Faction List for EB2?

[Bootsiuv]

I understand what you're saying, but I have to disagree.

I think having a faction like Syracuse (Has that ever been a playable faction in ANY mod for RTW?) would be somewhat exotic, and fail to see why Syrakousai would be so utterly defeated so quickly.

Historically, Syrakousai held out for quite some time against Carthaginian advances, although I'm not 100% on Syracusean history, I know they were a big pain in the ass for them.

Qarthadastim starts out relatively weak in Sicilia, and I fail to see why Syrakousai wouldn't have just as good of a chance of pushing them off of the island, especially if they start out with a decent field army.

[Bellum]

I know it's really not viable, but I'd like to see a faction in Ireland. What I know of the anchient Irish is so interesting, but then I don't think they invaded other people, or had much of an army - at least not one that could compete with certain other factions.

Anyway, if you could make an Irish faction, I think the whole island would be one faction. There were different tribes, but from what I've read, it seems like Ireland was pretty unified until whatever happened in the north.

[Tellos Athenaios]

I really didn't know Syrakousai had been dismissed? Where did that happen?

[Bootsiuv]

Someone said it in here, I assumed he was part of the team. I didn't pay much attention, but he seemed to know what he was talking about. If they haven't been dismissed, awesome. Please include them....they would probably end up being one of my favorite factions.

[Treshka]

Numidian and Syracuse are the ones I would like to see included and I dont know you guys but I really think another roman faction would be great, missing the civil wars

[Sir Edward]

I really didn't know Syrakousai had been dismissed? Where did that happen?

Massilia is a pretty bad choice compared to many other factions in terms of military, influence and importance, so the EB team scrapped it.

I think this is the post. Maybe there was some confussion. I do hope Bosphorean Kingdom and Caucasian Iberia is added to make the Black Sea region a little more interesting.

[Tellos Athenaios]

Still, Massilia and Syrakousai are two completely different powers.

[Bootsiuv]

#148
Son of Perun
Junior Member
Junior Member


Join Date: Aug 2007
Posts: 17 Re: New factions?

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I guess these factions will not make it to EB2(though they are popular):
Numidians - not united enough, never had ambitons or oportuniti to build empire
Illirians - same as Numidians
Syracuse - between carthagian anvil and roman hammer
northern Germanic faction - no place to expand
Cyrene - too weak to be real danger to either Ptolemies or Carthage
Galatians - powerful mercenaries but otherwise band of robbers
Meroe - (my beloved ) only 2 possible units (who said this!?)
Persians - there was no real opposition to Seleucids in 272 BC
Yuezhi - arrived about 50 years after the game starts

This was the post. It was in the other faction thread right under this one. I didn't pay much attention to the poster, and I have all sigs turned off to speed things up because I have dial-up on this computer, but I do have access to high-speed to dl stuff like EB :)

Anyways, everyone started talking like it was the truth, so I just assumed he was a member and knew what he was talking about. It's all good though, just give me Syrakousai, and I will crush the carthaginian scum.

[Bootsiuv]

BTW, I agree that Syrakousai and Massilia are two completely different powers.

If you include Massilia, then arguments could be made for any greek colony....How about Emporion as a faction? :P

[Puupertti Ruma]

BTW, I agree that Syrakousai and Massilia are two completely different powers.

If you include Massilia, then arguments could be made for any greek colony....How about Emporion as a faction? :P

Massilia is a pretty bad choice compared to many other factions in terms of military, influence and importance, so the EB team scrapped it.

Errm. Krusader is a member, so Massilia is quite definitely not going to be in EB II. Fortunately no member has said anything about Syracuse so we can still continue to speculate their inclusion.

:edit: Corrected the quote.

[moonburn]

BTW, I agree that Syrakousai and Massilia are two completely different powers.

If you include Massilia, then arguments could be made for any greek colony....How about Emporion as a faction? :P

emporion would be part othe massilia kingdom perhaps ...

anyway i don´t see why a western mediterranean greek kingdom would be so far fetched an alliance beteween massilia and syracuse to reconquer sardinia and corsica back from the poenii

since the 6th century bc greeks and poenii had a standing war wich was what allowed carthage to become the poenii superpower by being the defender of punic interests against the greek expansionists (peace treaties beteween massilia and carthage interests are well know the same for the wars beteween carthage and syracuse)

the 1st punic war happened to stop the poenii from cutting of the mediterrenean in two (conquering messina would mean there was no available passage beteween the western and eastern mediterranean unleass you bowed down to the poenii since the other passage was beteween lilibeo and carthage itself)

probably that can be the syracusean victory conditions to reconquer all the greek lands stolen by the poenii (the islands my friends the islands)

[Ludens]

Why on earth did you respond to a two-year old post? The discussion has moved on since then in other threads.

