Calling ALL CAVALRY COMMANDERS !

[Death is yonder]

Hi guys,I'm kind of a noob to M2TW,don't know a lot of stuff,but I know for sure that Horse Archers kick everyone else as... err..butt.Until recently,i thought a heavy foot archer and infantry with one or two units of siege weapons was the way to go.
Then,the mongols came and totally owned my units .I've been trying HA ever since.The byzantine empire's horse archers such as vardariotai(not sure about spelling)and the skythikons own a lot.Most battles result in high kills and low casualties.The next time i faced the mongols,I won!With stunning kill to death ratios.
I'll just like to say that im now officially a HA addict.Mmmmmmmm... Russian HA against Eastern Catholic Infantry armies.I feel evil .

[Odin]

Hi guys,I'm kind of a noob to M2TW,don't know a lot of stuff,but I know for sure that Horse Archers kick everyone else as... err..butt.Until recently,i thought a heavy foot archer and infantry with one or two units of siege weapons was the way to go.
Then,the mongols came and totally owned my units .I've been trying HA ever since.The byzantine empire's horse archers such as vardariotai(not sure about spelling)and the skythikons own a lot.Most battles result in high kills and low casualties.The next time i faced the mongols,I won!With stunning kill to death ratios.
I'll just like to say that im now officially a HA addict.Mmmmmmmm... Russian HA against Eastern Catholic Infantry armies.I feel evil .

Welcome to the club, wait until you get Mounted Dvor cavalry, fun unit.

[Czar Alexsandr]

I would just like to say welcome to Death is yonder and Fisherking!

I agree with you Death is yonder about HA. HA, espesially the lighter faster guys, are deadly. (Especially when they have good stanima. Or.. very good stanima in the case of the Cossack Cavalry. Russia rules.)

Fisherking, your post was very interesting. It seems you're a natural cavalry man. I like the subtlety and skill required when handling the cavalry as well. Infantry is basically just a wind em up and let em go thing.

[Death is yonder]

Thanks for the welcome guys.I agree with u Czar Alexander that infantry are basically quite useless while playing Russia and Byzantine,well,until you get the heavier infantry for the Byzantines.The only job term i have for infantry is... cannon fodder.I just use them to hold the other calvary/infantry in place till i charge them in the rear.

[Czar Alexsandr]

I use Infantry as Russia, I just prefer to use cavalry. I have several all cavalry armies but most of my armies are missile units, infantry, and cavalry. With infantry + cavalry armies you just gotta position the cavalry and infantry right and plan for them to strike around the same time. I take the speed of infantry in mind when planning my strategy and have my cavalry run behind the enemy a distance I think they can close and do the same with my infantry. When my infantry gets close, I have them charge, have the cavarly charge , and the infantry and cavalry often find themselves surrounded by a routing army.

[marrow]

I have to admit that all-cav armies worked best with my Polish camp.
Loved Russia too, but it's the sheer punch of polish nobles that makes all the difference.

I would personally recommend Poland as possibly the most involving campaign there is for cavalry commanders. Russian camp is much fun too, but the starting position is very secure compared to Poland and allows for both quick expansion and turtling strategies, whereas the poles are forced to pull their socks up from the word go to make world domination feasible.

Polish nobles and strzelcy are available right from the start and both are excellent units although demanding some patience and skill. In right hands tho, both units will butcher quite a ridiculous amount of men in early wars against HRE. After the first 20 turns my initial stack of 6 strzelcy and 4 PN + 2 generals have gone up to 1 - 2 silver chevrons on average. And it's certified that they eat boyar sons for breakfast, tried and tested both in my Russian and Polish campaigns.

