Forts good defensive idea?

**crpcarrot** · 05-15-2007, 10:15

yeah it does help

my main worry was about putting my invading armies in forts between turns cos i am afraid they will lose any terrain advantage. plus i want to create some choke points as well.

what i willdo is have some lightly guarded forts within a turns march of reinforcements. and re invading armies i guess it will depend on the terrain weather i use a fort or not.

**Shahed** · 05-15-2007, 10:23

if you place them correctly you won't lose terrain advantage. Zoom on the camp map and place them so the high ground is to their back, try to place them so forests are behind them as well. This gives you cover and allows you greater line of sight.

Naturally if the enemy comes from the direction of the high ground, they will then have terrain advantage.

They are not at all like cities, more like a bunch of tents with a wooden palisade. They are easy to break down, but like I said earlier you can use them so that you attract your enemy to them and just sally out from the rear, surround them while they focus on the fort. Specially if you have cavalry it's very effective.

IMO forts are not useful enough, it will be better in the expansion.

The other option you mentioned is exactly like in my screenshot, except vice versa, my main armies are foward deployed (to attack the enemy as they approach, spotted by spies) and the reserves are deployed to the rear.

**Ciaran** · 05-15-2007, 11:04

There´s another thing about forts, armies in them don´t go rebel. So if you have to move a lot of tropps headed by captains or characters with questionable loyalty, you can establish a line of forts along your marching route, moving your units from one save haven to the next. To keep the forts on the map simply place some depleted unit in them.

**Magraev** · 05-15-2007, 11:16

Forts as bases for general-less armies is an excellent idea. In RTW the presence of forts also cut down on the number of rebels popping up, so that would be an added bonus.

I don't know if that is also the case in MTW2?

**Shahed** · 05-15-2007, 11:25

Originally Posted by Magraev

Forts as bases for general-less armies is an excellent idea. In RTW the presence of forts also cut down on the number of rebels popping up, so that would be an added bonus.

I don't know if that is also the case in MTW2?

Just put one spy in it, you gain line of sight plus fort. At least this way it's worth more than the toothpicks that it is made out of.

Don't know the answer to your question, unfortunately.

**Shahed** · 05-15-2007, 11:23

I should also point out, don't use forts against the Mongols as an offensive tactic.

You can use them against the Mongols to hem them into an area before you are at war with them. For example, the valley/pass north of Mosul which leads to Yerevan, is a perfect area to hem the Mongols in.

Once you've hemmed them in and declare on them, you need to immediately get out of the forts and attack. If you stay in the fort they will attack you from multiple directions and should this occur you are S C R E W E D.

The chances are extremely high you will lose that stack, because you no longer have a means to break out. They will be all around you. This is the worst possible scenario against the Mongols.

I would also recommend against using forts as an offensive measure in areas where multiple enemy stacks (which have artillery) are operating, for the same reason. Exeptions are when you have gold chevron armies which might have a chance.

**Daveybaby** · 05-15-2007, 11:35

I seem to recall that the merchant fort exploit has been partly fixed in 1.2, in that multiple merchants in a fort sitting on a resource will split the value of the resource between them, so they will actually be making you less money than if you put them each on a different resource.

I think the exploit that protects your merchants from aquisition is still there though. Bit of a shame really. IMO forts should cost, say, 100 or 200 per turn in upkeep once theyre built, which goes some way towards balancing out this unfair advantage.

**Shahed** · 05-15-2007, 11:36

That's good so now my merchants can share the 719 FL exploit, in that example.
A single merchant can make more than that in 1.10.

I would have liked to see the concept expanded, and the AI use this as well. I've hardly ever seen the AI use a fort.
I mentioned already if someone is using this as an exploit why don't they just change other factors in the simple text files to suit them. Modify the stat file...etc. This is a lot simpler way to cheat.

Besides if anyone needs exploits to win this game, well, then they obviously have a lot more pressing issues to worry about.

**Daveybaby** · 05-15-2007, 11:55

Originally Posted by Sinan

I would have liked to see the concept expanded, and the AI use this as well. I've hardly ever seen the AI use a fort.
I mentioned already if someone is using this as an exploit why don't they just change other factors in the simple text files to suit them. Modify the stat file...etc. This is a lot simpler way to cheat.

Fair enough i suppose - i never use them myself, in any capacity, though it is still very tempting to put merchants in there to protect them - i've managed to resist... so far.

I agree that it would be good to see the AI use forts more, but if was to start using the merchant protection 'exploit' as well then merchant aquisitions would become almost impossible. Hence i think forts should be limited in some way, either by costing upkeep, or by requiring at least one (full strength) military unit to be in there at all times - strategic agents shouldnt count.

**Vladimir** · 05-15-2007, 13:42

Originally Posted by Sinan

That's good so now my merchants can share the 719 FL exploit, in that example.
A single merchant can make more than that in 1.10.

I would have liked to see the concept expanded, and the AI use this as well. I've hardly ever seen the AI use a fort.
I mentioned already if someone is using this as an exploit why don't they just change other factors in the simple text files to suit them. Modify the stat file...etc. This is a lot simpler way to cheat.

Besides if anyone needs exploits to win this game, well, then they obviously have a lot more pressing issues to worry about.

If you're not cheating you're not trying. If you get caught, you're not trying hard enough. Seriously though, in VH/VH, you're already being cheated against by EVERYONE. Try to maintain merchants in northern Italy. You'll either use forts or a whole lot of assassins.

I'm pretty sure watchtowers are cheaper than spies. I like to place one ahead of my forts for the extra visibility.

I would like to see the option for more than one kind of fort. From a simple fortified field camp to something meant to hold the pass. Forts are really great in more open terrain. I love the reinforcement system in M2. It's now possible to attack a bridge from both sides (as Venice).