How useful do you find spears after 1.02?

[Caliburn]

Since installing the new patch, I've only played HA-strong nations (Turks and Russians) and didn't bother with getting spears, instead going straight for Jannissaries and using the Russian Dismounted Dvor/axe line later in the game. Now I'm starting a Venetian campaign.

Earlier it seemed that buying DFKs was the thing to do, as any spears (I mean those without the spearwall) were crushed by cavalry charges anyway, and you'd often encounter dismounted knight armies from castle factions anyway, and those would eat through the shield-bugged spearwall like no tomorrow.

What do you think, are non-spearwall spears rubbish or useful these days?

[Monsieur Alphonse]

They are very usefull to counter cavalry charges. Even English levy spears can hold a cavalry charge when they have some armor upgrades. Once the English can get longbows two units of spears are good for defending the flanks. I am now playing as Venice which has Italian spear militia. ISM can hold their line even against generals.

[Caliburn]

Yeah, M2 has taught me a very aggressive game á la Horse Archer armies, need to cool it down a bit and let infantry do what they can and keep cavalry as reserves and flankers. After all, a spear line has staying power against swords these days as well, and coupled with good missile troops can take care of most forces. The Italian crossbow militia units are great, they can even flank effectively if need be.

[pike master]

just make sure they are immobile so they can brace with guard mode on. they will stop a cav charge enough to make it a waste of time for any sensible opponent.

[Didz]

I find spearmen useful as blockers for most melee units in seiges, as long as you can keep their flanks secure. They also form the mainstay of my battle-line in open battlefields, but again need cavalry support to cover their flanks.

[sirnoob]

they will stop a cav charge enough to make it a waste of time for any sensible opponent.

rules out the ai then

[rvg]

Since installing the new patch, I've only played HA-strong nations (Turks and Russians) and didn't bother with getting spears, instead going straight for Jannissaries and using the Russian Dismounted Dvor/axe line later in the game. Now I'm starting a Venetian campaign.

Earlier it seemed that buying DFKs was the thing to do, as any spears (I mean those without the spearwall) were crushed by cavalry charges anyway, and you'd often encounter dismounted knight armies from castle factions anyway, and those would eat through the shield-bugged spearwall like no tomorrow.

What do you think, are non-spearwall spears rubbish or useful these days?

As of 1.2 spears are awesome. They eat cavalry for lunch and they are tough enough to stall DFKs or other swordsmen while your cavalry performs a flanking maneuver. Spears also do an excellent job as gate defenders in sieges.

[magnum]

As others have said, Spears in 1.2 are great. Excellent for holding my line while I use other faster troops (sword/axe/cav) to flank, they are also great at gate defense for city or castle. Excellent defensive units in my opinion. Of course there is a wide range of quality among spear units, but most factions have a at least 1 excellent one.

[Eng]

Very useful the problem is the lack of morale....

[Von Nanega]

Spears always have a place in my line. They hold well at the MLR (Main Line of Resistance). I have gone back to the English for my currant game. I always put them at the end of the MLR for flanking defense for cavalry.

[Caliburn]

The Italians with their Carroccio Standards have fewer problems with morale anyway, as long as you feel like lugging them along for a battle.

Putting the standards to the flanks of your formation seems like an interesting idea, as they'll boost the nearby units' morale and are pretty tough, so they can keep enemy flankers at bay and flank themselves if need be. Also, charges won't work well against them as the standard is in front of their formation, and they are spearmen.

Might try that as very early on Venice has very limited cavalry and only a few crossbows (before buiding enough barracks), so stacks tend to have more than enough spears anyway.

[andrewt]

I'm too aggressive as well and rarely use spears. I used them when I played Venice first because their militia spears are awesome but stopped in the late game. My last 3 campaigns (Rus, Turks and Moors), I've barely used any spears. The Turks and Moors I played after 1.2. My late game Moor army in my current campaign is a mixture of Christian Guard, dismounted Christian Guard and Camel Gunners.