The cream gets a bit too thick later on though, once you start producing Hussars. I have tested it numerous times and a stack of 1 - 2 generals, 6 strzelcy, 4 polish nobles, 4 Hussars and 4 polish knights/guard (same stats anyway!) is a bit too far on the jedi side I'm afraid. Hussars are just too good for their own good. Maybe it's just me, but I smashed through Russians, the Byz, the Turks, Egyptians and the Mongols without much effort. I have found I have to impose limitations on my expansion because no one can stop that single stack! I saved that campaign some few weeks ago and I actually don't fancy coming back to it as I had already started auto-resolving battles...

Seriously tho - give polish cav a try and prepare to be amazed.

[Fisherking]

Marrow, hear-hear!

I totally agree that Poland is a cavalry powerhouse.

And if you liked it so well the next challenge is Hungry.

They do not have the depth of Poland but they do have the Hussars and Hungarian Nobles. HNs are an excellent unit even though a bit expensive. It is harder hitting as an archer but not armor piercing.
But for dismounted archers they have nice pavise crossbows that can lay down a base of fire giving your horse a free reign to envelope and flank the enemy.

They are both wonderful factions to play. Poland seems the easier to me...

[marrow]

I have given Hungary a go in the past, but then I had a system rebuild and lost the savegame, it was going quite well tho so I will definitely come back soon, cheers bro!

BTW, not sure if this has been covered this far, what is the benefit of barded horses? Some units (polish knights/guard) seem to ride barded steeds but they have no advantage in stats, does that extra bit of armour have any impact (speed, survivability and such).

[Czar Alexsandr]

Poland and Hungary are excellent Eastren European nations as well. The Eastrean European factiosns are great Cavalry centered factions. Poland has the Polish Knights, Polish Guard, Lithuanian Cavalry, Strelzky, and the mighty Polish Nobles at it's disposal. All excellent units. Although I must admit.. the Lituanian Cavalry, although a fine horse archer, is nothing like my Russian Horse archers. My Cossacks are a much bettern unit in my opinion. And the Hungarians, with their Hungarian Nobles, Magyar Cavalry, Hussars, and Royal Banderium is also a very good cavalry faction. But no javelien cavalry! With Russia I have the fleet Cossacks and the versitile Dvor and the Boyar Sons. Russia has a very nice selection of Cavalry late game. (I admit it takes forever, but I personally enjoy making a medeival Soviet Union. XD ) The super Heavy Tsar's Guard is the best fighter in the heavy cavalry arena hands down. (Although the charge is a bit low.) The Dvor fires it's arrows with a very high attack rating. (It's like a T-80.) The Cossack is speedy and well balanced. Nothing makes me happier then seeing my Cossacks are still just as energetic at the end of the battle as they were when it started. (This is after all arrows have been fired and they've coomited to melee and routed the enemy.) Boyar Sons are good. Though not as good as Polish Nobles, they are still very good. And with the Dismounted Dvor, Cossak Musketeers, and Basilisks to provide long ranged support for your cavalry... Well... let's just say Russia's a pretty good faction.

I have to try Poland and Hungary in earnest though, although of course my favorite faction is Russia. (It'll be likely to stay that way. Me and my Russians have some history.. )

By the way.. has anyone seen that there's a Calling all Infantry Commanders thread now? O_o? Any cavalry guys play Multiplayer? I'd like to see thosse Infantry nuts put in their place once and for all!

Them Us

[Shahed]

WELCOME ABOARD to those who just joined us !

Alex, Thanks for keeping this thread & this association alive ! and .. HAHA ! YEAH ! I saw the Infantry thread, thought that was funny, in a way, but I think the original poster meant well.... BUT gentlemen this is not a "us vs them" thing. Respect where it's due, all round.

It's 2 different playstyles.

We're all in here to enjoy the game, and share our passion for a pastime.
If others feel differently than us, that's fine ! Hell that's exactly what makes us different !

Perhaps we'll learn something from them ? Who knows ? Hell they sure learnt a LOAD from us, Just look at how much an average player learnt about how to deal with HA & Combined Arms All Cavalry Armies from Hunters All Their Lives by Doug-Thompson. We gave, (thank you everyone for what I learnt from you), to this community over the years and we continue to give.

