0), MAIN_BODY(2), HOLD_TERRAIN(0), RESERVE(0), REINFORCEMENT(1), ASSAULT(0), ASSAULT_COVER(2), ASSAULT_COVER_CASTLE_ATTACK(0), COVER(2)"			0		UNFORMED	SMALL	NO	1	NO	0	0				MuslimFeudalLevy	yes	SWORD	YES	"HIGH,LATE"	"FN_TURKISH":book: 
TufekchiMusketeers	INFANTRY	300	5	1	0	80	120	1	DISCOURAGED	"MUS_REBELS(-1), MUS_LOYALISTS(1), MUS_PEASANTS(-5), MUS_BANDITS(-10)"		ID_EDESSA		"POVERTY_STRICKEN(31), DESPERATE_DEFENCE(130), CATHOLIC_EXPANSIONIST(170), CATHOLIC_NAVAL_EXPANSIONIST(170), CATHOLIC_TRADER(170), CATHOLIC_CRUSADER_TRADER(170), CATHOLIC_EXPANSIONIST_CRUSADER(170), CATHOLIC_DEFENSIVE_CRUSADER(170), POPE(170), CATHOLIC_DEFENSIVE(170), CATHOLIC_ISOLATIONIST(170), ORTHODOX_DEFENSIVE(170), ORTHODOX_EXPANSIONIST(130), ORTHODOX_STAGNANT(130), MUSLIM_PEACEFUL(130), MUSLIM_EXPANSIONIST(130), MUSLIM_DEVOUT(130), BARBARIAN_RAIDER(24), REBELS(130), CLOSE_TO_SUPPORT_LIMIT(112.5)"		"{GUNSMITH2,SWORDSMITH}"	"MISSILE, ANTI_SPEAR, STRONG"		"HIGH,LATE"	NO	"HEIGHT( 85 ), RADIUS( 25 ), SCALE( 120 ), PROJECTILE_TYPE(  XBOW ), SAMURAI( NO ), MARCH_SPEED( 6 ), RUN_SPEED( 11 ), CHARGE_SPEED( 12 ), MIN_TURNSPEED( 2 ), MAX_TURNSPEED( 8 ), TURN_TO_MOTION_SPEED( 8 ), MAX_INMOTION_TURN( 96 ), FORMATION_WIDTH_SPACING( 75 ), FORMATION_LENGTH_SPACING( 75 ), ENGAGEMENT_THRESHOLD( 1500 ), CHARGE_BONUS( 4 ), MELEE_BONUS( 2 ), DEFENCE_BONUS( -2 ), ARMOUR_LEVEL( 1 ), HONOUR_LEVEL( 2 ), AMMO( 5 ), FORMATIONS_PREFERRED_NUM_ROWS( 5 )"	NO		"own_unit_tooltip1, own_unit_tooltip2, other_unit_tooltip1,  other_unit_tooltip2"		"MAILHCAV, YES, YES"		FN_TURKISH	"ID_BULGARIA,ID_HUNGARY,ID_CROATIA,ID_SERBIA,ID_GREECE,ID_CONSTANTINOPLE,ID_CRETE,ID_RHODES,ID_GEORGIA,ID_ARMENIA,ID_RUM,ID_LESSER_ARMENIA,ID_EDESSA,ID_TREBIZOND,ID_NICAEA,ID_ANATOLIA,ID_CYPRUS,ID_ANTIOCH,ID_SYRIA,ID_TRIPOLI,ID_JERUSALEM"	"Missile, Shocktroop, Spear, Cavalry"	"SKIRMISH(1), ADVANCE_PARTY(1),
OUTFLANKING_FORCE(0), MAIN_BODY(2), HOLD_TERRAIN(0), RESERVE(0), REINFORCEMENT(1), ASSAULT(0), ASSAULT_COVER(2), ASSAULT_COVER_CASTLE_ATTACK(0), COVER(2)"			0	UNCONTROLLED	UNFORMED	NONE	YES	1	NO	0	0				Minerteam		SWORD	NO	LATE	FN_TURKISH
:book: TufekchiYenicheri	INFANTRY	450	11	2	0	80	100	1	OK	"MUS_REBELS(-1), MUS_LOYALISTS(-5), MUS_ZEALOTS(-15)"				"POVERTY_STRICKEN(24), DESPERATE_DEFENCE(110), CATHOLIC_EXPANSIONIST(130), CATHOLIC_NAVAL_EXPANSIONIST(130), CATHOLIC_TRADER(130), CATHOLIC_CRUSADER_TRADER(130), CATHOLIC_EXPANSIONIST_CRUSADER(130), CATHOLIC_DEFENSIVE_CRUSADER(130), POPE(130), CATHOLIC_DEFENSIVE(130), CATHOLIC_ISOLATIONIST(130), ORTHODOX_DEFENSIVE(130), ORTHODOX_EXPANSIONIST(130), ORTHODOX_STAGNANT(130), MUSLIM_PEACEFUL(130), MUSLIM_EXPANSIONIST(130), MUSLIM_DEVOUT(130), BARBARIAN_RAIDER(21), REBELS(130), CLOSE_TO_SUPPORT_LIMIT(30.5)"		"{GUNSMITH3,SWORDSMITH2,MILITARY_ACADEMY}"	"MISSILE, ANTI_SPEAR, STRONG"	2	ALL_PERIODS	NO	"HEIGHT( 85 ), RADIUS( 25 ), SCALE( 120 ), PROJECTILE_TYPE(  SBOW ), SAMURAI( YES ), MARCH_SPEED( 8 ), RUN_SPEED( 11 ), CHARGE_SPEED( 13 ), MIN_TURNSPEED( 2 ), MAX_TURNSPEED( 8 ), TURN_TO_MOTION_SPEED( 8 ), MAX_INMOTION_TURN( 96 ), FORMATION_WIDTH_SPACING( 60 ), FORMATION_LENGTH_SPACING( 60 ), ENGAGEMENT_THRESHOLD( 1500 ), CHARGE_BONUS( 7 ), MELEE_BONUS( 3 ), DEFENCE_BONUS( 4 ), ARMOUR_LEVEL( 1 ), HONOUR_LEVEL( 7 ), AMMO( 5 ), FORMATIONS_PREFERRED_NUM_ROWS( 3 )"	NO		"own_unit_tooltip1, own_unit_tooltip2, other_unit_tooltip1,  other_unit_tooltip2"		"PESTUCAV, YES, YES"		FN_TURKISH	"ID_BULGARIA,ID_HUNGARY,ID_CROATIA,ID_SERBIA,ID_GREECE,ID_CONSTANTINOPLE,ID_RHODES,ID_ARMENIA,ID_RUM,ID_LESSER_ARMENIA,ID_EDESSA,ID_TREBIZOND,ID_NICAEA,ID_ANATOLIA,ID_CYPRUS,ID_ANTIOCH,ID_SYRIA,ID_TRIPOLI,ID_JERUSALEM"	"Missile, Shocktroop, Spear, Cavalry"	"SKIRMISH(1), ADVANCE_PARTY(1),
OUTFLANKING_FORCE(0), MAIN_BODY(2), HOLD_TERRAIN(0), RESERVE(0), REINFORCEMENT(1), ASSAULT(0), ASSAULT_COVER(2), ASSAULT_COVER_CASTLE_ATTACK(0), COVER(2)"			0	DISCIPLINED	PERFECTLY_FORMED	NONE	YES	1	NO	0	-3			ISLAMIC(1)	Minerteam		SWORD		ALL_PERIODS	FN_TURKISH

