Wedge formation ?

[Mithradates]

Ive always wondered if the wedge fromation symbol is bugged. On my game it always appears illuminated at the start of the battle and the horses are never in wedge formation.

[pike master]

mtw 1 gave all units a wedge ability which was ideal so you could get your infantry through a gap in the line and swing around and charge the enemy in the rear.

wedge is best for formation maneuvring but only heavy cav get the option so i assume they intended it to be an offensive shock formation

i have noticed before that a group of 4 to 5 heavy cav in wedge commanded to strike a single infantry unit will wipe it out super quick. but you could probably do that in regular formation as well.

another tactic is to drive it into the enemies line and after impact command the cav unit to move beyond. this penetrates the formation and the widening wedge scores some kills as it passes through.

[Flavius Merobaudes]

I think the last thing you described is the intended purpose. Imagine the following scenario: Knights in wedge formation smash through the enemy's lines and pull out beyond. Your infantry engages the enemy from the front while the knights charge in from the rear, this time in line formation
= victory.
The "smash-through wedge" seems to be the direct way for heavy cav to get in the enemy's rear. Horse archers and light cav are good flankers, but knights are simply too slow for that.

[Sentinel]

I can't try it at the moment, but maybe the wedge will help keep the cavalry in formation when chasing down routers.

edit: just tried chasing two units of routing highlanders with two units of mailed knight. one in wedge and one in default formation. There was no improvement with the wedge unit cohesion. The default formation did much better in the initial charge.

[Kobal2fr]

I think the last thing you described is the intended purpose. Imagine the following scenario: Knights in wedge formation smash through the enemy's lines and pull out beyond. Your infantry engages the enemy from the front while the knights charge in from the rear, this time in line formation
= victory.
The "smash-through wedge" seems to be the direct way for heavy cav to get in the enemy's rear. Horse archers and light cav are good flankers, but knights are simply too slow for that.

That's the way I thought it worked too, but like I said in the OP, the knights just stop in front of the target if told to charge in a wedge. You could always give them a move command afterwards I guess, I'll have to try that.

But thanks all for your replies !

[Flavius Merobaudes]

Good news. The wedge is pretty good for smashing through.

I pierced through DFK four rows deep with a unit of basic feudal knights (no upgrades, no exp). I made them charge in wedge formation and double-clicked beyond the enemy unit instantly on impact.

Doing this five times my losses were 3 times 2 knights and twice 0. The losses all occured on impact. While moving through, my knights killed all enemies in their way and left a nice breach to be exploited.

It seems the enemy simply could not focus on a target, that's why I had no losses.

Quand meme I would prefer a formed standard attack. It's in most cases enough to cause an instant rout.

[WhiskeyGhost]

in other words, wedge is only good if you wanna go straight through the enemy to do something like kill those annoying siege weapons or archers behind those DFK's right?

[Empirate]

Good enough for me, I must say! I'll try out wedge more. Didn't ever use it in Rome or Medieval2, since in MTW it wasn't much use except against the thinnest of lines. Charging, then immediately ordering a push-through movement... great idea!

[Doug-Thompson]

The "smash-through wedge" produced outstanding results for me as well.

I ran a 40-man unit of English Knights into a 40-man unit of French Genedarmes head-to-head in normal formation. Got mutual destruction.

Did the same thing with English Knights in a wedge, using the "smash-through" and not being particularly quick about it. Pushed on through, rode off, reversed and killed all the Genedarms and still had 30 knights left.

This needs a lot more testing, but could be a major find. Also, it might make getting a good charge easier. The knights seemed to keep formation well. (The Genedarmes got a good, lances-down charge also.)

Re: Chasing routers. Line, loose formation works best for me. Go to loose and turn off wedge when the rout begins, but you'll only be fast enough to catch infantry most times.

[Shahed]

This is good. I'm going to use this technique.

Until now the only time I used wedge was to weave through the enemy army, switch to close formation and target the unit I wanted to kill, charge ! How I wish replays worked. Using wedge for weaving is awesome to watch, and it's very effective for going through the battle line.

[Czar Alexsandr]

Well to be honest I have used wedge in battle with some of the principles that have been discused in mind before. But.. to very limited effect. And now I see the error of my ways! Lol. Ah but now I will just need to send some cavalry on a daring mission throught the enemy infantry and to thosse anoying seige engines now. The Polish catapults will burn my horses no more! Lol. But.. it would be pretty impressive to watch cavalry running through the infantry to silence the big guns wouldn't it? And with the Infantry coming to kill the enemy infantry there's hardly a doubt in my mind that it wouldn't be a beatiful battle. I'll be doing some research on this very soon.

[Shahed]

That is precisely what I used wedge for most often, to get to the enemy artillery.

[Czar Alexsandr]

So it works well than Sinan? Hmmm... I still need to try it to make sure I got it right. Well we'll see. So you send you cavalry in wedge through the enemy infantry and to the siege engines? Or do you weave through holes and hit the artillery? Lol. And to think.. I've just discovered another way to whip the AI. Lol. (Running off to test Wedge.)