Had a brief game tonight as Teutons in the Kingdoms expansion, definetly not a great cav faction, although they have some BAD BAD BAD MEAN looking cav. And the map itself, not much of a cav map. It is do-able but be ready for lots of hills and trees. HOWEVER, LOADS & LOADS of infantry to utterly annihilate. Careful of woodsmen and other 2 Hander peasants-types they can do damage. I'd like to give a shot as Novogrod in this campaign, that should be fun! LOADS of Inf to shoot up (something the Teutons lack till Mounted Xbows & I have'nt seen those yet).

I did a few hours as Egypt the other day (Kingdoms) and WOW ! now that's defintely an ALL cav faction.

Will try Poland too...

MOUNT UP !!! WE RIDE ON !!!

[Mete Han]

Poland and Hungary are excellent Eastren European nations as well. The Eastrean European factiosns are great Cavalry centered factions. Poland has the Polish Knights, Polish Guard, Lithuanian Cavalry, Strelzky, and the mighty Polish Nobles at it's disposal. All excellent units. Although I must admit.. the Lituanian Cavalry, although a fine horse archer, is nothing like my Russian Horse archers. My Cossacks are a much bettern unit in my opinion. And the Hungarians, with their Hungarian Nobles, Magyar Cavalry, Hussars, and Royal Banderium is also a very good cavalry faction. But no javelien cavalry! With Russia I have the fleet Cossacks and the versitile Dvor and the Boyar Sons. Russia has a very nice selection of Cavalry late game. (I admit it takes forever, but I personally enjoy making a medeival Soviet Union. XD ) The super Heavy Tsar's Guard is the best fighter in the heavy cavalry arena hands down. (Although the charge is a bit low.) The Dvor fires it's arrows with a very high attack rating. (It's like a T-80.) The Cossack is speedy and well balanced. Nothing makes me happier then seeing my Cossacks are still just as energetic at the end of the battle as they were when it started. (This is after all arrows have been fired and they've coomited to melee and routed the enemy.) Boyar Sons are good. Though not as good as Polish Nobles, they are still very good. And with the Dismounted Dvor, Cossak Musketeers, and Basilisks to provide long ranged support for your cavalry... Well... let's just say Russia's a pretty good faction.

I have to try Poland and Hungary in earnest though, although of course my favorite faction is Russia. (It'll be likely to stay that way. Me and my Russians have some history.. )

By the way.. has anyone seen that there's a Calling all Infantry Commanders thread now? O_o? Any cavalry guys play Multiplayer? I'd like to see thosse Infantry nuts put in their place once and for all!

Them Us

The Polish, Hungarian and Russian and Byzantian (i doubt i spelled that right) HA units seem to have better stats than Turkish HA units. Especially the mediocre discipline and stamina of the Sipahis seems like a problem. However the advantage of the Sipahis is that their upkeep is much lower than their rival HA's. Only Cossack's have lower upkeep but then they are untrained and their pony is not heavy type as the Sipahis and also they do not have armour. So in the end there are two HA units that really can be the core unit of an army for you can use them in mass with thanx to thier lower upkeep: Sipahis and Cossack Cavalry. Sipahis are more meely oriented while the Cossacks are more manouverable. THe upkeep difference between Vardartorai (also the Dvor) and the Sipahi is 75 florins per turn. so in ten turns it makes 750 and if you have 20 unit it adds up to 15000 florins. With Cossak's the difference is even higher. So I would go for Cossack and Sipahi every time. THey will get the job done.

Apart from these the range of the camel gunners hurts you a lot in a battle especially if you are in the desert (which is usualy where you fight them) and get tired chasing them. Must be fun to use them against the Elephants.

[Czar Alexsandr]

Sinan

Thank you! I'm just suprised that this old thread's still getting people's attention. It seems there are a lot of cavalry fanatics out there and quite possibly even more!

