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Thread: How to stop crusaders deserting?

  1. #1
    Annoying Warhammer know-it-all Member DrZoidberg's Avatar
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    Default How to stop crusaders deserting?

    I'm Spain marching a crusader army through the African coast, but before I even get to Egypt my whole army has deserted. This is the second time it happens. Is there a way to prevent this from happening but still join the crusade on time?
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    Cynic Senior Member sapi's Avatar
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    Default Re: How to stop crusaders deserting?

    You need to move a certain distance to the target each turn.

    Having agents with the army will prevent you from doing this.

    Some paths, such as that from spain, will not count as having moved towards the target (moving south through the iberian peninsula, for example, is not moving towards the holy land) and the best way to get around this is to travel by ship, taking advantage of the cheap crusader merc ships.

    It's a good idea to land each turn, though, in case you get caught in a naval battle.
    From wise men, O Lord, protect us -anon
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    Annoying Warhammer know-it-all Member DrZoidberg's Avatar
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    Default Re: How to stop crusaders deserting?

    Quote Originally Posted by sapi
    You need to move a certain distance to the target each turn.

    Having agents with the army will prevent you from doing this.

    Some paths, such as that from spain, will not count as having moved towards the target (moving south through the iberian peninsula, for example, is not moving towards the holy land) and the best way to get around this is to travel by ship, taking advantage of the cheap crusader merc ships.

    It's a good idea to land each turn, though, in case you get caught in a naval battle.
    I am moving at full speed every turn.
    Sorry you must have been boring. -Dr Zoidberg

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    has a Senior Member HoreTore's Avatar
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    Default Re: How to stop crusaders deserting?

    Well, you have to ask yourself; are you moving the quickest way possible to get there?

    That doesn't mean "quickest way with ships" or "quickest way by land", it means the quickest way combining both. For spain, the quickest way to the holy land is NOT walking through the desert. The quickest way by far, is to sail directly from valencia to jerusalem, moving the max distance each turn of course, and not getting bogged down by enemy/neutral ships. You can easily detour a little, but until you know how to launch a succesful crusade, I suggest you don't, and go straight for the target.

    To this date, I haven't had a single crusade desert, except when I've been beaten at the target, or deliberately taken a detour knowing parts of the army will desert.
    Still maintain that crying on the pitch should warrant a 3 match ban

  5. #5

    Default Re: How to stop crusaders deserting?

    If you're moving through the desert and there's no road, you're going way too slow and all your army will bug out. If you've got a paved road its ok, otherwise forget it. go by ship.
    usually you don't want to go all the way there in any case. Just far enough to snatch a few rebel or muslim held cities. no point having a foothold in the Holy Land when you've got nothing in between. But be careful how you pace your moves when you stop to sack a city - if you end your turn too close to the city you won't move enough the next turn before you besiege, and troops will bug out.

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    New Member Member Jasper The Builder's Avatar
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    Default Re: How to stop crusaders deserting?

    This has happened to me on a couple of occasions also.

    I came to realise that the generals i had sent on the crusades lacked in loyalty and authority. When ive taken a Prince or a Faction Leader ive never had this problem. Like with all things within the game of TW its not always one problem that makes these things happen, I agree with the above also as being one of the major things you must do whilst crusading. Making sure the route you are taking is the fastest and most logical way, Having a number of scouts and spy's pathfinding their ways out in front and generally being totally professional about hoe you go about doing it.

    Its always a good idea also to take a number of priests along with you, To rally the soldiers hearts.

  7. #7
    Cynic Senior Member sapi's Avatar
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    Default Re: How to stop crusaders deserting?

    I wouldn't take any priests with a crusade; rather send them ahead.

    Keeping agents in a crusade/jihad stack removes the added movement bonus that they get and makes it impossible to move far enough each turn.
    From wise men, O Lord, protect us -anon
    The death of one man is a tragedy; the death of millions, a statistic -Stalin
    We can categorically state that we have not released man-eating badgers into the area -UK military spokesman Major Mike Shearer

  8. #8

    Default Re: How to stop crusaders deserting?

    There is a trick (exploit? / cheat?) you can use which enables you to move a crusading army in any direction without suffering any desertion.

    As a test I took a HRE army that had just starting a siege of Baghdad and marched it all the way back to Antwerp without suffering any desertions

    Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 
    All you do is move the army in the direction you want, until you have no movement point, left then click the "leave/join crusade" button twice. Once to leave, then again to immediately rejoin.

    There is usually a time limit starting when a crusade is called of about 10 turns during which the above will work. After this limit has expired you can leave the crusade but will not be able to rejoin.
    Last edited by Sentinel; 05-06-2007 at 08:00.

  9. #9
    Know the dark side Member Askthepizzaguy's Avatar
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    Default Re: How to stop crusaders deserting?

    I have some exploits for you....

    As france, I have become an expert crusader. France starts out with quite a few generals, and once I get a diplomat to rome and nab "modern day" france as a base of operations, I lump all my generals together and persuade the pope into a crusade of my choice. Generally, any catholic faction that has been excommed is your target. Barring that, a distant muslim province that has several rebel/non cath regions in between allows you to get a nice swath of destruction on the way there.

    With all my generals in one stack, I join a crusade. Then, I abandon the crusade. Then I join the crusade. Over and over, again and again, until the general leading the expedition has "the saint" after his name.

    Then I rinse and repeat for all the generals in the stack.

    Then I remove all the generals, save one, and send the crusading army on it's way.