[Gray_Lensman]

Why on earth did you respond to a two-year old post? The discussion has moved on since then in other threads.

Might I politely suggest that if the forum moderators do not like old threads being responded to that they consider "closing" them.

[Hax]

What's the point? It's like answering a question about two weeks after someone has asked it to you.

probably that can be the syracusean victory conditions to reconquer all the greek lands stolen by the poenii (the islands my friends the islands)

Refer to this thread.

[ThePianist]

MTW2 has 198 province limit VS RTW's 199. Which means one province gets axed.

And I don't think anyone on team would want thus to expand the map further east. Which also leads to the reason the Mauryans will probably NOT be included as their political centre was in eastern India and including only parts of that faction is a no.

The Yuezhi were dropped since at 272 BC they did not inhabit any areas on the EB map and it took over a century until they did.

Also a sad consideration is that while model limit in MTW2 seems to be limitless (RTW had 255 model slots) the unit limit on 500 is still in place, so any new factions should have a minimum of unique factional units.

This is most unfortunate.
Unless there are free unit slots available, there shouldn't be any new factions then, because it would take away units from existing factions.

Is there a way to mod the .exe so that more than 500 units can be memorized by the game?
This, after all, is a mod and no profit is made with it, only fun with history.

1. My first suggestion of a faction is the Gladiator uprising of Spartacus.
   The faction-specific infantry would be perhaps 5 different types of gladiators, maybe 7 ?
   You'd get more advanced units as gladiator schools are upgraded.
   Gladiator training would only take one round, but their combat statistics can be upgraded by retraining them in buildings.
   You'd also get to train existing Celtic units, Thraikian units and some Germanic units, since those races were the main components of gladiators.
   Other than that, units would come from mercenaries.
   
   Also, Spartacus and his generals would be able to persuade units to defect from the enemy army (either the entire army, or some units from the enemy army). I have no idea how this could be implemented, it can certainly be done with some programming. So the Spartacus and his generals would have a charisma level, and the opposing army would have a charisma level, and then some random flips of coin.
   
   The campaign would start in 73 BC, with Rome already expanded in Hispania in the West (Sertorius has a split-away kingdom in Iberia), and Pontos in the East (Rome at war with Mithridates). Spartacus' faction would start as a horde outside Capua. (is hording possible in M2TW?)
   
   Maybe this could be made into a separate provincial campaign, a specially-designed campaign (maybe even with a different map, more zoomed in?). That way, some far-away factions can be eliminated, so that the Spartacus faction would have more faction-specific units.
   
2. My other suggestion is, the Palmyrene Empire in 260 AD.
   
3. My third suggestion is, a second Germanic faction, or a second Iberian faction (see the mod "Iberia Total War" for detailed Iberian factions, there are 4 or 5).
   If so, then they need different campaign music, to show that they are from a different faction.
   
4. My 4th suggestion is the Numidians.
   
5. My 5th suggestion is, the Galatians. However, this doesn't have to be in the grand campaign. This could also be a separate, provincial campaign. Otherwise, there would be 3 Gallic factions, and it would occupy a precious faction slot. In a separate, provincial campaign, you could start as the Galatians in Galatia, and the Aedui and the Arverni can be combined into one "Gaul" faction (with an option of permanent alliance, so that if you wiped out all the other factions on the map, except that other Gaul faction, then your campaign is victorious, and you don't have to go to war against the last faction.)
   
6. My 6th suggestion is, Illyria. The faction should start with a fleet of pirate ships, carrying troops. That way, you can raid the coast of Italy, or other places. The faction should have rapid and cheap construction of ships.
   
7. My 7th suggestion is, a separate provincial campaign starting in a year when there were more than one faction ruling Roman territories, like Sertorius in Iberia in 73 BC, or "the year of 4 emperors" in 69 AD.

[The General]

Is there a way to mod the .exe

As far as I know, that would be illegal (hence some things are described as "hardcoded").