I admit I may have come off as being a little biast against the Infantry commanders but... I mean't it all in the sense of friendly rivalry! eg. The Hundred Years war was all a friendly rivalry on what was better! Just kidding! ^_^ Yeah I'd just really like to see some competion's held between the two groups. It'd be good for both of us. We'd learn how to counter good infantry generals and they'd learn how to counter cavalry. I have the utmost respect for them and wish no ill will. They may play the game any way they chosse and I'm sure if I got on today they'd teach me a lesson or two. (I'd get em back though. O_- )


Mete Han

I totally agree with you. The Sipahi and Cossack Cavalry are excellent cavalry archers. Very versitile (Not to discount the great horse archers oth other factions like Hungary, Poland, Byzantium, and Egypt.) And of course it's not a horse archer, but the Camel Gunners could very well be the most dangerous missle cavalry unit. (Aside from Spanish Dragoons in Kingdoms which to my understanding are much better.) I have used Camel Gunners against the Timurids and the Mongols though. It makes your battles a lot easier. XD (Doesn't mean it's not fun. Nothing's better than sweeping across Eqypt for the sole purpose of defeating the only armies that can still present a challenge to you.)

[Fisherking]

As promised here is a link to the Horse Archers in Augsburg, which is near me. It is the link to the translated page…hope it works.


http://translate.google.com/translat...%3Den%26sa%3DX


I was also wondering if anyone else actually has a horse. Mine is a gaited horse in keeping with what is/was desirable both then and now for me.

I don’t know how trotting horses gained such prominence but it sure makes for a hard ride.

Sorry, not posting pictures but she is a lovely 4 year old MFT (Missouri Foxtrotting Horse)

[imnothere]

hi fisherking,

you might want to check this out
http://community.livejournal.com/equestrian/ this is for horse-lovers - mostly pictures and some common problems in training and health.

despite being an infantry commander, yes i do like horses. just too poor to afford one.

(pity that horses cant learn how to cook....opps)

[Zajuts149]

POP QUIZ

Whose slogan is this ?

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

Silent as the forest, Steady as the mountain,
Swift as the wind, ATTACK LIKE FIRE !

Without using Google Gentlemen !

Takeda Shingen?

BTW, I've started to cross over to the Cavalry side. I started playing as the Turks, and boy I love those cheap, expendable Horse-archers. That way I can put a unit up at the border, face overwhelming odds from enemy Infantry and heavy Cav, inflict as much losses as possible, and then retreat for the loss:D. I even took Nicaea with just Cavalry:D(and a spy). My Sultan and som hired akinji thugs sneeked in at night and rained death on the enemy general and his town militia.

[Zajuts149]

Takeda Shingen?

Dang man, and without google as well:D That wild stab in the dark hit home..

[Dragunija]

I am cavarly person.I only tried demo of M2TW,but i love those Late Bodyguards in Pavia.So i mostly apply to RTW cav.Parthia and Cataphracts for the win!

Dragunija

[Boyar Son]

HELP!!

I'm playing MTW2: kingdoms in the teutonic campaign. After reading how the German cav are unmatched in the game and everyone here says the order has "omg uber heavy infintry111" I started the campaign.

Now I'm in debt for expensive cav and and cannot retrain, and they drop dead in the moment of impact!!

these guys are really crapy and I doubt that Brit dude and his cav are going to be any better against lithuania, practicaly an all cav nation.

what unit is the best for: _powerful while not expensive_

[LadyAnn]

Fellow Soldiers, Sipahi, Knights, Fursan, Guards, Cavalrymen and Women !

• Often command all cavalry armies.
• Favor Missile Cavalry or any Cavalry over all else.
• Love Cavalry and everything about it, ingame and historically.
• Have a great affection for horses.

I like to command men who happen to ride horses. I don't have any affection for horses!

Otherwise, count me in!

Btw, Furious has a mean all cav army in MTW/Vi (toward the end, near R:TW release).