    With the rest of the generals still in "crusade" mode, but with no accompanying troops, I return them to my best castles and towns as governors.

    The chivalry bonus makes this all worthwhile, because your towns will explode with population and your castles will be ready for improvement faster.

    Then, build up some troops at home.

    Next, let one of your (still technically "crusading") generals move to the middle of your territory, and send some of your best (and most expensive) troops to join him

    Then, when you're ready, hit the leave/join crusade button twice. Boom, all of your troops have joined the crusade.

    Now repeat the process until most of your generals are on a long crusade eliminating a catholic faction that has been excommed or into muslim territory, or my personal preference, through Byzantine territory and Turkey.

    For non catholic factions, exterminate the populace to maintain order. build a church the first turn, and then pop out as many priests as possible.

    Bonus here being, not only will you convert the populace faster, but you will get several cardinals. Next papal election is pwned by you.

    sacking cities while crusading is easy, just make sure you're travelling in a straight line as best you can towards your target, and end your turn much closer to it, and end the turn besieging the city. Sack it next turn, leave a garrison, and move quickly forward.

    In 30 turns I eliminated the HRE, Turkey, and Byzantium, and made it all the way to Baghdad. I have about 15 generals with 5 or above chivalry, and a massive army sacking the entire middle east.

    I generally prefer keeping my reputation honorable until I am vastly superior to all my neighbors in terms of immediate "blitz and sack their territory" ability. Then, without warning, I amass about 3 full stacks or more, and attack on mulitple fronts and end the war as quick as possible.

    Note that when you are a lone general on a crusade, you can move in ANY DIRECTION and not lose troops (your body guard will remain the same size).

    Use this technique to move your general far away from the crusading target (say, scotland or russia or africa)

    Once there, recruit as many mercenaries as possible and sack all surrounding cities on your way towards the "target" of the crusade.

    I think the crusade concept means the catholic factions are overpowered. If you had to pay for the troops you recruited (say, maybe at half the maintenence cost) it would be realistic. This way you can't have 25 stacks completely full on crusades and still be making 10000 florins per turn.
    #Winstontoostrong
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  10. #10
    Know the dark side Member Askthepizzaguy's Avatar
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    Default Re: How to stop crusaders deserting?

    Note well-
    I have been informed that apparently, the 5 chivalry exploit for crusades does not work after patch 1.2

    So tough luck all you patch users. I guess now all you can do is build dozens of free full stack armies and also send crusading generals in any direction and leave crusading generals inside cities so that if you need an instant army for an upcomming battle you can leave the city and hire a bunch of crusader mercs and kill whatever approaches you.

    Crusades... are... still overpowered!
    #Winstontoostrong
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  11. #11
    Cynic Senior Member sapi's Avatar
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    Default Re: How to stop crusaders deserting?

    It's your actions that are making the crusades overpowered, not any fault of the game...

    If you want a tough game, simple - don't exploit
    From wise men, O Lord, protect us -anon
    The death of one man is a tragedy; the death of millions, a statistic -Stalin
    We can categorically state that we have not released man-eating badgers into the area -UK military spokesman Major Mike Shearer

  12. #12
    Friendly Resident Knight Member Fußball's Avatar
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    Default Re: How to stop crusaders deserting?

    Quote Originally Posted by sapi
    It's your actions that are making the crusades overpowered, not any fault of the game...

    If you want a tough game, simple - don't exploit
    Agreed. House rules are the easiest form of balance in a game against the AI. In my games, making my actions more reasonable and less gamey enhances the fun. A good example being: In the early game it is easy to blitz the AI and accomplish your goals in the short campaigns. But if you hold back and only take rebel settlements, let your empire grow whilst the AI does, games last longer, are more challenging and imo more fun.

    Tschüß!
    Erich


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  13. #13
    Praeparet bellum Member Quillan's Avatar
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    Default Re: How to stop crusaders deserting?

    The basic calculation seems to be based upon distance; the game basically calculates how many squares away from the crusade target you are at the start of your turn, and you must be at least X squares less distant from the target at the end of your turn or you suffer desertion. Since sailing south from England forces you to go around the Iberian peninsula, as an example, that actually makes you move away from the crusade target, and people desert.

    In the case of Spain, if you are in Algiers marching due east, you'll probably not have to worry about desertion unless you have agents in the army or units that aren't part of the crusade (both slow it down). However, when you turn south to march down towards Libya, you may well lose chunks of the army. When I was playing Spain, I went by boat. If you are at all worried about the fighting capability of the fleet, then stay close to land and get off the boats at the end of each turn, plus you'd want more boats or spies ahead to scout for enemy fleets so you don't get stopped.
    Age and treachery will defeat youth and skill every time.

  14. #14
    Know the dark side Member Askthepizzaguy's Avatar
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    Default Re: How to stop crusaders deserting?

    Quote Originally Posted by sapi
    It's your actions that are making the crusades overpowered, not any fault of the game...

    If you want a tough game, simple - don't exploit
    I guess it is my fault... when I see a way to victory, I tend to take it. Unless it's downright cheating. I don't use codes or anything. But I do exploit loopholes in the game.

    So it's MY actions that make the crusades overpowered. Go me!

    I am just too powerful I guess. Even on VH/VH it's way too easy. That's pretty sweet if you think about it.

    Anyone else have 74 regions controlled by turn 49? That's a rate of 3 regions every 2 turns. That's actually challenging. I wish I knew how to make a screenshot.

    I have everything except egypt and turkey and my very first faction leader finally died on turn 48. Not a bad reign.
    #Winstontoostrong
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