Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast
Results 1 to 30 of 50

Thread: Glorious Cities!!!

  1. #1

    Default Glorious Cities!!!

    Hello to everyone!
    I would like to suggest two things for MTR.

    1) Wouldnt it be more interesting if cities where not identical to each other? As i think it is impossible to make every one of them, why not make the most important cities in Medieval history? Wouldn't it be awesome if you could assault the triple walls of Constantinople (pic related), Jerusalem, the eternal city (Rome), or fight on both sides of the river Seine (Paris).....etc?
    I am just tired of besieging those bland cities that they have made for us!
    Anyone who has played the game "Imperial Glory" will remember how cool it was to fight in the others capital (it had Paris,Bradenburg,Moscow and London)!
    It would make those particular sieges so interesting, tactical and different! GLORIOUS! Besieging Constantinople for example (the city that didnt fall for a thousand years) would be something to behold and would not be just another bland siege on the battle map!
    And on the tactical side, i think that there should be some "spice" in those sieges, like for example capturing specific points of the city or outside of it that would help you defend or capture the city. If we search at the real sieges of those cities, we could find the right and realistic "spice" to add!

    Is it possible? I have no modding skills but i am so frustrated with sieges that i am willing to try it myself if someone can give me any directions.

    2) I think that Huge Cathedrals should be allowed only at capitals and have an effect on public order and religion on the whole kingdom.
    Also, and adding to the personalisation and awesomeness of the above cities, i think that it would be great to personalise the Huge Cathedrals of those cities on both the campaign map (name and image) and the battle map (building). Imagine St Peter's basilica in Rome, Hagia Sophia in Constantinople and Dome of the Rock in Jerusalem!

    I hope you read this post and respond. I might be asking too much, but i think that things like that would add so much to the game. You would really feel the medieval air and glory!!!

  2. #2

    Default Re: Glorious Cities!!!

    Having unique cities would really be great, I was disgusted by M2TW's depictions of Rome and Constantinople as small, square-walled little towns in the middle of a flat, green field. Not a domed roof or block of marble to be seen.......

    MARMOREAM•RELINQUO•QUAM•LATERICIAM•ACCEPI

  3. #3

    Default Re: Glorious Cities!!!

    Yeah! It should have been obvious to them that those cities should be modeled differently! And at the exact size the actually were! IT WOULD HAVE BEEN GLORIOUS!

  4. #4

    Default Re: Glorious Cities!!!

    It would be a complete nightmare to mod, I don' think you could make the cities uniue without basically redesigning in the game and while you could add in special buildings (St. Peters, Dome of the Rock) as one off you would have real problems with footprinting, for example St Peter's (to scale) is far larger than any of the buildings (including the Huge Cathedrals) in the vannilla game, lovely idea but very very difficult, and most people wouldn't notice/wouldn't care, that's probably why there aren't in the vannilla game.
    Aracnid

  5. #5

    Default Re: Glorious Cities!!!

    Basically the cities are that matter, not the cathedrals. Go here:
    http://homepage.mac.com/paulstephens...nople_map1.jpg
    Wouldnt it be awesome to besiege a city like that! Three rows of walls! THREE! No other city was that big and well fortified as Constantinople!

    As for the cathedrals.... Yeah they are relatively small in the vanilla. Even though they are called "huge" in the game they are tiny compared to the real cathedrals in real world!
    The modded ones would have to be modeled from scratch and added to the modded cities so as to fit. I tihnk that people care. Thats why we play this game and not another with orks and stuff. We want realism and accuracy. But its not just for that! Its about the feel of the thing! Those cities look sterile and bland! They are lame! If i besiege the damn Rome, i wanna feel like it!

  6. #6

    Default Re: Glorious Cities!!!

    Quote Originally Posted by Sandouras
    I tihnk that people care. Thats why we play this game and not another with orks and stuff. We want realism and accuracy.
    I care. I absolutly care. I care allot. And it shouldnt be that hard... For example, if france builds a huge cathedral then it should be a model of notre dam instead of the generic northern european cathedral.

    Another great addition in the mod would be cities divided by rivers, it would not only be harder to capture the city as you would need to take the bridge, but it would be so much more accurate. Same with coastel cities. Though these probably would be modding nightmares.

    About the three wall thing, citadels have three walls in the game, and they are almost as big as cities as it is. It shouldnt be too much work to modifie a citadel to look a bit more like a city, and call it constantinople. then again i too dont know much about modding so dont rely on what i say.
    For his betrayal, his eyes were gouged out and molten lead poured in his ears...

  7. #7
    blaaaaaaaaaarg! Senior Member Lusted's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2005
    Posts
    1,773

    Default Re: Glorious Cities!!!

    Modding unique cities in RTW was a nightmare that took many months to do just 1. I doubt it will be any easier in M2TW.

  8. #8

    Default Re: Glorious Cities!!!