Annie

[Old Geezer]

I love cavalry too, but find it necessary to have some infantry to capture cities and castles. Otherwise, the cavalry get hurt real bad by some cheap spear militia in the crowded streets. Units like Jinnets and Irish Squires get caught when they enter a setltement and I can't get them away from the enemy without them getting mauled while in open field battles they usually take no casualties. There is nothing quite so boring as trying for 10 minutes to catch a single horse archer with six heavy slow tired knights. I learned my lesson good and now always try and have at least one unit, even if very small, of fast cavalry in an army in a field battle.

[TheLastPrivate]

I usually take an all-cav army to start the siege, where a arty+inf+archer army would come in the next turn to finish them off.
If you don't start the siege who knows what it would produce in the next turn you don't siege it - Siege stuff asap, and all cav army is perfect for that.

[phonicsmonkey]

I usually take an all-cav army to start the siege, where a arty+inf+archer army would come in the next turn to finish them off.
If you don't start the siege who knows what it would produce in the next turn you don't siege it - Siege stuff asap, and all cav army is perfect for that.

Me too! I have a vanguard of all-cav stacks that sweep over the border and eliminate any enemy field armies before sieging their closest cities.

Then the second wave of invaders is an all-infantry stack full of spears and archers (along with Greek fire if I'm Byz) - they take over the siege from the cavalry commanders who gallop off into the sunset and leave the infantry behind to do the dirty work (once the third wave of artillery arrives to break down the walls and smash the towers.)

[Shahed]

HI ALL !

Dang man, and without google as well:D That wild stab in the dark hit home..

You got it ! Impressed that you read the thread all the way back. Salute !

I am cavarly person.I only tried demo of M2TW,but i love those Late Bodyguards in Pavia.So i mostly apply to RTW cav.Parthia and Cataphracts for the win!

Dragunija

WELCOME ABOARD !

HELP!!

I'm playing MTW2: kingdoms in the teutonic campaign. After reading how the German cav are unmatched in the game and everyone here says the order has "omg uber heavy infintry111" I started the campaign.

Now I'm in debt for expensive cav and and cannot retrain, and they drop dead in the moment of impact!!

these guys are really crapy and I doubt that Brit dude and his cav are going to be any better against lithuania, practicaly an all cav nation.

what unit is the best for: _powerful while not expensive_

You mean what's the best cavalry for Teutonic Order ? -> Mounted RitterBruder. Powerful but nor that expensive -> Christ Knights. Cheap & easy -> Knechten.

You should be fine with just a few cav as Teutonic Order. It's not really a good all cavalry nation as their best units are infantry. It's a great faction for heavy slow armies. There's a discussion about a few army compositions earlier here (<-link). Copy paste :

My standard army around turn 35 is something like this:

• General's BodyGuard *1
• Mounted RitterBruder * 3
• Mounted HalfBruder or ChristKnights * 4
• Prussian Archers or Livonian Auxilliaries * 4
• Teutonic Order Foot Soldiers * 4
• Sword Brethern, Dismounted HalfBruder or Dismounted RitterBruder* 4

There's a discussion about Clergymen here (<-link).

Hope that helps.

I like to command men who happen to ride horses. I don't have any affection for horses!

Otherwise, count me in!

Btw, Furious has a mean all cav army in MTW/Vi (toward the end, near R:TW release).

Annie

Nice to see you Annie! You mean you like to command men!.
Don't worry once you're proficient at commanding men, you'll find horses a lot less intimidating.

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

!JUST KIDDING !

Do you remember that army composition that Furious used ?
Please post it if you do, I don't remember it.

BTW are you still in Freedom Fighters ? Do they still have a website ?

I love cavalry too, but find it necessary to have some infantry to capture cities and castles. Otherwise, the cavalry get hurt real bad by some cheap spear militia in the crowded streets. Units like Jinnets and Irish Squires get caught when they enter a setltement and I can't get them away from the enemy without them getting mauled while in open field battles they usually take no casualties. There is nothing quite so boring as trying for 10 minutes to catch a single horse archer with six heavy slow tired knights. I learned my lesson good and now always try and have at least one unit, even if very small, of fast cavalry in an army in a field battle.

