Epeirus:Which of these two strategies did you choose?

**pansoiatr** · 05-11-2007, 09:22

Since i downloaded the last EB i have played 5 campaigns as epeirus.I havent managed to conclude them but in my current campaign i have chosen a different aproach to what i usually do.
Normally i would abandon taras and the italian adventure of pyrrhos and concentrate in mainland greece defeating the macedonians and the koinon.
This time i chose to have a go at the romans with my local forces and the trusted general Helenos(which historically was the only general that pyrrhos could depend in his skills).
And to my surprise after conquering and losing capua and arpi a few times and many manouvers and come and goes, i even managed to capture rome.
After that pyrrhos came in italy and everything was over for the romani.
I would like to know the strategy that U follow:

1.Concentrate in mainland greece

or

2.Fight in both fronts italy and greece?

**Redmeth** · 05-11-2007, 09:47

If you can do it pick number 2.
For extra funds you can exterminate some roman cities for plunder and get Rhegion for the mine and Sicily for the grains and trade and should get enough money to keep the fight going on both fronts.
Never played Epeiros but that's what I'd do...

**Watchman** · 05-11-2007, 10:25

Samnite mercs are your best friends in Italy early on, I've noticed.

**MiniMe** · 05-11-2007, 11:57

Originally Posted by pansoiatr

2.Fight in both fronts italy and greece?

Yep, it's possible. I've done that in 0.80 and in 0.81a and I'm going to do that in 0.90 =)

Originally Posted by Watchman

Samnite mercs are your best friends in Italy early on, I've noticed.

And Samnite swordsmen are your best friend later on. Great universal units of great value. In my second epeiros campaign I've been using them as my main infantry instead of Illiryoi Thorakitai.

**JeffBag** · 05-11-2007, 18:05

Using the starting elephants, I blitzed Macedon and Thessaly, then got a ceasefire with the Macedonians, before disbanding my elephants and rushing to board a ship off Ambrakia for Italy.
Spring - Take Macedon
Summer - Take Demetrias
Autumn - Pack up Pyrrhos' army
Winter - Land at the Port of Taras, Romani seiges Taras
Within 5 years from Summer of 271 bc, the Romani is finished, leaving me undisputed ruler of Macedon and Italy, and in a great position to finish off the Koinon, take Sicily for trade, and take Illyria for mining income. Main problems with this strat is that it gets too boring too fast, until you blitz Asia Minor.

**LorDBulA** · 05-11-2007, 18:54

I play Epeiros now.
VH/H and I chosed second strategy.

I used starting troops to attack Macedon and used money to fortify Taras.
I took Makedonia and Thessalia. I didnt want to finish off Macedon or Hellons so
I signed peace with Macedon.
I wanted to go for Sycily but it wasn't possible since Romanii where making troubles. So I moved to Itally. I took Apullia and raze Capua.
I didnt want to fight Romans more but they just didnt want to make peace.
So later I razed city in Umbria, Rome twice and Capua again. But they just didnt want to make peace. Lots of great big battles against Romanii, ton of fun.
In the meantime I captured Brettia and Dalmatia.
I also kept Capue after I capture it n-th time.
Then there was war with Hellans (they attacked me).
When I kicked Hellens out of greece they assassinated my King.
Great character only 35 years old. I was planing to make him second Alexander.
This pissed me off really bad. I set my mind to destroy Greeks.
So I rushed attack on Rhodos and I lost like 70% of my elite army and another great character when my fleet was intercepted and sunk. But later I finished them off.
Later there was second war with Macedon (also they attacked me).
After that finally I was able to take Sicily ( war with Carthage, my elephants where wrecking havoc on very good and full force carthage army in sicily ).
By that time I had enough Romans, so I attacked them with intension to throw them out of Italy.
Its 220BC now. I throw Romans out of Itally. They are yet another Galic faction now.
Since I kicked Romans butt, AI decided I need more challenge and my long Ally Getai attacked me at Dalmatia. Now my homeland is attacked by 3 big Getai stacks.

Lots fun all around. I really can recommend playing Epeiros to everyone.

My strategy tips for everyone would be to take Dalmatia and Brettia fast. This mine riddle provinces are very profitable.
Athens are also very profitable but starting war with Kinon Hellenon fast will lower the challenge.

**pansoiatr** · 05-11-2007, 19:35

In general in my last campaign i did as as Lordbula.
I find that it is essential to make a ceasefire with the macedonians after you have taken dimitrias and pella.With the romanni it is a tough battle until you manage to capture rome.After that you can easily drive them out of italy or eliminate them as a faction.They also dont seem to be ready to accept a ceasifire even if they have only 1 province left.
Too much hatred between them and pyrrhos i guess

**Lovejoy** · 05-11-2007, 21:16

I usually first blitz the mac and capture Pella and the city right under it. I then turn against the romans. KH and the macs should be busy with eachother long enough for you to kill them off. After this you simply return to greece and kill whoever won the great KH vs Mac war.

It worked twice!

**Ravenfeeder** · 05-11-2007, 22:17

The starting position against Makedon is so good that I went for Greece first.

I'd actually planned to leave the Romani to really build up, but they kept on spamming Epeiros with stacks by sea from Arpi that when Taras rebelled against them I just went and jumped all over them.

It was (is) a great campaign, but eventually I got annoyed with fighting the Kart-Hadast as the mixture of distance to capital and cultural penalties meant constant revolts.

There's maps of my progression in the AI Progression thread.

**Kralizec** · 05-11-2007, 23:22

Use your starting money to que some extra Phalangitai Deuterioi and one or two skirmishers in Taras. Stay defensive in Italy for the time being while you conquer Pella and Demetrias. After that you can either chose to disband your elephants to recover your finances or keep attacking either Makedon or the KH till your elephants are spent.

