An independent Sweboz overview

[ElectricEel]

Okay, I've tested the club warriors vs. germanic spears matchup in custom battles, and the spears have a very clear advantage. The spears suffer 20%-50% casualties, depending on the timing of the javelin volleys, and rout the clubs after inflicting 85%-90% casualties. This invalidates the "spears get a penalty against infantry, so the matchup is not as unfair as it seems" theory.

[Watchman]

The "spear" bonuses/penalties only apply if the unit has been given the appropriate weapon attribute in the EDU. In EB no spear unit that uses only spears for melee has been given it (instead they get verying degrees of anti-cavalry bonuses in the "mount_effect" line); units with the phalanx formation need it for their primary weapon so the formation works, and some of the "double armed" spear/sword units (Celtic and maybe Sweboz heavies, some Hellenic guard units mainly) have it for their spears.

Far as I can tell the club dudes are intented as "cheap and cheerful" mass infantry for dealing with the heavily armoured troops many of the Sweboz' neighbours start getting later on, and as such don't have too much use against most Eleutheroi armies. Assorted axemen, nevermind those scary Wodanawulfaz, are a higher-quality version of the same theme.

The Ridonharjoz kinda suffer from the fact about everyone and their dog near the Sweboz starting regions has a spear and is thus pretty good against cavalry, and their overhand cavalry spears may still have some statting issues (there's still an across-the-board consistency problem with these in the EDU). However, they should do well enough on flank and rear charges and as router-chasers, and ought to be able to cream the Celtic Leuce Epos types in a straight fight due to their higher base combat skills (the latter are of the underhand cav spear type with very low base attack, high delay, high charge and AP - not a very good combination against high-skill low-armour enemies like the Sweboz obviously).

[ElectricEel]

Thanks for the clarification on the spear penalties.

Far as I can tell the club dudes are intented as "cheap and cheerful" mass infantry for dealing with the heavily armoured troops many of the Sweboz' neighbours start getting later on, and as such don't have too much use against most Eleutheroi armies.

I figured that was their role. Still, it probably would not hurt to reduce their cost, considering that as they are now, they are pretty much redundant in the early game, and do have significant weaknesses compared to other units later on when they become useful. Also, considering that they use poorer-quality equipment than other units that have the same level of availability, it would be logical (though they do have a lower upkeep cost already).

A few minor problems I've noticed about the Sweboz units:
-The shirtless (foreign-employed) varieties of germanic spears put their shirts back on when you zoom out enough that they switch to a sprite instead of a model.
-There's some inconsistency in which units can benefit from weapon upgrades, and which cannot. Levy spears have the 'light' weapon type, which means they can upgrade, but the javelin-chucking varieties of spearmen have the 'missile' weapon type, which is not upgraded by a blacksmith.

[LordCurlyton]

Maybe I'm the lone dissenter, but I think the clubmen are just fine. Mainly that is because they are FAST, in fact I think they may be faster than any other non-cav unit (at least any I've encountered, and I've encountered a lot). When I played as Sweboz I almost always kept 4-5 in a stack. Great for killing Romans, phalanxes, and pesky skirmishers (I ran down many with these guys). They are almost perfect flankers for the Germans due to their speed since your locking units will take far less casualties that way, as opposed to using a heavier, slower flanking infantry. Heck, if I could recruit them as the Romans I'd use them as a decent light infantry backup to my legions and send them to the East to deal with all those armored phalnxes.

[ElectricEel]

I didn't notice they were fast-moving.

Doesn't their description state that the romans used germanic clubmen as auxiliaries?

[LordCurlyton]

That it does, but as the Romans I have yet to find a province I can recruit them in and since they don't seem to pop up as mercs (Germany is rather sparse in the merc department) I guess I'm stuck churning out more Marian legionaires.

[Watchman]

I didn't notice they were fast-moving.

The Herthoz/Ferulharjoz/Gastiz armoured heavies, the Merjoz and the Bastarnoz-Swaiut are about the exact only Sweboz infantry who aren't. Light gear has its perks.

[ElectricEel]

How many different speeds of infantry units are there in EB?