    Its not going to be easy, but it would be great if it could be done! I am willing to contribute any way that i can. If any modder sees this, please let us know if and how it could be done.
    And about the three rows of walls of Constantinople, take a look here (3 rows and ditch):

    https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikiped...tantinople.JPG
    and
    http://www.turkeyvision.com/turkeyin...s/remparts.jpg
    and
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:Car_bed_kap_deu2.jpg
    and the best one:
    http://www.mlahanas.de/Greeks/Mediev...anWalls03.html

    Basically the first and smallest row was low and was right at the edge of the ditch. Look here:
    http://mek.oszk.hu/01900/01955/html/...195fm90102.jpg
    and here:
    http://templiers.info/cross_and_demi...tinople_00.jpg

    It was the largest,richest and most magnificent city of the Middle Ages and stood for a thousand years before it fell. Besieging it or defending it, should be special!

  9. #9
    Harbinger of... saliva Member alpaca's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2003
    Location
    Germany
    Posts
    2,767

    Default Re: Glorious Cities!!!

    We can't edit the settlements at all unless somebody cracks the format.

  10. #10

    Default Re: Glorious Cities!!!

    How can we do this?

  11. #11
    Megas Domestikos Member AnthoniusII's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2006
    Location
    Thesalonike Greece
    Posts
    219

    Default Re: Glorious Cities!!!

    How about if some cities are huge from the begining of the mod produsing atleast royal garisons but with less than the half population they can host...In this case the city design could stay the same but force the player to constuct all the other buildings a city needs as even a minor one.For example we could have Konstantinople with the imperial pallase and those three line impresive wall structure with a population of a small city..

  12. #12

    Default Re: Glorious Cities!!!

    Does the hard part of modding cities include unique buildings in the construction list? Because unique buildings on their own would give cities a better feel.
    For his betrayal, his eyes were gouged out and molten lead poured in his ears...

  13. #13

    Default Re: Glorious Cities!!!

    I think the important thing is for us to feel the difference of Jerusalem for example, in contrast to any other huge city. Jerusalem was the jem that every king would like in his crown! It should be special.
    So maybe changing the arrangement of the walls to match the original city, and adding just a single new building (Dome of the Rock) would make all the difference. Rome could be easily done as well.
    But the most difficult one, and the most wonderful, challenging and fortified would be Constantinople. Cause apart from the 3 rows on the east side, every other side was coastal and had one huge wall to protect from naval assaults. Hagia Sophia should also be added. Pics: (minarets are turkish additions)
    http://www.math.umn.edu/~alayont/tur...a/ayasofya.jpg
    http://www.sccs.swarthmore.edu/users...a%20sophia.jpg

    So.... any modders, please tell us if any of the above is possible and if any of you has any interest.
    Because i personally am not so interested in super historical accuracy (the historical role of the smallest kingdom in the middle ages) rather than the feel of the thing. I wanna feel like i felt in that movie, the Kingdom of Heaven. Yeah, i know it was not that great a movie.

  14. #14

    Default Re: Glorious Cities!!!

    HTML Code:
    How about if some cities are huge from the begining of the mod produsing atleast royal garisons but with less than the half population they can host...In this case the city design could stay the same but force the player to constuct all the other buildings a city needs as even a minor one.For example we could have Konstantinople with the imperial pallase and those three line impresive wall structure with a population of a small city...
    I forgot to answer to that. I believe that this is great. Cause it is imposible to make those "special" cities in minor, large and huge forms. Just make them huge and have their population and tech increase like the rest. Besides, they were huge in size at the year the game starts.

  15. #15

    Default Re: Glorious Cities!!!

    Yeah and maybe that way CONSTANTINOPLE WOULDNT GET SACKED IN THE 1200'S!!!! It would actually be a city that is particularly hard to take until gunpowder is invented.
    For his betrayal, his eyes were gouged out and molten lead poured in his ears...

  16. #16
    blaaaaaaaaaarg! Senior Member Lusted's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2005
    Posts
    1,773

    Default Re: Glorious Cities!!!

    So.... any modders, please tell us if any of the above is possible and if any of you has any interest.
    As alpaca said above, we can't edit settlement layouts.

  17. #17

    Default Re: Glorious Cities!!!

    Shit then!!!

  18. #18

    Default Re: Glorious Cities!!!

    Quote Originally Posted by \Vazul's Ghost/
    Yeah and maybe that way CONSTANTINOPLE WOULDNT GET SACKED IN THE 1200'S!!!! It would actually be a city that is particularly hard to take until gunpowder is invented.
    Constantinople was sacked in 1204 by the crusaders...

  19. #19
    Megas Domestikos Member AnthoniusII's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2006
    Location
    Thesalonike Greece
    Posts
    219

    Default Re: Glorious Cities!!!

    Quote Originally Posted by il-principe
    Constantinople was sacked in 1204 by the crusaders...
    Yes you are correct but even then the 10 greater cities of the west could fit in the city!!"Alexiad" Yuge cities existed all over east but Konstantinople was the biggest!!Western urban centers(cities)where in the same size with the eastern small towns.