When capturing cities with missile cavalry, you shoot out the enemy to the last man. Then you charge from multiple sides, never head on in a street. This has been discussed at some length earlier in the thread IIRC. The key to not getting them engaged in prolonged melee is to watch them closely and keep them at a safe distance. If commanding melee cavalry, the same principle applies, many directions, charge in and disengage, repeat.

The way I deal with enemy horse archers is to shoot them down. It's a pain to have to run around the map after them, far easier to outshoot them. This can be achieved by using multiple units against a single enemy unit, and using manual fire, everyone shoots at the same time allowing more kills and reduced reaction time for enemy horse archers to go into Cantabrian Circle.

I usually take an all-cav army to start the siege, where a arty+inf+archer army would come in the next turn to finish them off.
If you don't start the siege who knows what it would produce in the next turn you don't siege it - Siege stuff asap, and all cav army is perfect for that.

Absolutely! Also spies are great, just make sure you have enough inside and open the gates, walk in from all sides. Not the best way but if you MUST take a city with an all cavalry army, it's good to have all gates open to allow for greater mobility.

SALUTE !

[Shahed]

NEW MEMBERS!

Gentlemen! please welcome Dragunija & our first female member LadyAnn of the Freedom Fighters !

For those of you who have never heard of her, she's quite a legend in Total War multiplayer since a few years ago.
A veteran, she's a good player, well spirited, sporting & competitive, a good leader better than most men could ever hope to be.

WELCOME ABOARD ! to you both!

[LadyAnn]

Freedom Fighters as a gaming group are still alive. Website is www.ffighters.co.uk. The Totalwar section is dormant though. Recently, only two of us occasionally play Samurai Wars on Sunday.

Been a while, so I don't remember the composition of Furious all cavalry army.

Annie

[Shahed]

GREETINGS ALL !

Few sigs I made a long time ago, they're not that great but if anyone wants to use them feel free.
I've kept them within the 10kb rule, original screens were from an earlier build of Broken Crescent.







Also the Broken Crecent Mod for M2:TW has been released. Haven't tried it yet but it should be great for all cavalry fans.

SALUTE!

[marrow]

Nice, how does one set them up as signatures (pardon my ignorance...)?
Cheers mate!

[Mete Han]

Nice, how does one set them up as signatures (pardon my ignorance...)?
Cheers mate!

yeah I'd like to learn that as well!!! I cant even post pictures in posts (that sounds awful).

[manwithplanx]

<

Cavalry Commander Manwithplanx reporting in.

I loved the Parthians in RTW and love the eastern factions in M2TW.

Nothing beats watching a cavalry line rush into a group of frightened swordsman as they look at their doom.

[MerlinusCDXX]

Dihqan Merlinus reporting for duty.

Era; Hellenistic
Occupation; General's Bodyguard
Mount; Full Lamellar Armored Warhorse
Weapon; Kontos, Composite Bow
Opponent Best Against; The poor dumb footslogger
Nation; Pahlavan (Parthian) Empire
Game; RTW (EB 1.0)

Era; Medieval
Occupation; Cataphract Lancer
Mount; Full Lamellar Armored Warhorse
Weapon; Lance, Mace
Opponent Best Against; anyone without a spear or a decent mount
Nation; Khwarezm Shah
Game; M2TW (Broken Crescent 1.05)

Era; Medieval
Occupation; Templar Knight
Mount; Barded Charger
Weapon; Lance, Sword
Opponent Best Against; anyone, I'll f**ckin' kill 'em all in the name of God
Nation; Order of Knights Templar
Game; M2TW Kingdoms (Stainless Steel 5.1)

...hmmm, I always seem to be playing these cavalry heavy factions...I guess cav IS king