Majority of Iraqi Lawmakers Now Reject Occupation

**Fragony** · 05-21-2007, 16:49

Originally Posted by econ21

I wonder if the Afghans really want us there either? The ways things are going there - the Don Quixote NATO tilts at the poppy fields; the resurgent Taliban now with roadside bombs and suicide bombers; the feeble enclave government unable to build a political consensus or even train an army to defend itself - it reminds me more and more of Iraq.

I am impressed by the old saying: you can't buy an Afghan's loyalty; you can only rent it. I'm wondering if the lease is up?

Poppy field destroying is a huge mistake, that's why we might need a hand. Seems to be doing fine for now but destroying people's sole recource to live is never a very good idea.

**Gawain of Orkeny** · 05-21-2007, 16:57

Like I said even if they havent asked us to leave we should ask them to vote on the matter. Then we will know where we stand. If they vote go then were outta there and leave the kennel to Lassie.

**Alexander the Pretty Good** · 05-21-2007, 17:52

So Zak, which version of America was responsible for the conquest of the Philippines? American slavery?

**Seamus Fermanagh** · 05-21-2007, 18:10

To be fair to the isolationist crowd, ATPG, they usually put the advent of US imperialism at around 1898 -- the Phillipines being their first "bad" example. The ACW was, to the isolationists, the last war we should have been involved in as it was the war by/through which the USA's one "at start" critical flaw was corrected.

Isolationists are more "mixed" in their views regarding: the undeclared naval war with France, the conflicts with (one declared, others not) the "Barbary Pirates" (read Tunisia, Libya, and to a lesser extent Morocco), the Mexican-American War, the campaigns against the amerinds (aka native americans, indians, injuns, indigenous peoples), the punitive expedition against Pancho Villa, our attempts to invade Canada during both the Revolution and the War of 1812, and the border posturing in support of the overthrow of Ferdinand of Mexico in 1865-1867.

If you want a couple of good authors on the imperialism issues, I'd suggest:

Smedley Butler

Max Boot

**Gawain of Orkeny** · 05-21-2007, 18:50

Smedley Butler

What an amazing man. A true marine. Won two medals of honor I believe. Its hard to believe he wrote some of that stuff. I mean what the hell did he know

**Seamus Fermanagh** · 05-21-2007, 19:54

Originally Posted by Gawain of Orkeny

What an amazing man. A true marine. Won two medals of honor I believe. Its hard to believe he wrote some of that stuff. I mean what the hell did he know

Yes. 2 MoH. They may have been a mite easier to acquire (and survive) then, but still an impressive accomplishment.

He had very few illusions about what he was doing, but he was also not of the opinion that everything we were doing was wrong either.

**rotorgun** · 05-21-2007, 20:34

Smedley Butler aside, didn't the Iraqis set up their constitution so that the individual factions could all have a limited autonomy of their own? I don't know, as I haven't read a translated copy of the document, but I can't help but think that the situation could be mitigated with the implementation of such a measure. It would be sort of how each state has it's own powers in the constitution of the U.S. It's that sort of comprimise that allows represenative government to work, albiet in its inefficient manner.

Does anyone know where I could find a copy of the Iraqi constitution online?