More than 1/3 of the US troops in Iraq says torture is acceptable

[ajaxfetish]

Furthermore, the issues which Agent Smith raised as to the validity of the data collection and reporting are sufficient to cast significant doubt on the validity of the study.

I wouldn't so much say that they cast doubt on the validity of the study, so much as raise unanswered questions about how the study should best be interpreted. I like Seamus' position that more detailed information on the specifics of how it was conducted and what the exact results were would be nice.

Ajax

[Tribesman]

If I was in Iraq, and a situation arose in which I had to mistreat, beat up, or torture an Iraqi to save the life of a comrade, I'd do it. And I hope any other soldier would do the same for me.

So your basic training didn't teach you much about the laws you have to follow then No surprise there then GC

The lives of the Soldiers come first.

Nope , soldiers are expendable , didn't you read the smallprint when you signed up .

[ajaxfetish]

If I was in Iraq, and a situation arose in which I had to mistreat, beat up, or torture an Iraqi to save the life of a comrade, I'd do it. And I hope any other soldier would do the same for me.

The lives of the Soldiers come first.

By your logic, it's a good thing I'm not in the military. I can't be sure what the stresses of the situation might do to me, but I sure hope I wouldn't be willing to torture an Iraqi for any reason. As a religious/spiritual person, I believe a good soldier would be welcomed by God if he died in the line of duty, and his unjust killer would face eternal justice in the end. The eternal blight on my mind and soul from participating in torture isn't worth it.

Ajax

[Redleg]

My argument is just as valid if the number was 30% instead of 50%. The army has begun to understand that mental health is an issue, however, they are lightyears away from the rest of society, and so they need a kick in the behind to speed things up. It's a good thing that they have started, a bad thing that they have used so long to find out the obvious.

Incorrect - Society in general is lightyears behind on mental health issues. So I find a major fault with your statement here.

Care to guess how civilians with bi-polar are treated in the civilian world?

[ShadeHonestus]

I find the study very interesting indeed. I know that it says a lot about the situation and mindset of our troops, but I also wonder how much would be lost going from belief to practical application. That same curve of gentlemen who say they can kill in combat as opposed to those finding that pulling the trigger is much harder than saying you can. In fairness you have to ponder those that say they wouldn't and yet when stress breaks your capacity you find yourself committing the offense.

Somebody mentioned the "macho attitude" coming in play here and while I don't dismiss this idea, from my own experience in the military the macho attitude both individual and collective served as more of a mental survival mechanism which was conducive for the training and muscle memory to function more readily. I see it much less as any kind of value system. The cadence an example. Many times my fellow marines and I chanted many horrific things like the "napalm sticks to kids" line, but yet those I served with are probably some of the finest human beings I've ever or will ever know and they'd sacrifice themselves to save any child from exposure to napalm.

Finally I'd just like to note here that I'd like to see the study done along the time-line of a conflict. No doubt we'd see the stress levels relative to the answers given. Tribesman mentioned something about remembering the laws given in basic training and he's quite right. You go over to Iraq, regardless of your politics, you fight for the men and women next to you, you find yourself emotionally vested in the country's citizenry and you are bound by law to fight for the rights of your combatant. The inherent stress is in exponential increase.