How to increase public loyalty?
what are the various ways to overcome the various bad loyalty traits (when i look at the scroll some are unrest, health, squalor, distance to capital, etc)?
For RTW, not MTW2. I bought each city a spy because that helps find other spies and quells something, right?
Last edited by Test112345; 06-01-2007 at 22:36.
Re: How to increase public loyalty?
I know next to nothing about the triggers that give family members specific traits, so I'll leave that to someone else who can hopefully explain.
One piece of advice is to build academies, and farm ancilliaries for your governors that have a public order effect.
Not all negative public order modifiers on the scrolls are character related. Many of them are related to buildings, I advice you explore the building browser.
I advice against building farming upgrades in settlements except those that have very low inherent growth rates (segesta comes to mind) and maybe those close to your capital.
The reason is that while they give you a nice income boost, they also increase population growth (and thus cause squalor) without giving a public order bonus. This can be extremely problematic when you've reached huge city level and can't counter squalor any longer by upgrading the gov. mansion.
Re: How to increase public loyalty?
Hi Test112345,
Managing public order in R:TW is very hard - high taxes, unrest, squalor, cultural penalty and distance to capital are factors which great leaders could do without. Squalor is possibly the worst:
To prevent squalor, the best option is to simply prevent growth - as a wise fellow once said - "your war is not against squalor - it's against population growth". Population growth will always occur in even the least hygienic and well fed settlements, yet it can be slowed down by avoiding health and population boosting buildings, including farms. Sadly, though, since to get the best military units you require maxed up cities, so, in certain strategically important cities, this rule will have to be broken.
Unfortunately, your only resort against squalor, once you have it, is building heath buildings and similar happiness structures, as you have said. I do believe, however, that they do not actually resolve squalor and instead simply counter-act and, over time phase their good out by piling huge amounts of population upon your settlement creating a worse squalor issue. You could also upgrade the Governor's palace, yet that can make things worse in the long run too.
The best thing I find if the problem is too out of hand is abandoning the settlement, leaving it to revolt, and then returning to exterminate the populace. It reduces the population's numbers, yet also removes income within the settlement, so, if your desperate for cash, then you may wish to avoid this evil strategy.
May I also suggest that you try rebalancing the population. Simply train many units of peasants in your largest cities and disband them in your smaller ones. This migration moves men from the large city, that could do with less people in the populace, to a smaller one that requires the population to expand to the next level to gain better troops. If you have no small cities that require this boost, send the Peasants to their deaths - stick 'em on a boat and send them into pirate/enemy infested waters. They will soon be dead, leaving you with nothing to worry about!
Unrest is caused by recent conquest of a settlement, governor's traits and enemy spies stirring up trouble!
Sadly, resolving unrest caused by the settlement changing hands in unresolvable and cannot really be changed without the help on a unrest reducing governor - sorry.
However, checking out your characters can solve unrest. Does the governor have unrest causing traits in his selection? If he does then get your calculator out and add things up! For every happiness influencing point which is positive, such as influence/subtraction from squalor, add 5% onto your totals unless a percentage is given and then instead add that on. Then subtract everything negative taking away 5% per point of anything unless a percentage is given. If the governor's rating on your calculator turns out to be below 0 (causing more problems than he is resolving) then take him out and find somebody with a better rating. You can work them out using this system, and install them as governor of this realm. As a rule, it is best to install those with the highest ratings in the more rebellious settlements (often on your borders).
Enemy spies are the chief cause of unrest, causing +5% unrest per subterfuge point. Put your own spies in the settlement to track them down and get them executed for their evils, this may take a few turns, however, so it may not be useful if you need an emergency quick-fix.
Cultural penalty is caused by buildings of a different culture being in your settlement. For example, if the Romans were to capture a Greek settlement with many Greek buildings then this factor would run rampant. It causes a -5% penalty per building that is not your culture with a 20% penalty for the governor's building. It does, however, reach it's maximum capacity at 50%.
It can be removed through upgrading the buildings in the settlement to the next level, upgrading the governor's residence, and the city, to the next level and destroying buildings not of your culture, although it's best to do a balancing act here and thing about the positive effects of the building versus a -5% happiness penalty.
Distance to capital is possible the easiest resolved of all the factors in R:TW happiness! Simply move the capital closer to the dangerous settlements and they will be much happier! However, bear in mind that other settlements may become unhappier if the capital is moved away from them. It's best to browse around for a good place to locate your capital throughout a turn, making sure that everybody is satisfied with your choice of re-location.
On a final note, you should bear in mind, as well as prevention, that the cure can be equally effective. If you ever have problems the construction of a law or an increased happiness building can never go amiss. Law is much better since it also aids your finacial situation by reducing corruption, but in couter-acting rebellion problems, either will do.
Good luck with your public order problems, cheers!
Last edited by Omanes Alexandrapolites; 07-06-2007 at 22:18.
Dawn is nature's way of telling you to go back to bed
Re: How to increase public loyalty?
Wow, thanks for the really good reply Omanes, i appreciate it.
Does that killing/moving of population trick only work if you build peasants? Also, should i just not build these farms (or only at certain times)?
For the distance to the capital, should i just centrally locate it? there are no other drawbacks to this method?
should i just start destroying and buildings that arent built by me if there's a culture penalty? will i be allowed to rebuild it afterwards?
Re: How to increase public loyalty?
