Plate for spears

**WhiskeyGhost** · 05-18-2007, 04:50

Originally Posted by Mad Mac

They have the same morale, actually...

Armoured Sarges:
Cost 540/155
Attack 7/3
Defense 14 Can upgrade to Heavy Mail
Morale 5

Italian Spear Militia:
Cost 460/125
Attack 7/3
Defense 13 Can upgrade to Partial Plate
Morale 5

Although, I notice that in custom battle they only have 2 armor upgrades. this is odd, because they only start with padded, and 2 upgrades should put them at heavy mail. But they are obviously equipped with plate with both upgrades...I don't know any unit that can skip armor upgrades...strange.

ah my bad, i thought they were close to the same, but i assumed they had like 1 less morale or something due to the fact they seem to perform worse then the sarges

**pike master** · 05-18-2007, 05:32

try papal guard.they have some decent armor when they are upgraded.

and in the campaign game italian spearmen will upgrade to partial plate, just not the kind pikemen and halberdiers use.

**Xehh II** · 05-18-2007, 06:05

Originally Posted by mad cat mech

try papal guard.they have some decent armor when they are upgraded.

and in the campaign game italian spearmen will upgrade to partial plate, just not the kind pikemen and halberdiers use.

Papal Guard have heavy chain when upgraded and their armour is exactly the same as ISM which means ISM have heavy chain.

**Flavius Merobaudes** · 05-18-2007, 08:00

Actually, there are lots of units that skip upgrades, especially late ones. For example tercios:
no armour -> light chain mail -> partial plate

It's all in the Faust here:https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showthread.php?t=84650

**Furious Mental** · 05-18-2007, 08:22

In the screenshots one can see that the Teutonic Knights will get some kind of plate armoured spearmen.

I don't know if the Scots ever used to fight in plate armour with pikes. It seems unlikely to me- Scotland doesn't seem like the kind of place for it. English knights did use their lances on foot and were described in one battle account as being in a formation resembling a "hedgehog".

**Ciaran** · 05-18-2007, 11:10

Originally Posted by Flavius Merobaudes

Actually, there are lots of units that skip upgrades, especially late ones. For example tercios:
no armour -> light chain mail -> partial plate

It's all in the Faust here:https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showthread.php?t=84650

But do they require the smith building for partial plate to enable that last armour upgrade or will the one before suffice?

What´s important is the stats, not the look.

**Flavius Merobaudes** · 05-18-2007, 14:15

The level before will suffice. Fully upgraded, they have an open helmet and plate at their trunk, but no armour at their arms and legs. Stats are the same as heavy mail as far as I know, maybe +1. There's a difference between early armour like in sergants and knights, and the later renaissance armour of tercios or arqbusiers (new model army).

If the armour stats were shown correctly, we wouldn't need to guess anymore. This whole thing is getting on my nerves and they better fix it sooner than later. It's so obvious and didn't even attempt to fix it. Classical laziness.