Byzantine Empire Imperium Graecorum or Imperium Romanum??

[MiniMe]

Wasnt the Greeks taken over by the Romans and the western world adopted the Roman way (admitted also part greek, but Roman version) ?

Yes, they were taken over. However, the most prestigious colleges were in Athens and Alexandria.

Highly debatable.

Highly debatable, indeed =)
But:
There was no theoretical science in Rome. 10:0
Literature: greek win 10:2
Theater@drama: greek win 10:1
Historians: er, well, romans had one good historian. the funny thing is: he wasn't roman =)
Philosophy&religion_innovations: 10:1 (1 goes for stoicism)
Athletics&sport: Olympiad versus Circus Maximus. MiniMe votes for Olympiad, Greek win. Again.

Now the back side of the coin =)
1. Law system. 5:10 (lawyers are roman invention )

2. And finally, the one and only explanation of roman supremacy:

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

Military recruitment system. 10:200
Romans winwinwin

[Agiselaos]

I think that you all must consider that The Emperors thought themselves descendants of Constantine not Augustus.then after the Arab Conquest the territories the Empire Had was populated by Hellenes from ancient times.The used the term ''Roman'' only for political mean.we must not forget Plithon who said that We are Hellens Not Romans.As for Roman in east they were assimillated by the Greek population

[Morte66]

I think Byzantium may have been pretty Roman in 477CE, but 75 years later everybody who personally remembered Rome was dead and they just had scrolls. By about the 8th century it was medieval Greek with a lot of Romanesque institutions and the "continuous Roman empire" thing was a marketing slogan.

The most Roman thing about them was that they were an empire, but you could equally well call that "Persian".

Those who looking at things from a historical timescale tend to forget that lives are short and societies change. E.g. I'm British, our empire essentially ended about fifty years ago, and anybody who seriously hearkens back to "the glory of empire" is a loony. But a thousand years from now, historical wargamers will think we were just the same as the British of 1880 and probably build forces for the reconquest of our rightful territories in America.

[Will_YouFight_ForME]

My personal opinion is the death of the real Roman empire is when they got rid of the old gods in favor of Christianity but thats really a very generalized reaction.

I think they saw themselves as Roman before the collapse and split making the western and eastern empire because their was that dream that was Rome - the most glorious city in the known world

and everyone wanted to claim they were part of that

but i really don't have the qualifications or knowledge to justify this


i can ask but one question, what would have happened if Imperium Romanum did not collapse?

[keravnos]

If you had to leave your country to save your life, would it still be you in the other country you found refuge?

Then, imagine some generations later the descendants of your pursuers, coming from the country you left, and claiming to be your REAL descendants, killing your very own offspring.

That's Eastern Roman Empire-Byzantium in a nutshell, in my own personal opinion.

[abou]

Highly debatable, indeed =)
But:
There was no theoretical science in Rome. 10:0
Literature: greek win 10:2
Theater@drama: greek win 10:1
Historians: er, well, romans had one good historian. the funny thing is: he wasn't roman =)
Philosophy&religion_innovations: 10:1 (1 goes for stoicism)
Athletics&sport: Olympiad versus Circus Maximus. MiniMe votes for Olympiad, Greek win. Again.

Now the back side of the coin =)
1. Law system. 5:10 (lawyers are roman invention )

2. And finally, the one and only explanation of roman supremacy:

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

Military recruitment system. 10:200
Romans winwinwin

Obviously you completely ignored the spirit of my post. I suggest you go back and read it. Also, quoting arbitrary numbers doesn't help your argument and doesn't do anything to point out the differences in Roman culture compared to Greeks - ie. concern for the here & now compared to a concern for the metaphysical.

[alatar]

Obviously you completely ignored the spirit of my post. I suggest you go back and read it. Also, quoting arbitrary numbers doesn't help your argument and doesn't do anything to point out the differences in Roman culture compared to Greeks - ie. concern for the here & now compared to a concern for the metaphysical.

Abou has a point.

[Boyar Son]

But we both can agree that the Hellens (their true name) and Romans has possibly the most glorious history. Hands down in my opinion.

[Intranetusa]

But we both can agree that the Hellens (their true name) and Romans has possibly the most glorious history. Hands down in my opinion.

Yup, the Romans is the best in the western world/world while the Hellens is
2nd best in the "western world" only.

[hellenes]

Yup, the Romans is the best in the western world/world while the Hellens is
2nd best in the "western world" only.

Its strange how the Hellenes took the illeterate farmers of Latio and taught them practically everything that would even remotely be called civilised...
So strange how the Romans dissapeared as a culture/language/tradition under the heel of the germanic tribes whilst Hellenes continued...

[MarcusAureliusAntoninus]

Its strange how the Hellenes took the illeterate farmers of Latio and taught them practically everything that would even remotely be called civilised...
So strange how the Romans dissapeared as a culture/language/tradition under the heel of the germanic tribes whilst Hellenes continued...

Greeks didn't civilize the Italians. They were already civilized via the Etruscans. I don't think Greeks had any influence over Roman society until they started 'allying' with other cities, some of which being Greek colonies.

Also Roman civilization didn't disappear with the Germanic invasion. Remember that the 'barbarian invaders' didn't want to destroy Rome, they wanted to be part of Rome. All of western civilization could be said to be Roman. Systems of government, law, religion, and much of the morality of the west is mixture of Roman and Christian systems. France has always been a very Roman nation. And Latin didn't disappear, it just changed. Spanish, French, Romanian, and Italian are all bastardized versions of Latin. I would say that Spanish is about as close to Latin as modern Greek is to ancient Greek.

[antisocialmunky]

The Romans had more obscene graffiti. That has to count for something. :)

[abou]

Its strange how the Hellenes took the illeterate farmers of Latio and taught them practically everything that would even remotely be called civilised...
So strange how the Romans dissapeared as a culture/language/tradition under the heel of the germanic tribes whilst Hellenes continued...

To add to what Marcus wrote, the Hellenic culture didn't continue any more than any other culture. In fact, a governor of Athens wrote to the emperor in Constantinople complaining that no one in his city could read. Also, when Greece converted to Christianity they converted hard and either abandoned or altered their religious and cultural traditions to match. Therefore no more Elysian Mysteries, no more festivals to Dionysus.

And where do you think ancient Greece went? Lime-kilns of course, because when you burn marble it turns into lime for farming.