sarmatian house rules?

**kalkwerk** · 05-13-2007, 11:14

I tried a campaign as sarmatia, played with cunctuator/redmeth/BI-exe and on M/M. The first 10-15 years were quite challenging because of my debts, but after taking crimea i got enough money to recruit a full stack of HA and archers and now nothing seems to stop me, I mostly win battles without casualties.

I dont play with generals cam, and I suppose that might be an interesting option to make battles somewhat more difficult. Do you play with houserules in the composition of armies?

This is my first campaign on medium. It has the advantage that there has been no spamming of armies (not even the seleucids) until now (218 bc), but of course its somehow less challenging and its hard to "find" challenging opponents, the AI very rarely attack my settlements.

**Redmeth** · 05-13-2007, 11:46

The money script helps against the stack-spamming and I'm afraid playing on M makes it too easy, the serious challenges to the steppe armies are the Seleukid phalanxes aided by archers (Toxotai Syriakoi) really put the hurt on you if you can't get to them and some Catas, also steppe vs steppe is pretty interesting (Parthia and Sala) with HA duels and outmaneuvering your opponent is key.
Pahlava's catas are really nasty.
The Maks are also pretty tough and their high end troops are almost arrow-proof some Galatian Wild-Men i got from Galatia (duh!) make all the difference there.

**kalkwerk** · 05-13-2007, 12:14

ty ill play on vh then, but i cant see that phalanxes are any problem. Probably some of you know the classic from RTR forums:

HA HA HA HA

E E E E E E E E

HA HA HA HA

Its not difficult to get in this position and phalanxes stand no chance, especially as you archers get expereinced.

**Tristuskhan** · 05-13-2007, 14:17

Do you really have no problem with Phanlanxes? My Sarmatian campaign became very painful when I began to face Epeiros stacks of Chaonian phalanx and Thorakitai Illirikoi. Horse archers can waste all their arrows firing in the back of such units and creating very very few casualties...
My house rules were simple (were because the game CTD'ed in year -204): no retraining, no troop moving without a general in the stack. Even on M/M this campaign was really the toughest I ever played.

**kalkwerk** · 05-13-2007, 14:28

Originally Posted by tristuskhan

Do you really have no problem with Phanlanxes? My Sarmatian campaign became very painful when I began to face Epeiros stacks of Chaonian phalanx and Thorakitai Illirikoi. Horse archers can waste all their arrows firing in the back of such units and creating very very few casualties...
My house rules were simple (were because the game CTD'ed in year -204): no retraining, no troop moving without a general in the stack. Even on M/M this campaign was really the toughest I ever played.

Phalanxes are no problem. But you must do it right.
1. it is essential that you fire at them in the back or from more than one side.
2. it is more effective if you turn off skirmish mode so that you get really close.
3. make as many archers fire at one unit at a time (concentrate fire)
4. take out enemy archers and light cavalry before you attack phalanxes
5. cataphrachts might be a problem, but if you attack one at a time and use the secondary attack you overwhelm them. You will take casualties though. (i once encountered 8, this worked fine)

**Redmeth** · 05-13-2007, 14:43

I'm in 197 in my Sarmatian campaign and believe in some battles because of the terrain and because in every battle you're outnumbered at least 2:1 it's not easy at all in my fights against the maks the cheap Galatians and the Wild men make a huge difference.
I usually deploy my HA in a long line and try to envelop the enemy and when they are weakened and my HAs are out of ammo I dance around the phalanxes and engage one at a time with some infantry and send the other HA charging from all directions sometimes it works perfectly and I get little casualties but the elites sometimes won't break on the first charge and that means casualties sometimes quite a lot.
But still the feeling is unique and the close battles are great one time I managed to route their last phalanx with my general after 5-6 charges with 8 men left (after an epic battle where I held a ridge in the desert against a full stack and after I was out of ammo I tried what I described above only it was bloody as Argyraspidai are really tough).

**Kull** · 05-13-2007, 16:10

That horse archers would dominate the plains and steppe is hardly surprising. Just look at Cunaxa to see what happens to a predominantly infantry force out in the open against these guys.

What I never hear is how well HA armies fare when you drag them into the deep woods to take on the Sweboz, Getai, and Celts. If you want a real HA challenge, don't go west and south. Instead, march your forces east all the way to the Atlantic and tell us how well that worked out!

**Basileus Seleukeia** · 05-13-2007, 16:16

The Atlantic is in the West.

But nevermind.

**kalkwerk** · 05-13-2007, 17:34

Originally Posted by Kull

That horse archers would dominate the plains and steppe is hardly surprising. Just look at Cunaxa to see what happens to a predominantly infantry force out in the open against these guys.

What I never hear is how well HA armies fare when you drag them into the deep woods to take on the Sweboz, Getai, and Celts. If you want a real HA challenge, don't go west and south. Instead, march your forces east all the way to the Atlantic and tell us how well that worked out!

Well Ive begun expaning into Germania and this is actually even easier because of their bad armour.

**Zafersan** · 05-13-2007, 17:56

HAs are too cheap. I had an experienced army fight the Getai (who had only 1 settlement). The Getai had a full stack. I placed my HA armies in groups of 4s like a usually do, encircled the enemy all this while shooting mass arrows. And ended up destroying the Getai army with very few casualties and taking their only settlement afterwards.

I noticed that the HA does extremely well against Western Barbarians since they have low armour. The problem in West Europe is retraining the HAs though...good luck.

**Centurio Nixalsverdrus** · 05-13-2007, 18:21

Im my Mak campaign, Getai have become a Horse Archer and Celtic Levy faction. I hate archers, because the like to kill Thureophoroi and Agrianians.

**Ludens** · 05-13-2007, 18:54

Originally Posted by Kull

What I never hear is how well HA armies fare when you drag them into the deep woods to take on the Sweboz, Getai, and Celts. If you want a real HA challenge, don't go west and south. Instead, march your forces east all the way to the Atlantic and tell us how well that worked out!

Unfortunatly, trees don't stop arrows in R:TW, so my guess is the unarmoured Germans with their weak Bugimannoz and Ridjarhoz would fare even worse.

**Kull** · 05-14-2007, 07:22

Originally Posted by Ludens

Unfortunatly, trees don't stop arrows in R:TW, so my guess is the unarmoured Germans with their weak Bugimannoz and Ridjarhoz would fare even worse.

Sometimes I hate this engine.....

**Geoffrey S** · 05-14-2007, 09:26

That is what I found the most disappointing about Rome, that terrain had far less effect. I remember using trees in Medieval was absolutely essential to win against archer- or cavalry-heavy enemies, and dislodging opponents from a hill could be pretty tough even against the AI.