  20. #20

    Default Re: Glorious Cities!!!

    Maybe the battle editor would help. Here:

    http://totalwarcommunity.blogspot.co...dieval-ii.html

  21. #21

    Default Re: Glorious Cities!!!

    I begun working on the battle editor, and while you can put any building on the map (even some i had never seen before, like fortified estate), i cant put walls. Therefore, building your own city is impossible. I will try more and maybe find a way.
    For now, the only way to put walls is to put a whole settlement on the map.
    Any ideas anyone?

  22. #22
    Megas Domestikos Member AnthoniusII's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2006
    Location
    Thesalonike Greece
    Posts
    219

    Default Re: Glorious Cities!!!

    Can you create costantinople?Then create a huge city from the begining!!! This whould not be unrealistic...The problem i think may be a huge population ready to revolte...How can you or anoyher of the dev team manage a city's population?Leaving it to revolt and then to recapture it? I am sure you will find a solution...I have faith in the team's abilities...Unfortunatly i have no idea in programing and I haven't a PC of my own to make experiments in the map editor...The only way I can help for now is by my historical knowlege in forts,cities,tactics,weapons and armors...

  23. #23

    Default Re: Glorious Cities!!!

    This is a BATTLE EDITOR. Meaning that you can make your own historical battles, and maybe maps for the campaign game. It is a very hard tool to use. It needs a lot of time to get to know it.
    I started making the map look like the peninsula of Constantinople (kinda....cause you cant really make it look like the original, nor have the same, gargantuan size) and now i am about to make the ditch and the bridges. You have every possible building at your disposal, but no walls! This is stupid! You can only have walls if you place a whole settlement, which you cannot edit. Meaning that it acts as a whole and you cannot erase buildings in it and put your own.
    So, please try too, so that we could find a solution. If i find a way to place walls, i can make the whole city!!! It would be great!
    PLEASE HELP.
    Info about the editor and the way to open it are above, at a link i gave you. Just remember that every time you want to use the editor you have to replace the text, cause it returns to its original format. So save a copy of both the original and the edited, so that you can simply paste the 2 when you want to use the editor.

  24. #24

    Default Re: Glorious Cities!!!

    The settlements are essentially one big model, theres no way to place individual parts without cracking the format

  25. #25

    Default Re: Glorious Cities!!!

    Yeah i kinda unsterstood that. But why does the editor have every concievable building for me to put on my map, when i cannot put walls? I mean.... COME ON!
    How am i supposed to make my own custom map, when the most important part is unavailable?
    So i can make my own fields and forests and place a church or blacksmith in the middle of nowhere! Am i supposed to be satisfied?
    I am soooo frustrated!

    Anyone else that has given it a try?

    PS. Breaking the code will probably allow you to erase buildings in the settlement and place your own. You will still have to make do with the circular format of the walls. So... i dont see any light in the tunnel....
    Why didnt they make it like the editor in Age of Empires? Is it so difficult?

    Sorry about the rage....Its just that i have spent so much time in it!

  26. #26
    Megas Domestikos Member AnthoniusII's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2006
    Location
    Thesalonike Greece
    Posts
    219

    Default Re: Glorious Cities!!!

    My dear friend sadournas don't force yourself so hard.Any way i'm happy to see people trying so hard for something all of us to enjoy.

  27. #27

    Default Re: Glorious Cities!!!

    Quote Originally Posted by Sandouras
    Yeah i kinda unsterstood that. But why does the editor have every concievable building for me to put on my map, when i cannot put walls? I mean.... COME ON!
    This is because the walls, gatehouse, generic buildings etc are all the same model, the individual buildings that feature in the tech tree are seperate models which are included based on whats in the actual strat map settlement. You cant place walls because there are no individual wall pieces, just the settlement as a whole.

    Quote Originally Posted by Sandouras
    PS. Breaking the code will probably allow you to erase buildings in the settlement and place your own. You will still have to make do with the circular format of the walls.
    The file structure for both the tech tree buildings and the settlements themselves look to be pretty much the same, if one gets cracked the other should be too. They're more complex though than units so its not going to be done overnght.

  28. #28
    Megas Domestikos Member AnthoniusII's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2006
    Location
    Thesalonike Greece
    Posts
    219

    Default Re: Glorious Cities!!!

    How about placing all the buildings and the population and when the mod begins the player must build huge walls

  29. #29

    Default Re: Glorious Cities!!!

    HTML Code:
    How about placing all the buildings and the population and when the mod begins the player must build huge walls
    I didnt get that.
    HTML Code:
    They're more complex though than units so its not going to be done overnght.
    So can anyone have a go at it?

  30. #30

    Default Re: Glorious Cities!!!

    Course, I suggest starting with something fairly simple like one of the rocks in the ambient_settlements folder. Work out the structure of the files there and move on to something more complex. The .world file looks to contain the actual geometry, the names of the other files are self explanatory as to whats in them, just a matter of figuring out how the info is stored.

Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  
Single Sign On provided by vBSSO