Also, EB [II] depicts the world as it was in 272BC and they have decided against (iirc) the use of emergent factions.

[Ludens]

Might I politely suggest that if the forum moderators do not like old threads being responded to that they consider "closing" them.

I prefer to keep old threads open so that people can present new information or perspectives on old discussions. That helps keep the information in one place. However, in this case there are two newer threads on the subject, so I want to know why moonburn posted here.

As far as I know, that would be illegal (hence some things are described as "hardcoded").

Also, EB [II] depicts the world as it was in 272BC and they have decided against (iirc) the use of emergent factions.

Correct on both counts, although, to be stricly correct, you cannot mod the .exe. Modding is changing the data files; changing the .exe falls under programming. Also, changing the .exe file is not in itself illegal, but distributing altered copies (or unaltered ones for that matter) is, as you are giving away free copies of SEGA's program.

[Caulaincourt]

Med2 allows 31 factions... Also i think it's enought to represent all the ancient powers of this time.
I'm right when I say Parthia will be included ?

[Ludens]

Med2 allows 31 factions... Also i think it's enought to represent all the ancient powers of this time.
I'm right when I say Parthia will be included ?

The Partians (Pahlavans) are already in EB1, and all EB1 factions will be included (although I think some may be given an overhaul). Keep in mind that one of those 31 factions is going to be the "rebel" faction.

[Brave Brave Sir Robin]

EB1 factions are thus:
1. Lusotann
2. Kart-Hadast
3. Romani
4. Aedui
5. Arverni
6. Casse
7. Sweboz
8. Getai
9. Epirotes
10. Koinon Hellenon
11. Makedonia
12. Ptolemaioi
13. Arche Seleukia
14. Pontos
15. Sauromatae
16. Saka
17. Pahlava
18. Baktria
19. Hayasdan
20. Saba

Next is Rebel Faction
21. Rebels

Next are two confirmed factions
22. Massaelyian (sp?) Numidians
23. Pergamon

That leaves 8 slots to fill

Some logical ones would be:
Boii
Belgae tribe, dont know which
Brigantes
Arevaci or another Celt-Iberian tribe
Syracuse
Chatti, Churusci, Marcomanni or some other Germanic tribe
Caucasian Iberia
Atropatene
Galatian tribe

Out of all those I would guess Brigantes probably the least likely to get in just because of limited knowledge of warfare and culture in the British Isles at the time. Which leaves...8! Im gonna guess at least 4 are right. :)

[Skullheadhq]

Atropatene'd be killed in 2 turns by either the Seleukids or the hay

[bobbin]

From my poll a while ago,

Arevaci - A celtiberian tribe
Érainn - A Goidelic (irish) tribe
Aquitanians/Vascones - Non Celtic speaking peoples of southwestern france and northeastern iberia, ancestors of the Basques.
Illegert - a heavily celticised iberian tribe from north eastern iberia (around emporion)
Nervii - A belgic tribe with germannic influences
Brigantes - Powerful british tribe residing in northern england.
Helvetii - Celtic tribe from the alps
Massalia - Greek city state in southern france (modern day marseille)
Ligures - A highly celticised italic people in north west italia
Syracuse - A greek city state in sicily
Boii - A Powerful celtic tribe in eastern central europe (modern day Bohemia)
Lugii - Germanic or slavic tribe in eastern central europe (modern day poland and germany)
Dalmatae - Illyrian tribe
Skordiskoi - Powerful celtic tribe in the balkans (modern day serbia and surrounding areas)
Rhaetians - Alpine tribe with either Celtic or Etruscan roots, or both
Tylis - Celtic kingdom ruling over majority thracian population in southeast balkans.
Bosporan Kingdom - Hellenic kingdom on the north coast of the black sea (modern day Crimea)
Galatia/Bythinia - Celtic kingdom in union with hellenic kingdom (modern day turkey)
Kappadoika - Persian sucessor kingdom, Rebelious satrap of the seleukids(eastern anatolia)
Kartli - Also know as Caucasian Iberia, main rival for the Hai, native Caucasus people, ancestors of modern day georgians.
Atropatene - Persian sucessor kingdom, eastern caucasuses (modern day Azerbaijan)
Nabateans - Semitic Arab Kingdom in the Sinai
Palmyrae - Arab kingdom in modern day syria
Massaesylians - Main rival of the Masaesyli and other major tribal power in numidia
Maures - African kingdom in modern day Mauritania. Ancestors of the Moors
Qataban - Southern arabian state in modern day yemen.
Hadrumaut - Another southern arabian state in modern day yemen.
Massagetae - powerful nomadic tribe in central asia, lie north of the Pahlava.
Kamboja's - Iranian people in northwestern india/hindu kush

One of the team members (Moros) said that five of these are factions in EBII, I've also crossed off other factions that were discounted in other threads.