Hi again Test112345,
Nope, it works with any unit from the humble Town Watch to the almighty steel first of the Urban Cohort, although Peasants are the natural choice since they are nice and cheap to train and keep paying for during their transportation.Originally Posted by Test112345
Often, a balancing act could be done - squalor vs. cash. On the settlement details scroll there will be a statistic of "Farming Base Rate". The higher this is, the more worthwhile it is to build farms in the settlement due to the higher income that they will provide - however, if you are nice and rich already, then you may not need the extra income. One also has to consider if this settlement could cope with increases in squalor - if the population is "blue" under the current circumstances (around about 75%) then it may be a bad idea - a slight change in happiness factors may result in civil revolts (below 60%). These factors also can be considered in choosing where to locate your "growth" cities for future military output.Nope, luckily, no other drawbacks. Central location is often the best method as it keeps everybody reasonably satisfied, although you may wish to move it slightly in the direction of your more disloyal cities.It depends - if the problem causing building is a happiness providing building, then it will not usually be worth removing (subtract the penalty, 5%, from the bonus and, if it's in positive figures, then it's not worth it). However, if it's a building providing nothing in the way of happiness then it may be worth destroying or upgrading for the removal of the nasty penalty. You do have to consider the effects of the building though and your current situation.You may have the ability too, but this depends upon your faction's tech-tree.
Hope this helps you, cheers!
BTW, I feel a little tired, and mildly drunk, at this moment in time, so it may be a little unclear - my sincere apologies if it is. I'll revise it in the morning to avoid confusion. Thankyou for your patience.
Last edited by Omanes Alexandrapolites; 06-02-2007 at 21:01.
Dawn is nature's way of telling you to go back to bed
Re: How to increase public loyalty?
Haha nope, perfectly clear, thanks again!
what does it mean when the little icons in the settlement details are greyed out? some are grey and some are clear.
Re: How to increase public loyalty?
I usually destroy the temples, but not immediately upon conquering it - when public order is really low. The culture penalty is AFAIK only removed the turn after you destroy a building, while you do lose the public order bonus immediately.
After I've destroyed it I build my own shrines there, the more disloyal provinces of course get shrines that give the most massive public order bonuses.
Temples and governors residences are the worst as far as culture penalties are concerned, and the latter you cannot destroy. Other buildings are much less significant.
I recall that possessing the Pyramid wonders in Egypt removes all Egyptian culture penalties across the map - something to consider.
Re: How to increase public loyalty?
The greyed out icons are effects that will occur in the future due to building constructions. The greyed out icons can be very useful in deciding which is the best building out of a set to build, especially when considering constructing trading/farming buildings which do not provide a fixed income. Simply place the building on the que, remove all other buildings from the production line, and hover your mouse over the grey icons. You then can gain the ability to foresee the effects of the building in question. Hope this helps, cheers!
Last edited by Omanes Alexandrapolites; 06-03-2007 at 07:29.
Dawn is nature's way of telling you to go back to bed
Re: How to increase public loyalty?
its seems the egyptians are notoriously bad for revolting...so every time i conquer an egyptian city i slaughter them, lol.
Re: How to increase public loyalty?
That's because you have the usual cultural penalties combined with high squalor levels, as the Egyptian starting cities have insanely high growth rates.
I recall that possessing the Pyramid wonders in Egypt removes all Egyptian culture penalties across the map - something to consider.
Re: How to increase public loyalty?
Well i just got that way after i got all the other cities because when i starting conquering the Brutii already had the pyramid.
how can i remedy corruption?
oh, what would happen if the the Senate (i forgot the name of the office that does it) actually checks your accounting for correctness (they threatened to do that to me lol)?
thanks
Last edited by Test112345; 06-04-2007 at 00:00.
Re: How to increase public loyalty?
Buildings which boost law, are your resolution to corruption! They may never completely destroy this horrible R:TW statistic, but they still can drastically reduce it under most circumstances. Also moving the capital closer to your corrupt settlements can also reduce the statistic, but may, if not centralised, inspire others to become corrupt further away.It's just a simply fine of either 5,000 or 10,000 denarii. According to the text files it can't go any higher than that. However, the text files aren't always perfectly accurate sources, so, unfortunately, I may be wrong.
However, since the not-so-wise senate is now challenging your supremacy in this way, it may be a good idea to fortify your borders against the other Romans, should the senate demand your faction leader commits suicide and you wish to tell them no (resulting in exile and civil war - the other Romans always support the senate).
Hope this helps you, cheers!
Last edited by Omanes Alexandrapolites; 06-04-2007 at 16:25.
Dawn is nature's way of telling you to go back to bed
Re: How to increase public loyalty?
Oh i didnt know they would ask me to have my leader commit suicide, havent seen that one.
they fined be ~85000 denarii lol.
Once i got my army close to rome all the other roman factions seemed like they were getting ready for war everywhere.
Re: How to increase public loyalty?
The Advice i would have given has already been said. (wah...)
TosaInu shall never be forgotten.
Re: How to increase public loyalty?
If you're in the eastern half of the 'known world', it's well worth going after those Wonders. The Pyramids have already been mentioned, but there are plenty more concentrated around Greece and Asia Minor.
Omanes' detailed advice is obviously very useful. Another strategy which I don't think was mentioned (sorry if it was) is planning to recruit most frequently from the most growth-prone cities. This to a certain extent avoids the problem of having to balance farm building and happiness. If you are recruitng the larger ships or units of infantry from a city almost every turn, then the population will probably remain steady or even decline, allowing you more control.
If your cities are already past this stage, this may not be so much use.
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