From one 'book' to another.

From my experience it remains the best possible approach - this way it is possible to add dozens of units in no time without a need to test the resuts too often - once per a dozen is enough..



@Macsen rufus

I have read a little about assyrian horsemen from 900 B.C. and earlier times - early empire. They rode in pairs - one was steering both horses another one was only for shooting and fighting.

Apparently one was armed with a spear and shield (the 'driver') and the second was a kind of mobile archer - calling him horse archer would be too much.

It often diesmounted before a battle when requested.

Another thing - they apparently rode one horses' bottoms - proper saddles were not yet invented.

My question is are you gong to try to add the feature ?

I know it is possible - since HTW uses full horse-and-rider animations you can combine two different models in one cavalry unit by setting one as a mount and moving it is the coordinates so they are side by side now.

The flaws are that
- this way you have a number of teams instead of people so you might want to rise their stats a little (and give them proper anti-missile protection - a large shield or a pavise would be sufficient) - one death mean two models less.
- the animation used as 'mount' cannot have any attached weapons at all - so the right place for the mobile archer in the team.
- the weapons' coordinates for the spear armed model might need correction - the new model coordinates might impose it.


Might be hard, but probably you will have something noone else uses - and it will be absolutelly historically accurate.
If you don't know where to start check my Izci Tatarlar in PMTW - the cavalry with two mounts.


Regards Cegorach

[macsen rufus]

@ Cegorach -- I have seen the info about the Assyrian "mobile archers" and was just going to pretend they were like ordinary horse archers But, you are right, to be really accurate there should be the two horses side by side...

I don't recall seeing the Iczi tartarlar with two mounts - is this in PMTW v1.5? That's the latest I have, so I might be getting behind, or I might just be unobservant Anyway, I was considering having a look at some of the things you'd done in there for ideas... The main problem is I'm not really set up for doing a lot with animations, it's okay to swap a few shields and weapons, but any 3D modelling or anything requiring artistic ability is beyond my boundaries.

The other thought I had was maybe using a chariot pair as mounts.