**Watchman** · 05-12-2007, 00:30

Huh. When I tried the Epirotes a while back I was able to simultaneously blitz both the Macs with Pyrrhus and most of south-central Italy with the Taras garrison augmented with Samnites (hired with cash earned from disbanding Mac factional buildings in Pella...). Seemed to me once you got rid of the garrison of the nearest Roman city (don't recall the name now) the Res Publica had a hard time scrounging up enough decent troops to seriously contest the matter. Either they were busy up north, or their starting stacks just don't add up to enough of a strategic reserve to quickly make up for the loss of the fairly strong southern garrisons...

Incidentally, I found the elephants Pyrrhus starts with to be a rather pointless money sink. Maybe I just got lucky, but spies worked much better for instant siege assaults, partly because with them you don't have to worry too much about the slingers most of the Mac garrisons include. Indeed, as the AI tries to put one unit blocking each of the open gates, them pesky slingers for some reason always tended to be guarding the one facing the whole assaulting army with the due result Pyrrhus and his boys shortly trampled them flat...

**pansoiatr** · 05-12-2007, 08:27

I found the elephants at the start of the campaign very useful.With them you can easily take pellas and dimitrias in the first 2 turns.
I found that letting some of elephants getting killed gives a necessary breath at beggining since it takes only 3 out of the initial 9 elephant guides to operate all 3 elephants
Maximum effect with minimum cost

**gran_guitarra** · 05-31-2007, 05:36

Actually if you use them right you can capture all of Greece no problem. I captured everything except for Sparta and the Delphi place.

That being said, it took me about 12 turns and I was 50k in debt by the time I finished. Took me about ten or so turns to get back into black. But if you do this all you really need is a nice little army to take both those places and then blitz Rhodos and Kretai, thus gaining you a brilliant economy.

btw, when you expand into Ionia, is it common for the Selucids to attack you for no reason with a half stack of half-strength units? cause they did that to a full stack of experienced units, mostly mercenary medium phalanxes, cavalry, and a bunch of skirmishers.

**MiniMe** · 05-31-2007, 08:51

Originally Posted by Watchman

Incidentally, I found the elephants Pyrrhus starts with to be a rather pointless money sink.

Originally Posted by gran_guitarra

That being said, it took me about 12 turns and I was 50k in debt by the time I finished.

Pyrrhus money problem has simple solution:
1. disband 2 of your 3 vessels;
2. take Pella;
3. rase the taxes to maximum.
that's it =)

**The Errant** · 05-31-2007, 10:24

I use a different strategy for victory.

First. Disband all troops in Taras with the exception of two Phalagitai Deuteroi. Then start building stone walls in Taras and train six slingers there.

Disband all your fleets.

Attack Pella with Pyrrhos stack and bring in reinforcements from Ambrakia. Any troops already there is fine.

Take Pella. Leave a garrison and move south. Take Demetrias. Leave the Maks fighting the Koinon on the Peloponesos. They will be busy for a while.

Now move to Byzantion and take it. Then do the same to Tylis, Serdike and Dalminion. You now have four additional mining towns to Pella and Epidamnos. The money should be flowing in at this time.

Concentrate on economic upgrades and reinforce your army. When the Koinon grab the last of the Mak holdings in mainland Greece. Move your army closer to Demetrias.

Now watch the Koinon go for Thermon. When the bulk of Koinon forces are besiegeing Thermon, attack Athens. Take Athens, defeat their field armies, and take Korinthos, Sparte and Chalkis in that order.

You have now kicked out both rival greek factions from the peninsula and have a good defensive position. Not to mention a killer economy with mines and seatrade.

You can now start moving against Rome in Italy. The slingers and stone walls of Taras should have been strong enough to whitstand anything the Res Publica have thrown at you up until now.

**Elminster12** · 05-31-2007, 14:33

I dug in around Taras and beat the Maks around like a punching bag...y'know, what Pyrrhos should've done. One of these days though....I'm going to try doing what he ACTUALLY did, and so how it works out....

**LusitanianWolf** · 05-31-2007, 20:33

I've started to playing with them too...
I've abandoned Taras, disbanded the elefants

and most of my army, conquested 2 rebeld towns to north, bought some toxotai units (cheap and good enought to auxiliate my few deuteroi falangite units and started working in economy. After having an nice economy I bought an large merc army and in few turns (and lots of heroic victories) cleaned greece from maks and KH...
Restarting to work in economy again, keeping only an small veteran army I've putted my economy into an nice one (10-20k ever turn). While that making problems to romans and the last of Maks with assassins, spies, diplomacy (giving money to their enemys, refusing to trade and bribing) and naval battles.
After completed upgrating the european greece into an power house I've obliterated the last Maks in Bizancium and Asia and now I'm starting to overrun AS with my old veteran army now with elephants and some elite units, an new stack with some elites and elephants too and an little troublemaker galatian mercenarian army. Of course I'll have some problems to deal with that huge war machine that they are, but well see...
Romans and Carts are fighting hard for italy so I'll have some time without worries on it.

**blank** · 05-31-2007, 22:04

I took Pella with elephants, then disbanded them (i can get like 6-7 infantry units for their upkeep), and marched on Demetrias with most of my units (left Ptolemaios and one Illyrian regiment in Pella). Now i've taken Demetrias, but i'm not ready to go to war with KH yet (i can't get to the remaining Macedon cities any other way), so i'm sending Pyrrhus north into Thrace with some fresh hoplite reinforcements from Demetrias.

In Italy, Rome attacked Taras with 1600 soldiers vs my 700. Only about 50 stinky Romans crawled out, but i took quite heavy casualties too. Now i gotta reinforce the garrison, since i'm sure as hell not leaving Taras for no damn Romans