If i was to hazard a guess the five from here would be: Arevaci, Boii, Bosporan Kingdom, Kartli and Nabataeans.

[WarpGhost]

My hopes would be Boii and Lugii, because some activity is badly needed east of Sweboz. Illegert would add some action between Gaul and Lusota/Carthage, whilst fusing Gallic and Iberian troops without requiring much unique. Bosphoron Kingdom would also add some interest to the north of the Black Sea. I'd prefer something more south-east in the Selucid region, but of all the choices there Atropatene sounds the most promising in that region.
I really dont like the look of any of the others; they're generally adding nothing to already crowded areas. The addition of Pergamon doesnt fill me with confidence on this point unfortunately; nations should only be added if they fill a genuinly useful game niche, not simply because they historically existed.

[Phalanx300]

The Boii and Lugii seems very possible, would like a Batavian unit though, seeing how specific units are mostly given to units who did or had something special they may be more worthy then a Chauci unit.

[bobbin]

I really dont like the look of any of the others; they're generally adding nothing to already crowded areas.

Yeah thats why Galatia or Kappadoika aren't very likely in my eyes as Anatolia is crowded enough as it is (5 factions, 6 if you count KH as well) Mind you the criteria for becoming a faction involves things such as expansionistic tendencies, good historical information etc which means we're unlikely to see factions in some of the more empty parts of the map (like the baltic region).

[lobf]

I know I talk about this all the time and I've brought it up before, but what is the reason for keeping the Casse? I really don't remember.

As far as I understand (and I may be wrong, feel free to correct me) but not only were the Isles not unified politically, but they didn't do much of anything off of their island.

If you have a Casse faction, the first thing the player will do is unify the island, probably conquer Ireland. Then we're left with essentially a colonial-era Great Britain, earning piles of dough, and sending military excursions over the channel to conquer Europe. Doesn't that seem weird/wrong to anyone else?

I don't understand how you can consider any political institution in Britain at the time significant enough to warrant a faction. Anyone want to clear this up for me? (again...?)

[Brave Brave Sir Robin]

Atropatene'd be killed in 2 turns by either the Seleukids or the hay

You could argue the same thing for Hay or Baktria. Both stuck between Seleucids and another faction. (Sauromatae and Saka respectively)

I suppose Atropatene would have less room to expand however.

Oops I forogot to mention Bosporans in my first post. Oh well, maybe scratching Atropatene wouldnt be such a bad idea.

In terms of keeping the Casse, it ensures that Britain is not a joke to take as the Sweboz or Gallic factions. Historically, you are correct, no tribe united the isle before the Romans arrived. However its addition imo is merited both to make the isle harder to take and also because British tribes did lend money and possibly troops to help their Gallic and Belgic allies during Caesars wars in Gaul.

Also, remember the game is about presenting the situation at 272 and letting everything go from there. What did or didn't happen makes no difference.

[ziegenpeter]

In terms of keeping the Casse, it ensures that Britain is not a joke to take as the Sweboz or Gallic factions. Historically, you are correct, no tribe united the isle before the Romans arrived. However its addition imo is merited both to make the isle harder to take and also because British tribes did lend money and possibly troops to help their Gallic and Belgic allies during Caesars wars in Gaul.

Well then cut britain out? Leaves more provinces for the rest.
And

Also, remember the game is about presenting the situation at 272 and letting everything go from there. What did or didn't happen makes no difference.

is not entirely true. The importance of a faction after 272 does influence the consideration wether a faction is included or not.

[Skullheadhq]

Well then cut britain out? Leaves more provinces for the rest.
And
is not entirely true. The importance of a faction after 272 does influence the consideration wether a faction is included or not.

Well, Epeiros was largely gone after 272BC....

[bobbin]

Eh? The Aiakid line lasted until 231bc, then the Eproite League until 167bc thats hardly "largely gone"