@ Iron Lord - yes, the method Cegorach outlined above is pretty much what I do - open the prod_file in notepad, copy a unit that's a bit like the one you want to make, and paste it in between existing units (I usually put them in just before the beginning of the ships so they're easy to find). Then save the file, and reopen in Gnome, and edit the stats from there. Once it's saved with Gnome, I REOPEN it AGAIN with Notepad, to make sure there are no extra bits of Gnome-junk on the end. If there are, delete this and resave, then try it out!

I also tend to do things by stages - ie make a copy of a unit, change its name, but not the animations or stats, train it, run it through a battle etc to check all the names and info pics are all okay. Then I'll change the animations and so on. Bit by bit, so when errors crop up they're easier to find. One thought that springs up on your "Unknown unit" problem -- this can arise from entries in the DISMOUNT or FEARED UNITS column. I had that a few times, copying things from one unit_prod to another - many HTW units I've recycled are afraid of elephants, and I don't have elephants in the mod, so the FEARED UNITS column was what caused the crash.

I haven't tried changing religions, I'm afraid, but I believe the basics are hardcoded and you can only change the text descriptions and the icons. That's something I've put to one side as a "finishing touches" project.

The wierdest problem I've seen is that one certain unit always causes a CTD if I try to place it at the beginning of a campaign with the MakeUnit:: command. There are no other problems with it, it works in battle, is trainable, belongs to the right factions, culture, era and provinces and so on. But once I try to put them on the map in the startpos file, they always cause a CTD. Anyone else had a problem like this? I just cannot find anything that may be causing it, and it has cost me a few hours to track down after I updated my startpos. Really had me pulling my hair out, as it was so unexpected...

[barocca]

culture will do that,

now i am very rusty but IIRC
unit culture must match culture of faction it is assigned to (who owns the province)
and culture of province must match culture of province owner too....
cheers,
B.

[macsen rufus]

Hi Barocca -- thanks for that. I think the culture etc is all correct, as the unit is trainable from turn one, and it's an "all faction" unit, as well. In terms of culture/faction/location it's no different to other units that CAN be placed safely. But I will have a closer check

[axel]

Macsen thx mate

[macsen rufus]

Currently developing the "high era" ( "The Catastrophe"). As well as the Sea Peoples, I've also added in the Cimmerians and Prytani who will both go into the early era too. There will be more factions to follow, including Ugarit (decided to make it an independent state rather than part of the Hittite empire - it was historically wiped out in the Catastrophe, so the challenge will be to survive ), Ligurians, Philistines and Israelites (late era only). There are too few provinces to really do justice to the intricacies of Middle Eastern politics of the era.... Oh, and the Phoenicians of course, for the late era.

Here's the starting position for the High era (so far):

[western]

Hi Macsen

All sounds very tempting. I've been playing the beta quite a lot, with no issues or crashes. The imported stuff from HTW is good of course - top quality battle maps and graphics, but I also really like the feel you have achieved with new emblems, portraits, info-pics etc. It's a visual treat to play and I can't wait to see the new work.

[axel]

Hi mate
It looks really great and i am really enjoying this mod mate

[macsen rufus]

Thanks for the feedback, guys!

A little more progress last night - biggest change is that I've now put the Sea Peoples into the FN_07 slot (which is the "Viking" slot) which had been given to the Thracians at first. Having checked out a few moves with the Thracians using the -ian facility I finally convinced myself that this slot is what caused the Thracians to rampage all over the place! They were able to get back on their ships without ports (just like the Vikings) and they always seemed to have too much cash (raiding bonus!) SO the proper place for all this is with the Sea Peoples! Eveything seems to have switched over okay, but I doubt I've tested it all thoroughly yet. It was about the last thing I did before falling asleep last night, so I've not had time to see how the AI handles them, but I expect they won't be as inert as they were at first .

The bad news is that the next patch will not be save-game safe, and you'll have to start your campaigns all over from scratch

The unit roster for the Cimmerians has had a bit of work now, as well:

* Cimmerian cavalry - BG unit
* Tribal warriors
* Slingers
* Tribal archers
* Cimmerian spearmen
* Cimmerian archers (compound bows + axes)
* Cimmerian warband (axes)

They have no sword unit or javelins, and the Cimmerian unique units are "homelanded" to the steppes (the infantry homeland is slightly larger than the cav homeland, as well). Although all factions can train CimCav in the appropriate provinces, the Cimmerian faction has a cost advantage on these, even so they are still expensive and high-tech (two level 3 facilities required) as we're talking about the very first stirrings of equestrianism here

Prepare to defend your northern borders, Western

I've also redone a few of the review panel unit icons, so there won't be quite so many identical-looking spearmen etc. I've now got a good selection of graphics software so should be ready to do the battle unit icons as well, where it really matters (having the same icon for skirmishers and heavy infantry can lead to some serious tactical blunders )